3

[armand]

clouds

[Jeremy Roussak]

Well caught!

Jeremy

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Exquisite!

On a technical side, I wonder if that thin strip of water (?) at the bottom serves much purpose? I also see a slight purple color cast,  especially between the tree line and the clouds.

[Eric Myrvaagnes]

Exquisite!

On a technical side, I wonder if that thin strip of water (?) at the bottom serves much purpose? I also see a slight purple color cast,  especially between the tree line and the clouds.

I agree. Great catch, but I would crop out the strip of water.

[Tonysx]

Exquisite!
On a technical side, I wonder if that thin strip of water (?) at the bottom serves much purpose? I also see a slight purple color cast,  especially between the tree line and the clouds.

A purple cast? In a black and white image? O.k. maybe my calibrated monitor is inaccurate or maybe...
But if you don't like the water(?) why not offer an alternative to a very pleasing image?
I'll post my interpretation if you post your's!....

[armand]

While it's possible that I have some color blindness this one shouldn't have any color in it. Processed initially in LR, then sent to Nik Silver Effex and then to Photoshop for some minor content aware replacement of a small cloud on the periphery of the frame which distracted from the main elements. There is a red filter in Nik but no toning so it shouldn't really have any color.

I felt the thin strip of water might provide a better balance to the picture but I might be subjective as this was taken from the kayak.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

It should be easy to check. I used Mac's utility DigitalColor Meter and these are screen shots. The point of measurement was in the lower right hand corner, where the arrow is pointing. In the clouds right above the tree line, the measurement is indeed neutral. However, in the darker clouds just below the three white ones, the red channel has a higher value.

[davidh202]

OMG I actually agree with you   

I see the very slight cast ... almost thought it was a duotone 

[armand]

Still can't say it jumps at me; with what you say I think I'm seeing something but it might be autosuggestion.
So the most probable explanation is that a red filter applied in Nik will give a very slight color shift. Unless you have a better one.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Still can't say it jumps at me... So the most probable explanation is that a red filter applied in Nik will give a very slight color shift. Unless you have a better one.

By the way, what I said was not meant as a criticism, neither of you nor your technique, but merely as an observation. The color cast does not "jump" either. It is indeed a "very slight" cast, as I said initially. The reason I noticed it is that I struggle with the same issue occasionally, especially when applying split toning (and even if both hues are the same, differing only in saturation amount). The problem gets compounded  in printing, as the printer induces its own color casts.

I am not a color-space expert (and if Andrew Rodney, a.k.a. digitaldog, is reading this, I am sure he could provide a better explanation), but I believe it has nothing to do with the Nik red filter, but most likely to do with color spaces. Your image is in sRGB color space, meaning that the system is using RGB colors to achieve grayscale values, not always succeeding with 100% accuracy.

Try a simple experiment: use any software that can desaturate the image. Push the slider all the way to complete desaturation and then back quickly and you will notice the cast better. If you use a color picker, you will then measure absolute grays in the completely desaturated image.

You image deserve the best printing and presentation you can get, so getting rid of even minor distractions should help.

[Dave (Isle of Skye)]

By the way, what I said was not meant as a criticism, neither of you nor your technique, but merely as an observation. The color cast does not "jump" either. It is indeed a "very slight" cast, as I said initially. The reason I noticed it is that I struggle with the same issue occasionally, especially when applying split toning (and even if both hues are the same, differing only in saturation amount). The problem gets compounded  in printing, as the printer induces its own color casts.

I am not a color-space expert (and if Andrew Rodney, a.k.a. digitaldog, is reading this, I am sure he could provide a better explanation), but I believe it has nothing to do with the Nik red filter, but most likely to do with color spaces. Your image is in sRGB color space, meaning that the system is using RGB colors to achieve grayscale values, not always succeeding with 100% accuracy.

Try a simple experiment: use any software that can desaturate the image. Push the slider all the way to complete desaturation and then back quickly and you will notice the cast better. If you use a color picker, you will then measure absolute grays in the completely desaturated image.

You image deserve the best printing and presentation you can get, so getting rid of even minor distractions should help.

Great shot Jeremy and for some reason for me at least, quite spooky..

Thank you Slobodan - I also posted a B&W image on this forum some time ago and a discussion then ensued regarding a perceived colour casts that only some people could see and only in some parts of it, even though the original image had been fully desaturated on my computer, and I think you have now answered why this may have happened, because of the compression the uploaded image had gone through when being squeezed down into the sRGB colour space.

I wonder if it would be better to create the large and original B&W image in whatever colour space you use and save it, then before you resize the image down and convert into sRGB for uploading here, whether adding an extra 'converting to greyscale' step into the process would cure this?

ProPhoto RGB/Adobe 1998 RGB -convert to- Greyscale -convert to- sRGB.

Thanks again.

Dave

[Chris Calohan]

ProPhoto RGB/Adobe 1998 RGB -convert to- Greyscale -convert to- sRGB.

I never convert to grayscale and cannot say I've never experienced this color shifting, but going back through about 50 B&W's, pretty sure it's never occurred in my images. I do the ProPhoto RGB to Adobe 1998 RGB as well prior to printing. I wonder if the above process wouldn't just denigrate the image quality in each modification? I truly do not know.

[Dave (Isle of Skye)]

I never convert to grayscale and cannot say I've never experienced this color shifting, but going back through about 50 B&W's, pretty sure it's never occurred in my images. I do the ProPhoto RGB to Adobe 1998 RGB as well prior to printing. I wonder if the above process wouldn't just denigrate the image quality in each modification? I truly do not know.

Hi Chris, no I only mean for when you upload a B&W image onto Lula. For printing, home viewing and everything else you might do with your work then I agree, maybe not such a good idea, but for uploading here in the sRGB colour space with a small low res image, then maybe it would help to remove any chance of a weird colour cast due to compression - but I agree, who knows??

Dave

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

I think it will be easier to see the cast in a direct comparison. The image on the right was desaturated (I know, it sounds strange to "desaturate" a b&w, but there you go):

[armand]

When I was looking in LR I didn't see it that fast but when I looked at the exported jpeg I saw the light. Going back to LR it was also there but more subtle so the jpeg conversion made it worse.
Now to the part of why it was present in LR also I'm not sure, I still suspect Nik as I did use a red filter in it.

Here is the version desaturated in LR.

PS. the file comes from a Sony RX100

[cjogo]

Great capture -- the first thing I do in the RAW editor is de-saturate completely -- slide it to the left -- > no color will make it over ~!