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Author Topic: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode  (Read 20630 times)

Doug Peterson

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2013, 02:38:59 pm »

With all due respect, in low light, the back may give great files but if it's a Phamiya I'd be surprised if it focuses as well as your average D4 or 1Dx.

You'll get no objection from me here.

All medium format I've tried (which is literally ever option) struggles to focus in low light compared to a D4 or 1Dx. Those two bodies can focus on a dark car in the middle of the night - kinda scary actually.

At any given wedding I shoot, when the light goes down far enough, a Canon or Nikon comes out.

The only question is for any given back+body combo how long into the evening that is. With the DF+ I find the body and back give out about the same time for hand held shooting. If I'm on a tripod the body AF will give out before the back, but it's also easier to do MF on a tripod so it's a little less of an issue.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 02:43:16 pm by Doug Peterson »
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Steve Hendrix

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2013, 03:01:55 pm »

Doug,

With all due respect, in low light, the back may give great files but if it's a Phamiya I'd be surprised if it focuses as well as your average D4 or 1Dx.

Edmund

I wouldn't be surprised at all.

I do believe Sensor Plus has other advantages also - for some landscape shooters, wind creates an issue for slower shutter speeds, so Sensor Plus is a tool to have in the back pocket for those conditions.

I also believe Sensor Plus was a very important development in terms of allowing a company to be able to continually increase megapixel counts, while creating an option for lower megapixel count captures with the same product. If medium format extends megapixel counts into the hundred megapixel and higher mark (as expected), then being able to only offer the full rez file, let's say, 125 megapixels for everything you shoot is a restriction. I anticipate seeing Leaf or Hasselblad also develop reduced file capture technology - the nice thing about where Phase One has gone is that the technology has an additional benefit (the 2 stop noise decrease).

But Edward, that's a good point about lower light - the file doesn't just have to be able to handle the noise, the camera also has to be able to focus.


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eronald

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2013, 03:35:07 pm »

 Doug, Steve,

 Are you taking preorders for the new Phase One body?   ;D
 
Edmund


But Edward, that's a good point about lower light - the file doesn't just have to be able to handle the noise, the camera also has to be able to focus.


Steve Hendrix
Capture Integration
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 03:45:26 pm by eronald »
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2013, 03:52:34 pm »

Hi Steve,

I would suggest that you over-exaggerate the benefits of sensor+ . The theoretical advantage in DR is 1 EV over simple downsize. Regarding noise there should be no advantage at all. The DxO figures illustrate it well, in the figures below the stretched part is sensor plus. So you are throwing away 75% of the resolution for a one stop advantage in DR and no advantage in noise.

But, that is only sampling theory and measurement data from DxO.


update: I have read a few good postings in favour of your statement.

Best regards
Erik

I wouldn't be surprised at all.

I do believe Sensor Plus has other advantages also - for some landscape shooters, wind creates an issue for slower shutter speeds, so Sensor Plus is a tool to have in the back pocket for those conditions.

I also believe Sensor Plus was a very important development in terms of allowing a company to be able to continually increase megapixel counts, while creating an option for lower megapixel count captures with the same product. If medium format extends megapixel counts into the hundred megapixel and higher mark (as expected), then being able to only offer the full rez file, let's say, 125 megapixels for everything you shoot is a restriction. I anticipate seeing Leaf or Hasselblad also develop reduced file capture technology - the nice thing about where Phase One has gone is that the technology has an additional benefit (the 2 stop noise decrease).

But Edward, that's a good point about lower light - the file doesn't just have to be able to handle the noise, the camera also has to be able to focus.


Steve Hendrix
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« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 11:24:46 pm by ErikKaffehr »
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eronald

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2013, 03:59:33 pm »

Erik,

 Maybe they also gain in pattern noise, or use a trick to limit banding ?
 My experience with Phase is that at high ISO pattern noise eg. banding and sensor non-uniformities kill you well before "statistical" noise becomes an issue. You can downsample a 40MP image get rid of noise, but it's hard to run away from high-iso banding without special-purpose tricks such as histogram matching per column. At least there was no way the last time I tried, I've now sold my back - which to be fair to Phase worked superbly up to something like ISO 200 and decently to 400.

Edmund

Hi Steve,

I would suggest that you over-exaggerate the benefits of sensor+ . The theoretical advantage in DR is 1 EV over simple downsize. Regarding noise there should be no advantage at all. The DxO figures illustrate it well, in the figures below the stretched part is sensor plus. So you are throwing away 75% of the resolution for a one stop advantage in DR and no advantage in noise.

But, that is only sampling theory and measurement data from DxO.

Best regards
Erik

« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 04:03:24 pm by eronald »
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2013, 04:11:47 pm »

Edmund,

That is a good point. The DxO figures don't show the quality of the noise.

I have a P45+, that back has not Sensor+ so I cannot check. Also I only shoot ISO 50, but I often expose low to protect highlights, so I feel that noise lurks around in the shadows.

Best regards
Erik

Erik,

 Maybe they also gain in pattern noise, or use a trick to limit banding ?
 My experience with Phase is that at high ISO pattern noise eg. banding and sensor non-uniformities kill you well before "statistical" noise becomes an issue. You can downsample a 40MP image get rid of noise, but it's hard to run away from high-iso banding without special-purpose tricks such as histogram matching per column. At least there was no way the last time I tried, I've now sold my back - which to be fair to Phase worked superbly up to something like ISO 200 and decently to 400.

Edmund

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Doug Peterson

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2013, 04:37:30 pm »

*Shrugs*

All I know for sure is I've been very happy with ISO800-1600 while shooting weddings with an iq260.

I'm even ok with iso3200 provided I convert to b+w, add some contrast, and add some grain.

I cannot acomplish that same versatility by under exposing and downsizing at full res.

Once I'm finding iso3200 is needed consistently then the phase goes back in the bag and the canon (or Nikon) comes out.

eronald

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2013, 04:37:58 pm »

Edmund,

That is a good point. The DxO figures don't show the quality of the noise.

I have a P45+, that back has not Sensor+ so I cannot check. Also I only shoot ISO 50, but I often expose low to protect highlights, so I feel that noise lurks around in the shadows.

Best regards
Erik


With Sensor+ they have 4x less data to read, so they can run the bucket brigade much slower, and I believe will have substantially lowered pattern noise aka banding generated by the readout circuitry. Some dSLRs (ask Iliah) have slower readout ability and a high precision mode. I have always wondered why Phase does not offer the same, after all landscape shooters do not care about fps.

Edmund
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 04:39:39 pm by eronald »
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bcooter

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2013, 04:55:26 pm »

Doug,

You really would rather spend a day with a Mamiya 645 than a Leica?  OK,  I guess you'd rather have a date with the Duck Dynasty wives than a double with Kate Moss and Kate Upton? (at least you wouldn't have to worry about getting their names mixed up).

I'd never pay 25 something thousand for a 645 Mamiya  if it had three Rolex glued to the back of it.  I know phase has improved it and I know that Leaf in that test was defective, but my two Aptus 22 did the same thing, even worse because they would centerfold and overheat.  The aptus 33 I owned for a day had grey balances so off I packed it up 12 hours after I received it and believe it or not I really really really like the people at Leaf and before you start the defense of leaf and dalsa, I remember the quotes in the phase one kodak sensor only era.

And btw:  Leaf was fixing al their issues and I wish Leaf could have stayed on their own because they really were a photographers camera company, and they had a roster of the world's best to prove it.

I think if they hadn't been bought and sold so many times they would have really produced some more inventive equipment than they are allowed to produce now.

Also I'm pretty much done with C-1.  I have many multiple licenses and this upgrade your software - buy a computer, buy a camera - upgrade your software - buy a computer routine is as close to a bait and switch scheme as life can get and phase isn't alone with this as everyone does it, they just signed on.

At least the Leica use a dng format that of course won't run on C-1 but at this stage I consider that a plus.

C-1 use to be bullet proof and low power but now it's heavy and needs new graphics cards.  I have those open cl computers but they're used for editing and a two generation old computer should run still software quickly.  I mean still images aren't that big.

Older C-1 I think 5 or something is fine, runs my Contax and I'm not going any further with C-1. Plus C-1 really needs single channel corrections like Iridient or single color settings like lightroom.  

Anyway we're talking cameras and look at the files from the Leica, forget about the other cameras just look at the leica files.  

Oh and by the way on 1600 sync speed?   Really?   You need to try some different strobes.  This was shot at 90th of a second with monoblocks and this guy was rocking so fast any shutter speed is not going to add the sharpness of quick flash duration.



All a fast shutter speed does is cut into the flash like it was a continuous source and you loose a lot of light and the file gets kind of muddy looking.  BTW:  Nudes need fast duration?  Jeez what are you doing with these naked people, and out of curiosity are the naked people photographed during your wedding sessions, because that would be a hell of a marketing trick.


Edmund,  (I always get your name mixed up.  Would you change it to Bedumandandronald?)

I over think s__t.

In order of cameras.  Love the Contax, love the olympus em-5, love the RED ones, love using the gh3 (don't love the camera but love the digital video from it).  

Loathe the 1dx orange d3/d4 look, don't like Nikon g glass, it's too clinical.   I want to change still cameras because this is how we now work.



We shoot motion, usually with dialog, or foley sound, either inside or outside.  The stills are important but lately they're starting to  become more a grab and shoot than something defined.  With a larger camera I shoot different.  

Other people will argue, but T left something off.  

If you point a Leica, I promise you your brain works different.  If it feels important in your hand it will look important in the viewfinder (you can quote me on that).  I have about 15 minutes (at most) to relight, make the subject into a pretty still and then back to the next setup.  I don't need a billion iso, just 800 and with the fast contax glass I can get there with a kino or a 500 to 800 watt hmi, or if I look  a window light and a cutter will do it.

If I was smart (no chance of that), I'd just buy two 1ds3's and never mess with it again, but  what I want, really want is a new contax.

They don't make it, never will, so the S2 is like a modern version of a contax given it uses the lenses and focus them faster.

What got me started thinking about the Leica (which btw: has one stop more a than pee30 and has better color) is that I looked at those little A7 things.  They're actually ok, except the viewfinder looks like a Sony over saturated video cam, actually when I was at the Sony store, they looked exactly like those over saturated TV's that they have stuck on every wall.  (btw; don't diss all evf because the OMD em-1 and 5 look like film in the viewfinder), but the thing about the Sony's are even though I own two A mount zeiss zooms, to buy primes, two bodies, adapters, blah blah blah I'm at 9 to 10 grand and it hit me . . .  I'm at the price of an S2 and I'll keep an S2 way way way longer than I'll keep a mobile phone with a viewfinder.

And Sony has to sell you proprietary media AND a usb cable.  That is so Sony.   You can steal my car, but don't expect me to pay to wash it.

But bottom line, find me a medium format anything that has good autofocus, will accept zeiss glass and sell for under ten thousand.  

Your on the clock.

IMO

BC

P.S.   Take all of this with a grain of salt, because I can change my mind tomorrow.

P.S. 2.   If you want to see a pretty still file look at a panasonic gh3.  It's not that detailed (in stills) it doesn't do anything past 800 iso without getting painterly, but it's one thick pretty file.

If only Panasonic would tap onto leicas industrial design and make a camera that didn't look like somebody shrunk a 5d2, or if they would just marry olympus

they'd be a lot easier to take, but for video and some stills the gh3 is the deal of the century.





« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 05:37:23 pm by bcooter »
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ToddP

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #49 on: December 12, 2013, 05:13:48 pm »

Quote
Todd,

I find it interesting that you what to go from Nikon to DMF so you can shoot more commercial.
Quote
I’ve been an adverting photographer for 28 years and have used Sinar, Mamiya RZ, Mamiya 645AFD, Horseman, Noblex, Rollie and Nikon.

Now all I use is a Nikon D800E and Nikon D800 for all the different type of work I do. Go to my website and you will see the sort of stuff I do.

Now this is my opinion don’t was your money on DMF period. Wait cause next year Nikon will bring out the Nikon D4X which I think will have some improvement over the Nikon D800’s for a fraction of the cost of you wasting your money on DMF.

Those CCD sensors are just awful.

Simon, I guess it's just a natural progression of wanting to use/learn a different format.  I'll be entering the market with used gear, thus avoiding a huge loss financially.  Plus the high sync speeds could be damn fun and worthwhile.  

Cheers!


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ErikKaffehr

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #50 on: December 12, 2013, 05:18:00 pm »

Hi BC,

Thanks for putting some things in perspective. Just a few comments.

I own Sony and go with Sony mostly because of the lenses. Not because I love them but because I have a lot. I feel the Sony lenses are a bit expensive. The lens program should be a prime consideration when buying into a system.

A small system has it's attraction. Personally, I shoot everything from 12 mm ultrawide to 800m. A 70-400/4-5.6 (or so) telezoom will never be light. With 4/3 a xxx-200 mm zoom would make the same service.

Video from the Sonys could be better. Panasonic video looks nice (the samples I have seen). I guess that the problem with Sony is that they use line skipping and need to do a lot of artificial softening to reduce moiré. Perhaps Panasonic reads out full image and down samples in real time? Sony RX10 is supposed to that and offer superior video quality.

Regarding the Leica vs. Leaf test the Leaf was obviously broken. But Leaf should not have sent him a bad sample to begin with. Now I know that s__t happens time to time, but I guess the author was sort of p____d off. Reviewers need to live with bad samples but those testing at opportunity seldom get another chance.

Best regards
Erik
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #51 on: December 12, 2013, 06:00:10 pm »

Hi,

Yes, of course, but it does not show up in the DxO data. But I respect Doug's judgement on this. I would also say that Steve Hendrix used to have solid info.

Would be nice to see raw files to compare.

Best regards
Erik

With Sensor+ they have 4x less data to read, so they can run the bucket brigade much slower, and I believe will have substantially lowered pattern noise aka banding generated by the readout circuitry. Some dSLRs (ask Iliah) have slower readout ability and a high precision mode. I have always wondered why Phase does not offer the same, after all landscape shooters do not care about fps.

Edmund

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eronald

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #52 on: December 12, 2013, 06:32:29 pm »

B. Cooter Esq,

 C1 can be flipped into a "free" mode that only does DB files.

The only "real" MF camera currently in production that seems to work right seems to be the Hassy, but it can only do AF with those Fuji lenses most of which seem to offer the subject about as much gentleness as Torquemada.

 Concerning the S2, I'm a bit wary that it might expect a 35 hour workweek, and retirement at 50 like a french train driver.

 The 1Ds3 feels right, and works well. At highish ISO makes really nice files with DPP or the Irident thingie and the "good glass". It kind of cooperates with the lenses in dim light in a way my 5D2 didn't; it's a "real" camera with a personality like the first 1Ds. I was surprised after I got my salvage dog. You might get a used body from a friend for less than your daily catering bill, and with the fast glass the viewfinder probably beats the Contax P30 tunnel by a wide margin  ;D.

 For all I know, the Sony is wonderful, or the next Nikon (I doubt that); or the next Phase body which we all keep hoping for will be a cure for cancer. But I see a preloved H4D40 in my future as my outdoor camera in a year or so.

Edmund

PS. I know you're a really smart guy, I can't imagine that the 1Dx you use is so bad that you cannot get it to make decent stills for you by candlelight, or that you really need that extra bit of rez which the 1Ds3 gives ...



 



Edmund,  (I always get your name mixed up.  Would you change it to Bedumandandronald?)

I over think s__t.

In order of cameras.  Love the Contax, love the olympus em-5, love the RED ones, love using the gh3 (don't love the camera but love the digital video from it).  

Loathe the 1dx orange d3/d4 look, don't like Nikon g glass, it's too clinical.   I want to change still cameras because this is how we now work.

We shoot motion, usually with dialog, or foley sound, either inside or outside.  The stills are important but lately they're starting to  become more a grab and shoot than something defined.  With a larger camera I shoot different.  

Other people will argue, but T left something off.  

If you point a Leica, I promise you your brain works different.  If it feels important in your hand it will look important in the viewfinder (you can quote me on that).  I have about 15 minutes (at most) to relight, make the subject into a pretty still and then back to the next setup.  I don't need a billion iso, just 800 and with the fast contax glass I can get there with a kino or a 500 to 800 watt hmi, or if I look  a window light and a cutter will do it.

If I was smart (no chance of that), I'd just buy two 1ds3's and never mess with it again, but  what I want, really want is a new contax.

They don't make it, never will, so the S2 is like a modern version of a contax given it uses the lenses and focus them faster.

What got me started thinking about the Leica (which btw: has one stop more a than pee30 and has better color) is that I looked at those little A7 things.  They're actually ok, except the viewfinder looks like a Sony over saturated video cam, actually when I was at the Sony store, they looked exactly like those over saturated TV's that they have stuck on every wall.  (btw; don't diss all evf because the OMD em-1 and 5 look like film in the viewfinder), but the thing about the Sony's are even though I own two A mount zeiss zooms, to buy primes, two bodies, adapters, blah blah blah I'm at 9 to 10 grand and it hit me . . .  I'm at the price of an S2 and I'll keep an S2 way way way longer than I'll keep a mobile phone with a viewfinder.

And Sony has to sell you proprietary media AND a usb cable.  That is so Sony.   You can steal my car, but don't expect me to pay to wash it.

But bottom line, find me a medium format anything that has good autofocus, will accept zeiss glass and sell for under ten thousand.  

Your on the clock.

IMO

BC

P.S.   Take all of this with a grain of salt, because I can change my mind tomorrow.

P.S. 2.   If you want to see a pretty still file look at a panasonic gh3.  It's not that detailed (in stills) it doesn't do anything past 800 iso without getting painterly, but it's one thick pretty file.






« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 08:04:40 pm by eronald »
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bcooter

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #53 on: December 12, 2013, 07:23:04 pm »


I’ve been an adverting photographer for 28 years and have used Sinar, Mamiya RZ, Mamiya 645AFD, Horseman, Noblex, Rollie and Nikon.

Now all I use is a Nikon D800E and Nikon D800 for all the different type of work I do. Go to my website and you will see the sort of stuff I do.

Now this is my opinion don’t was your money on DMF period. Wait cause next year Nikon will bring out the Nikon D4X which I think will have some improvement over the Nikon D800’s for a fraction of the cost of you wasting your money on DMF.

Those CCD sensors are just awful.

Cheers

Simon


You know Simon, we usually shoot different stuff and I give you a hard time but your right.

Nothing comes close to a Nikon in the blacks and honestly for the price the D800 is amazing in the fact it is a full featured pro camera.

BC
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fredjeang2

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #54 on: December 12, 2013, 07:45:31 pm »

The conclusion that I draw of all this is that:

in the holy Word of digital imagery

we never had so much choice and many options

in wich

none is satisfying anyone



or to say it differently: the big lucrative business
consists in inundating the market
with very short-life new tech (carefuly planned not to be
too good at once) gear of all sort
beta tested by the consumers by the way,
but never good enough
so that people will buy the next generation
hopping the definitive camera
that never comes and never will
because it's planned in such a way.




 
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 07:51:39 pm by fredjeang2 »
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eronald

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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #55 on: December 12, 2013, 07:49:29 pm »

Maybe Doug can supply files if asked nicely (hint) :)

Re. DxO, I don't stand in awe of them, as I'm a bit (!) full of myself. What impresses me is their ability to do tests systematically under controlled conditions; however for determining a single parameter like noise, I'd just randomly guess that picking any old Raw file apart would get you the juicy optical black pixels - masked off from light on the edges of the sensor to provide a reference. Then once you grab these black pixels, doing a statistical noise test on them would be a quite reasonable alternative to real hard work for a lazy individual. :) Of course if you want to look at pattern noise, I'd guess you'd want to do something more sophisticated, maybe use Matlab to fourier transform the vector of black pixels...of course just looking at pictures is in the end a better criterion IMHO.

Edmund

Hi,

Yes, of course, but it does not show up in the DxO data. But I respect Doug's judgement on this. I would also say that Steve Hendrix used to have solid info.

Would be nice to see raw files to compare.

Best regards
Erik

« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 08:52:46 pm by eronald »
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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #56 on: December 12, 2013, 08:20:32 pm »

The Leica S2 might feel like a better put-together system than the Phamiyas or the Blads, but there's one thing about it that pots it out of contention for me, no matter how cheap it gets; and that's the 3:2 ratio. I simply hate working with this aspect ratio. Almost everything I shoot with the D800 is cropped down to 4:3 (Or to a lesser extent, 5:4). Every time I pick my Bronica up, I see the world differently. In a way that appeals to me a lot more than how it looks through a 3:2 viewfinder. And that's a major reason why I am going DMF.

In other words, the S2 is perfect for those who like the "35mm DSLR feel". For the rest, it's a non-player.
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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #57 on: December 12, 2013, 09:47:56 pm »

The part I don't understand is why you want a different camera (S2) if it has exactly the same Kodak sensor as a P30, and on top of that you lose the wonderful processing from C1 Smiley
 I thought you liked the Contax experience. If you swap to the S2, what is gained here?


anybody wants to swap their s2 for a contax just to feel like they are correct line please send me a pm... meanwhile back to my medication
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Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #58 on: December 12, 2013, 10:18:09 pm »

You really would rather spend a day with a Mamiya 645 than a Leica?  OK,  I guess you'd rather have a date with the Duck Dynasty wives than a double with Kate Moss and Kate Upton? (at least you wouldn't have to worry about getting their names mixed up).

Hey, what's wrong with Jessica Robertson??

Also I'm pretty much done with C-1.  I have many multiple licenses and this upgrade your software - buy a computer, buy a camera - upgrade your software - buy a computer routine is as close to a bait and switch scheme as life can get and phase isn't alone with this as everyone does it, they just signed on.

Really?

C1 Upgrades are $50/computer.

From 2005 until today there have been 4 upgrades, 2 of which were free to owners of v3.

This is really unreasonable to you for one of the most important non-human components of your tethered shoots??

My guess is you've spent more money on gaffe tape than you have on C1 upgrades.

Older C-1 I think 5 or something is fine, runs my Contax and I'm not going any further with C-1. Plus C-1 really needs single channel corrections like Iridient or single color settings like lightroom.  

Single channel RGB levels and Single Channel RGB Curves were added many versions ago.

C1v7, including those features, is free for use with any of your digital backs. Or $99 upgrade for a 2-computer license if you also want to use it with your Canon/Nikons.

Oh and by the way on 1600 sync speed?   Really?   You need to try some different strobes.  This was shot at 90th of a second with monoblocks and this guy was rocking so fast any shutter speed is not going to add the sharpness of quick flash duration.

All a fast shutter speed does is cut into the flash like it was a continuous source and you loose a lot of light and the file gets kind of muddy looking.  BTW:  Nudes need fast duration?  Jeez what are you doing with these naked people, and out of curiosity are the naked people photographed during your wedding sessions, because that would be a hell of a marketing trick.

I only shoot naked brides.

Seriously though, fast flash sync isn't about stopping motion in the studio while stopped down. For that, as you say, flash duration is the only thing that really matters.

I use fast flash sync in my wedding work. It allows me to, e.g. shoot wide open during an outdoor ceremony (which requires a fast shutter speed even at low ISO), while still being able to use fill flash from any reasonable distance. This isn't to create a dramatic effect or drop the ambient light so far you create the "day as night" effect - it's just to get a bit of fill in an otherwise too-contrasty situation where I don't have any control over where the subjects are standing relative to the sun, and I only have a limited number of places I can stand without being intrusive.

With a Canon or Nikon and their psuedo-fast-sync the effective power output drops like a rock at high shutter speeds, meaning I could only fill from a short distance. With P1 I can crank the shutter speed to 1/1600th, shoot at f/2.8, and use a simple 580EX flash to fill (on camera or off), even from the back of a ceremony.

Others would use fast flash sync with studio strobe, on location, and have independent control of the amount of ambient vs. fill -  regardless of the aperture they are shooting at. This applies to editorial and fashion that your mind jumps to right away, but it also applies to architecture/interiors/event.

It's really freeing knowing that you can increase or decrease your shutter speed as needed, regardless of where you happen to be.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 10:23:33 pm by Doug Peterson »
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ToddP

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    • Todd Parsons Photography
Re: First Medium Format Purchase - My Head is Going to Explode
« Reply #59 on: December 12, 2013, 10:54:07 pm »

Quote
or to say it differently: the big lucrative business
consists in inundating the market
with very short-life new tech (carefuly planned not to be
too good at once) gear of all sort
beta tested by the consumers by the way,
but never good enough
so that people will buy the next generation
hopping the definitive camera
that never comes and never will
because it's planned in such a way.

Only if you get sucked in.  I'm talking about purchasing a 6-7 year old system to get my feet wet.  I have yet to upgrade (nor do I see myself doing so) to the D4.  The D3 more than fulfills mine and my client's needs for wedding work.  And the focusing - man, once you use a D3/D4 - nothing else comes close.  I use the 3D tracking at f1.4 or f2.0 when the brides walking down the aisle.  Gravy.  And it's sharp (as can be for that shallow DOF). 

I'm looking for something different - nothing wrong with having a quiver of boards when heading on safari, if you catch my drift ;)   
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