Building a Better Profile

[Czornyj]

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/building_a_better_profile___its_all_in_the_recipe.shtml
Yeah, great. But I keep asking myself what does it have to do with "Tutorial"

[Rhossydd]

Just a stealth advert really.

[wildstork]

Well said, Paul and Czornyj!  
So media Settings determine the ink output.  And the wrong media setting, regardless of the spectrophotometer used to build the profile, will produce a less than satisfactory print.  So we're wasting our money on profile building hard and software?  Hmmm...  
Forget about building your own profiles and buy a RIP from Colorbyte for $$$ more and hope that your third party media is covered… or you're scre_ed bananas!  
Instead, if this were a tutorial instead of a sales pitch for Colorbyte, we would have been advised to try building different profiles with different media settings to find the ideal media setting (and that is only if the paper manufacturer doesn't recommend a specific media setting.)  We could also restrict ink output through the print driver if there was too much ink on paper.  Cheap alternative… you think?  
Thanks but no thanks.  I'll use my Datacolor Studio 4, recently purchased, that offers me the ability to alter my profiles and retain full control of my profile building with some very rare and unusual third party papers.  I considered XRite… but they wanted more to repair my Pulse Spectro than I paid new for entire package that came with it.

You've gotta love it when there's little to no competition (thanks to XRite buying up the competition).

[Ernst Dinkla]

My best guess is that the article has something to do with the appearance of PrinTao 8. Maybe the next article on LuLa will be a review of that LaserSoft program. Mac based right now so in another league than Qimage was all the time.

--
Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst

http://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm
July 2013, 500+ inkjet media white spectral plots.

[alain]

Hi

Maybe next a review for Qimage itself? 
It's for me the way to print.

Alain   

[Czornyj]

My best guess is that the article has something to do with the appearance of PrinTao 8. Maybe the next article on LuLa will be a review of that LaserSoft program. Mac based right now so in another league than Qimage was all the time.

Yet another nesting software for clogzillas? I'm not holding my breath, either

[photoartman]

Very surprised that this article is basically an ad for colorbyte. I am new to the forum - does this happen very often? Is anyone acting as an editor to weed out this kind of not so subtle advertising? I will be watching for this in future articles.

[laughingbear]

I am not convinced that threethousand greenbacks are justified to be put in colorbytes account for use with my 11880. Seriously not, and I am not willing to allocate my time to test this. Just my opinion of course, but there are other and also very good solutions and PrinTao stops at 44 inch btw.

3K! Utterly ridiculous.

[Neil_Brander]

You know, when I first read the article my first thought was that "this is just an advertisement".  And I was going to post, but thought I might being too negative.  Many articles are by people wanting to sell you something -a workshop, a paid site, etc.  But, they are giving you something, a good tutorial, and then letting you know what else they do.  In this case I received nothing but a hard sell.  Even if the author suggested other competitive products after pushing his own I would have felt better about the piece. 

[BarbaraArmstrong]

I feel duped into spending my time reading this article.  The title, and lead-in blurb are extremely misleading.  It is not about building a better profile, but rather about giving up on building a profile.  The lead-in, "building ... high quality profiles for papers can be a challenging hit or miss situation.." creates the clear perception that the piece will be about improving the quality of paper profiles.  This was certainly not the case.  I further think that when the suggestions in a written piece are really directed only at Epson users, then that should be made clear up front.  And, I would further suggest, the statement that "it's vital that the ink recipe you choose is always the same one that was used to print the target it was made from" is not what was meant; rather it should be: it's vital that the ink recipe you choose is always the same one that was used to make the profile you have selected, OR: ...to print the target THE PROFILE was made from.  The "it" in Pannozzo's statement can only refer back to the ink recipe, which isn't what is meant.  The whole piece was frustrating. --Barbara

[Rob C]

I feel duped into spending my time reading this article.  The title, and lead-in blurb are extremely misleading.  It is not about building a better profile, but rather about giving up on building a profile.  The lead-in, "building ... high quality profiles for papers can be a challenging hit or miss situation.." creates the clear perception that the piece will be about improving the quality of paper profiles.  This was certainly not the case.  I further think that when the suggestions in a written piece are really directed only at Epson users, then that should be made clear up front.  And, I would further suggest, the statement that "it's vital that the ink recipe you choose is always the same one that was used to print the target it was made from" is not what was meant; rather it should be: it's vital that the ink recipe you choose is always the same one that was used to make the profile you have selected, OR: ...to print the target THE PROFILE was made from.  The "it" in Pannozzo's statement can only refer back to the ink recipe, which isn't what is meant.  The whole piece was frustrating. --Barbara

Barbara, unless you have bought into Window 8 you have no conception of what frustration means!

;-)

Rob C

[Rhossydd]

What I found particularly insidious about the article/advert was the introduction of a new term that isn't normally used in discussions on Colour management: "Ink recipe".
Trying to create a new term seems to me to just be a way of creating FUD (fear uncertainty and doubt), rather than just using the well known and used description of 'media setting'. The last thing colour management needs anyone associated with the industry making it more complicated than it needs to be.
'Ink recipe' would be more intuitively used to describe the actual constituents of the ink itself eg pigment, dye, solvent, sublimation etc.

Media settings are important and help lift an acceptable profile to a good one.
Ten years ago finding the correct media settings for non-OEM papers did require a degree of trial and experimentation, but there were, and still are, plenty of helpful articles out on the web about the subject along with freely downloadable test images that helped the assessment of the results. Now in 2013 most of the good paper manufacturers offer credible recommendations for media setting that work well for most commonly used printers.
My experience suggests that just staying with the manufacturers recommendations will result in a very good profile without any particular fuss now.

Very surprised that this article is basically an ad for colorbyte. I am new to the forum - does this happen very often?

It's an increasingly common trend here and was commented on at length at http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=84795.0 until the thread was locked.
Lula is evolving from an enthusiast 'fine art' site to one with more commercial intent.

you have no conception of what frustration means!

We all know about frustration, here it's about you hijacking another thread and moaning about things you can't be bothered to learn. :-(

[Rob C]

Rob, there's so much help out there.

https://www.google.co.uk/#q=making+windows+8+look+like+xp

Apologies for taking this thread off topic.

Even better: Christoph came around the other day and managed to fix me with a good, working E-mail setup once more and also considerable help with the PS system. ;-)

All in all, only a very few glitches remain: I've recounted the CanoScan problem elsewhere, in Coffee and an initial rejection of my HP B9180 printer software CD was fixed late last night when I delved rather deeply into the Internet and HP Problem solver sites. Didn't even need my CD in the end - the installation came down through the wires...

Rob C

[Rob C]

What I found particularly insidious about the article/advert was the introduction of a new term that isn't normally used in discussions on Colour management: "Ink recipe".
Trying to create a new term seems to me to just be a way of creating FUD (fear uncertainty and doubt), rather than just using the well known and used description of 'media setting'. The last thing colour management needs anyone associated with the industry making it more complicated than it needs to be.
'Ink recipe' would be more intuitively used to describe the actual constituents of the ink itself eg pigment, dye, solvent, sublimation etc.

Media settings are important and help lift an acceptable profile to a good one.
Ten years ago finding the correct media settings for non-OEM papers did require a degree of trial and experimentation, but there were, and still are, plenty of helpful articles out on the web about the subject along with freely downloadable test images that helped the assessment of the results. Now in 2013 most of the good paper manufacturers offer credible recommendations for media setting that work well for most commonly used printers.
My experience suggests that just staying with the manufacturers recommendations will result in a very good profile without any particular fuss now.
It's an increasingly common trend here and was commented on at length at http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=84795.0 until the thread was locked.
Lula is evolving from an enthusiast 'fine art' site to one with more commercial intent.
We all know about frustration, here it's about you hijacking another thread and moaning about things you can't be bothered to learn. :-(

Oh my, so sorry! But a new year and new, spiritual resolutions beckon; what are yours?

You'll just have to start your own international photographic chat site, and then you can lock and unlock at will!

;-)

Rob C

[Neil_Brander]

Given the negativity of the comments about this article I'm surprised that Michael or Kevin have not responded?  I'd be interested in understanding their take on this article and why they felt it was worth publishing.

[Kevin Raber]

Interesting, first considering the number of times this article has been read there is not that much so called negative comments.  Readers have been asking for more technical information type of articles.  Sometimes the best place to go for that kind of information is the manufacturers and those that work with these technologies on an everyday basis.  If you have ever used a RIP and especially ImagePrint you'll know that these guys know what they are talking about and as I mentioned in the What's New section, they make a great product resulting in super nice prints.  We have reviewed ImagePrint on this site in the past and many readers swear by the software. The article introduces the reader to another level of understanding regarding what it takes to make a good print.  It helps you the reader understand that there is more than just a profile to be concerned with in making good prints.  Yeah, maybe John got a plug in for his company and that is OK.  John has contributed to this site on numerous occasions and so have other manufacturers or dealer representatives.  This site is about delivering good information for the readers and none of our contributors are paid for their article contributions.  If you don't like the aspect of the so called commercialism then read around it or don't click through to their sites.  The same can be said about other contributors such as photographers.  The bottom line is we felt it was a good article, it exposed another layer of understanding the printing process and also helped the reader know what to look for when printing or looking at a printing solution. Maybe my one mistake was listing it as a tutorial and not an article.

Kevin Raber

[Neil_Brander]

Kevin,

Thank you for your response.  It helps me put the article in perspective.  FYI,  I did use image print until I bought the 4900, at which time I felt my results were just fine without it.  Regardless, I think it is a great product for those that need it.


And, as I said, I don't have any problem with contributors promoting themselves or their products.  I just thought this was too blatant.  Just one man's opinion.

Great site!

[Rhossydd]

Interesting, first considering the number of times this article has been read there is not that much so called negative comments.

Most people will just ignore poor content, can't be bothered to complain or are too scared to.

Readers have been asking for more technical information type of articles.

 
Well this one doesn't fit that bill.
The title suggests it might be about profile building, but it isn't at all.
A brief summary could be;
"Getting the right amount of ink on the paper is crucial for best performance, but it's really difficult so forget trying to do it yourself and buy our product instead."

It's just another example of Lula dumbing down :-(

[Czornyj]

Maybe my one mistake was listing it as a tutorial and not an article.

It's all I wanted to point out - it's not a tutorial and it's not about profile creation. And I've got nothing against the aspect of so called of commercialism.

[Richowens]

Most people will just ignore poor content, can't be bothered to complain or are too scared to. 
Well this one doesn't fit that bill.
The title suggests it might be about profile building, but it isn't at all.
A brief summary could be;
"Getting the right amount of ink on the paper is crucial for best performance, but it's really difficult so forget trying to do it yourself and buy our product instead."

It's just another example of Lula dumbing down :-(

  There is nothing to complain about. Take the article at face value and if it isn't your cup of tea............that's the way it is.

  As far as Lula "dumbing down"..........that is simply your own arrogant opinion. Instead of being a so pissy try writing an article displaying your vast intelligence.

 I would contribute, but I'm just a happy snapper using yesterdays technology, and articles such as this one help my understanding of the art or craft.......whatever you want to call it.

Just my humble opinion,

Rich