A7R: Not WHAT? but WHEN?

[ron ritcher]

I've decided to purchase an A7R, and have kind of a logistical question.  My decision, by the way, reflects a long-held frustration with Canon's lack of DR, vis-a-vis the Nikon 600/800 models.  The actual turning point came several weeks ago while traveling through Colorado and Utah; dropped in to a few photo galleries and saw first-hand what the 800E is capable of with the kinds of landscape images I try to capture myself.  Wow!!  Since I print only 16x24 (but occasionally outsource for larger prints), I figured a D600 would do, but then came Sony's announcement.

I rarely buy anything in its early iteration, preferring to wait until the dust settles, the reviews are in, tweeks made, etc.  That said, I've read enough to be ready to move on the Sony right now.  I'm 65, not getting younger anytime soon, and this will very likely be the last camera I ever buy (but, of course, I've said THAT before!), so I'm not interested in waiting for the "A7R ver. 2" to hit the market, but at the same time, wish to avoid buying a buggy prototype.  Any advice?

Jump on it, cross my fingers about early-release quality, and (hopefully) begin enjoying more resolution/DR soon, or wait awhile to see how the rollout actually goes -- while losing some of that early enjoyment?  That's the question . . . what do you suggest?  Thanks!

Ron

[Colorado David]

Were you in Images of Rocky Mountain National Park, Eric Stensland's gallery in Estes Park?  He does beautiful work with a D800 and D800E.

[ron ritcher]

No, I didn't get that far east (having started from No Cal), but was mightily impressed by JC Leacock's work at his gallery in Crested Butte.  Gorgeous 30x40, or thereabouts, prints from his 800E -- one frame each; no bracketing, HDR, exposure fusion, focus-stacking, etc.  Gives one pause . . .

Also, was taken by Bret Edge's work on display at his gallery in Moab; I understand that he works with a Canon 5dll, as I do.  His command of exposure is impressive, along with his aesthetic instincts.  Fun stuff!

Care to weigh-in on my pressing question: should I plunge now or later?  And why?  Thanks!!

Ron

[telyt]

Care to weigh-in on my pressing question: should I plunge now or later?  And why?  Thanks!!

Woud the A7r represent a total system changeover or would you be able to keep your existing system while you learn the strengths and weaknesses of the Sony?

[ron ritcher]

Good question!  The plan is to keep my 3 "L" lenses, buy a cheap adapter (for now), focus manually, as I prefer to do anyway, and maybe go ahead and sell the 5dii body -- or give it to my daughter.  That gets me shooting, at least, before seeing how the Sony lens plans shake out, months down the road.

The primary question has to do with the advisability to buying the very first iteration of something like a camera;  Generally speaking, do these things tend to go well, or is the initial wave liable to be glitch-prone, leaving early-birds stuck with buggy equipment?  And IF Sony does have early issues, could one assume that firmware updates would come to the rescue?  OBVIOUSLY, no one here has a crystal ball, but since I've never taken the plunge this early before, I really have NO experience.  I'd hate to wait 6 months or longer if the early models are probably destined to be fairly trouble-free.

So, what what can YOUR experiences tell me?  Again, thank-you . . .

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi,

I had a few Sony cameras that I bought early, and I don't recall any problem or failure. Sony usually has few firmware updates. The Alpha 77 I have was slow in response to inputs, that was improved by a firmware upgrade.

Your thinking seems feasible, but you may need to consider what you are expecting to gain.

Best regards
Erik

Good question!  The plan is to keep my 3 "L" lenses, buy a cheap adapter (for now), focus manually, as I prefer to do anyway, and maybe go ahead and sell the 5dii body -- or give it to my daughter.  That gets me shooting, at least, before seeing how the Sony lens plans shake out, months down the road.

The primary question has to do with the advisability to buying the very first iteration of something like a camera;  Generally speaking, do these things tend to go well, or is the initial wave liable to be glitch-prone, leaving early-birds stuck with buggy equipment?  And IF Sony does have early issues, could one assume that firmware updates would come to the rescue?  OBVIOUSLY, no one here has a crystal ball, but since I've never taken the plunge this early before, I really have NO experience.  I'd hate to wait 6 months or longer if the early models are probably destined to be fairly trouble-free.

So, what what can YOUR experiences tell me?  Again, thank-you . . .

[MarkL]

Wait 6 months for the hype to settle, the price to drop a bit, the early adopters to give the camera a shakedown and a consensus formed as to strengths and weaknesses.

[jrsforums]

Good question!  The plan is to keep my 3 "L" lenses, buy a cheap adapter (for now), focus manually, as I prefer to do anyway, and maybe go ahead and sell the 5dii body -- or give it to my daughter.  That gets me shooting, at least, before seeing how the Sony lens plans shake out, months down the road.

The primary question has to do with the advisability to buying the very first iteration of something like a camera;  Generally speaking, do these things tend to go well, or is the initial wave liable to be glitch-prone, leaving early-birds stuck with buggy equipment?  And IF Sony does have early issues, could one assume that firmware updates would come to the rescue?  OBVIOUSLY, no one here has a crystal ball, but since I've never taken the plunge this early before, I really have NO experience.  I'd hate to wait 6 months or longer if the early models are probably destined to be fairly trouble-free.

So, what what can YOUR experiences tell me?  Again, thank-you . . .

As far as lens adapters, you may want to review this article...

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/09/there-is-no-free-lunch-episode-763-lens-adapters

John

[ron ritcher]

Thanks, folks, for the input -- plenty to chew on . . .

I'm going to pull the trigger soon; waiting for the next best thing is a fool's errand (at least IF you believe that progress stops the moment you make that purchase).

My shooting is limited to landscapes (well, 90%) and I nearly always use the tripod and manual focus, tending to work methodically, so the actual ergonomics and user interface of my equipment is not a significant factor in my deciding what equipment to buy/use.  Therefor, waiting around to hear about the "feel" of the A7R wouldn't help me: I know it's much lighter (good!) than my Canon, and the IQ appears to be on a par with the 800E, also great from my perspective.  If I can rest assured that the first models rolling off the line will be as good (from a QC and initial design standpoint) as what Sony's selling in 6 months, it all looks like a go.  Fingers crossed . . .

Ron

[Wayne Fox]

I guess my question is whether the new sensor in the 7r has the same dynamic range capabilities as the current one in the nikon.  One would assume so.  as anyone seen anything on this?

the new sensor design is intriguing, especially “gapless, optimally positioned on-chip lenses” which may mean a Leica lens will actually perform better with less lens cast/vignetting than any other body.  I had some leica glass I was selling, but will wait to test it with the 7r.

As far as whether to wait, my perspective is sony has been making mirrorless cameras very well for quite some time now. This is just a slightly larger form factor to accommodate a larger sensor.  So I really don’t view this as a “gen 1” camera, more like a gen 3 or 4.  Natural evolution of what they’ve been  doing for a few years.

[ron ritcher]

Thanks, Wayne, for the response.  Regarding your DR question, I just saw something on the DxO site showing the A7R comparing favorably with the 800E in terms of sensor performance -- and that was about the final thing I needed to hear before deciding to head toward Sony.  Thanks again . . .

Ron

[BernardLanguillier]

Thanks, Wayne, for the response.  Regarding your DR question, I just saw something on the DxO site showing the A7R comparing favorably with the 800E in terms of sensor performance -- and that was about the final thing I needed to hear before deciding to head toward Sony.  Thanks again . . .

Yep, they got the same DxO mark.

Now, the question is whether you can live with the limited lens line up of the Sony for your applications.

Cheers,
Bernard

[viewfinder]

Interesting.....

I've been waiting a long time for a 'larger sensor' mirrorless system, however, for me the A7 is not it.   the main problem (apart from the indifferent design with superfuous DSLR lookalike 'hump') is the Sony origin.......Will A7 be repairable when the warranty runs out or will it be like other Sony products and not be cost effective to replace parts which are frankly priced to give built in obsolescence.

A7 is the first expensive Sony photo product to effectively have no engineering...just solid state electronics.   This will undoubtedly lower Sony's production costs but it brings their camera products right into their core consumer electronics business.     Is their repair track record good enough?

I should mention that I have previously had a higher range Sony camcorder which failed just after the two year period and which the repairers were unable to repair due to parts cost/non availablility.   The same repairer was able to repair my much older SVHS Panasonic camcorder which is still going strong after nearly 15 years.

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi,

OK I can feel your pian. On the other hand, I have had Minolta and Sony equipment something like 43 years with just two repairs. There have been dozens of lenses quite a few bodies.

The two repairs was a broken Macro switch on a A2 (warranty) and a bayonet replacement on an 80-200/2.8 that has seen 20 years of use. Total cost about 200 $US. Zero issues with Sony DSLRs and lenses.

Best regards
Erik

Interesting.....

I've been waiting a long time for a 'larger sensor' mirrorless system, however, for me the A7 is not it.   the main problem (apart from the indifferent design with superfuous DSLR lookalike 'hump') is the Sony origin.......Will A7 be repairable when the warranty runs out or will it be like other Sony products and not be cost effective to replace parts which are frankly priced to give built in obsolescence.

A7 is the first expensive Sony photo product to effectively have no engineering...just solid state electronics.   This will undoubtedly lower Sony's production costs but it brings their camera products right into their core consumer electronics business.     Is their repair track record good enough?

I should mention that I have previously had a higher range Sony camcorder which failed just after the two year period and which the repairers were unable to repair due to parts cost/non availablility.   The same repairer was able to repair my much older SVHS Panasonic camcorder which is still going strong after nearly 15 years.

[Dennishh]

I consider the A7r to be the third-generation camera because many of the features of the new camera were tested on the NEX-7 and then on the fixed lens full frame RX1 and RXr. Many of the bugs have already been worked out. I'm sure the second-generation of the A7r will have an improved focusing system, be a little quieter and have a touchscreen. Personally many of these don't matter enough to make me wait. When using the metabones Nikon G to e mount adapter for all my Nikon lenses work extremely well. It will be a dream to be able use the 14-24 and 70-200 when extreme quality is needed and the rest of the time just use the 24-70 Zeiss or 35 2.8 as a walk around/travel lens.

[aaykay]

I wish the smaller zoom (28-70) was available as a stand-alone option or as a kit with the A7R.  Seems like it is only available as a kit-option along with the A7. 

I think it is smaller and lighter (approx 250gms or so) and matches better with the small camera, vis-a-vis the larger/heavier Zeiss 24-70/4 (approx 430gms).

I too plan to get the A7R and maybe the 35/2.8 prime.  And since I have several A-mount lenses, I might get the LA-EA3 adapter (the one without the SLT mirror in the light-path).

Based on my prior experience with Sony DSLR products (A900 FF purchased in Oct 2008, along with several lenses), I have not had a single problem in over 5 years of hard usage across 4 continents.   

[allegretto]

As far as lens adapters, you may want to review this article...

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/09/there-is-no-free-lunch-episode-763-lens-adapters

John

Woo hoo

Have had my doubts about adapters for quite some time, Factor in the weight of the lens over time on these plastic frames and it's a virtual recipe for poor real world tolerances

The bodies are typically a fraction of the System cost. Why not keep your 5D III (or better yet, give it to me) and get the Sony body?

BTW; From a lifelong Sony guy across many product departments. Their service is desultory, but usually adequate.