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Author Topic: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range  (Read 3975 times)

Rob Whitehead

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The Pilbara Craton - this is what the earth's crust looked like back in the Archaean eon, 3 billion years ago. Remote and relatively inaccessable, when the sun rises here you can look around 360 degrees and be confident that you have the whole landscape to yourself.

This picture was taken in the Millstream-Chichester National Park in the rugged northwest of Australia. The Pilbara is generally flat, arid semi-desert but in this one magical location the terrain is folded into a series of hills known as the Chichester Ranges. As there's nowhere to camp in this side of the park you either need to make a VERY early start, or find your own home amongst the hills.

The combination of green spinifex and crumbling red iron ore is typical of this region. The flora in this picture is, however, much more varied than normal due to recent rains resulting in an outburst of new plant life.

I've shot this sunrise on three or four occasions over the years. This is a take on it from my first expedition to the site with a technical camera.

Photographed with: a Cambo Wide RS, Rodenstock 45mm, P65+, RRS tripod, BH-55 ballhead. 1 second at f/11. Image is comprised of a lateral shift stitch panorama, all shots LCC corrected. Framing was with a combination of an iPhone and an antique Zeiss viewfinder mounted on the camera.

All feedback greatly appreciate, particularly with regards to color, composition and subject matter.

Thanks for looking!

Rob Whitehead

Edit: re-saved/modified picture reposted below due to technical issues


« Last Edit: September 09, 2013, 11:51:57 am by whitey »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2013, 10:30:34 am »

... All feedback greatly appreciate, particularly with regards to color, composition and subject matter.

The color is grossly overdone, particularly the blues and oranges. Composition is fine, subject matter superb.

David Eckels

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2013, 10:37:25 am »

Composition, very cool. I saw Slobodan's comment and checked that in IE10, colors WAY over saturated. In Chrome, the image looks very washed out. Maybe some of the smarter guys in the forum can figure that out. I'm pretty sure that either alternative is not what you intended.
Update: Interestingly, the preview in Chrome looks about right or better at least, but probably still too saturated.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2013, 10:56:05 am by David Eckels »
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Peter McLennan

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2013, 10:53:04 am »

Something's wrong. In Chrome, the thumbnail looks good, the download looks about two stops hotter.
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PeterAit

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2013, 11:11:35 am »

Something's wrong. In Chrome, the thumbnail looks good, the download looks about two stops hotter.

Yep, the thumb in the message is very different from the larger image. I have no idea why this would be, they are supposedly based on the same uploaded image file.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2013, 11:13:11 am »

Thumbs are not color managed.

Rob Whitehead

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2013, 11:44:40 am »

I noticed some problems after posting, Firefox and IE looked very different.

Anyway, here's a repost. In addition to hopefully sorting out the color management/file issues I've toned down the pic a little (mainly the sky).

On my non-calibrated standard monitor, to my eyes the foreground looks fairly realistic but the sky is perhaps a bit underdone. On my wide gamut callibrated display it looks a bit punchier (maybe too much), with some of the greens in the foreground being a little off color-wise thanks to the sRGB conversion during 'save for web'.

Let me know what you think about it now.

Cheers and sorry for the odd monitor results!

Rob
« Last Edit: September 09, 2013, 11:58:48 am by whitey »
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RSL

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2013, 11:52:55 am »

The color is grossly overdone, particularly the blues and oranges. Composition is fine, subject matter superb.

+1.

I checked it in Firefox and IE 10. It's washed out in Chrome and Firefox but grossly oversaturated in IE 10. Preview's about right in all three. One of the things you learn right away when you build websites is that every browser has its peculiarities. It all depends on how peculiar the designers are.

Looks as if in the re-post Chrome displays the larger image correctly. But it still looks like something I'd expect to see in a local "art fair." Yeah, I know: if you oversaturate your sales increase.
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Rob Whitehead

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2013, 12:07:13 pm »

Do you still think the sky is way overdone on the repost?

When I look at the image on a normal device (such as my iPhone or a standard non-color calibrated monitor) I'd probably call the sunrise a little understated in terms of the vibrancy of the colors.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2013, 12:14:00 pm by whitey »
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Harald L

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2013, 12:16:18 pm »

Still looks somewhat HDRish (Safari, Firefox and IE10).

Harald

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David Eckels

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2013, 12:19:16 pm »

Looks better, but agree with Harald. Want to make sure I am looking at something fairly similar to what you render.

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2013, 12:33:32 pm »

... When I look at the image on a normal device (such as my iPhone or a standard non-color calibrated monitor) I'd probably call the sunrise a little understated in terms of the vibrancy of the colors.

Agree. On iPhone, it looks almost pastel.

However, on my calibrated iMac 27 (latest generation, with less reflective screen) greens look slightly oversaturated, while the sky, both oranges and blues, looks dull now.

In addition to saturation, I think the image suffers (in the believability department) from an uneven distribution of light/dark. For instance:

- there is a bright blue line just under the horizon, while the field becomes darker in the middle ground, then lighter again in the foreground

- it also does not make sense (to me) that the orange in the sky is darker (and duller) than the foreground

- given the position of the sun, it is unconvincing that the far left side is brighter than the middle

- the blueish cast in the distance creates the impression of a body of water... it is also brighter and more vivid than the sky itself

Isaac

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2013, 01:18:59 pm »

The Pilbara Craton - this is what the earth's crust looked like back in the Archaean eon, 3 billion years ago.

That's what rock formed 3 billion years ago looks like when exposed at the surface in present day desert Australia. Back 3 billion years ago, the rock was being formed in the shallows of a sea.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2013, 02:14:11 pm »

Isaac, you then must be older than Larry King, if you remember that ;)

Isaac

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2013, 03:37:19 pm »

I must be no older than whitey.
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davidh202

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2013, 09:24:04 pm »

Rob,
I'm viewing on IE10, calibrated Eizo and it is fantastic!
 I don't agree with the other criticisms...
there is one little bug in it  that is a bit of pet peeve of mine, and I am surprised that no one else picked up on it.
There is a distinct halo (artifact) at the top edge of the far ridge/ sky line, that is extremely easy to remedy in PP. That halo would really ruin it for me if I were to print big,(and you should!!). I guess viewing on an I phone just doesn't cut it ;-)
Lovely landscape portrayed very well. I find the image is virtually the same on Chrome for me, maybe a 1/4 stop brighter.
David
« Last Edit: September 09, 2013, 09:32:23 pm by davidh202 »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2013, 10:51:53 pm »

... it is fantastic!...

There you go. The beauty of the Internet. There is always someone liking something. And why not? There are huge hordes of fans for even grotesque HDR.

Rob Whitehead

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #17 on: September 09, 2013, 11:45:59 pm »

Thanks for the replies

re: "That's what rock formed 3 billion years ago looks like when exposed at the surface in present day desert Australia. Back 3 billion years ago, the rock was being formed in the shallows of a sea."

Isaac, without wanting to get too much into Geology debates, if I may quote Zegers et al from their 1998 paper "Vaalbara, Earth's oldest assembled continent? A combined structural, geochronological, and palaeomagnetic test":

"The only remaining areas of pristine 3.6±2.7 Ga crust on Earth are parts of the Kaapvaal and Pilbara cratons."

In addition, the oldest evidence of life on earth may be in the Pilbara, in the Strelley Pool Chert dated to 3.43 Ga.

However, this is more of an artistic forum rather than an earth sciences one. The take home message for the viewer is that this is an ancient landscape that you are looking at. Old as dirt, maybe older.   :)

It's also a part of the world that you've almost certainly never seen, at least in this light. Unlike the Karijini National Park to the north - which although remote has now been well photographed - you won't find images from here in the portfolios of most Australian landscape photographers. And the logistical inconveniences involved in trying to get to this spot for sunrise mean that this may well be the first Chichester Range dawn photograph published (I google imaged it to check! There's one photo I could find of a sunrise from the East part of the park - where the campgrounds are - and a few of the place usually photographed over there, the cliff lookout. And there's quite a few Python Pool photos around - but that's about it.). This is not Yosemite.

So as for whether this is just 'art faire' material - not that I mind art fairs, but I don't think that was a compliment :) - I guess the reasons to share it with the world are:

1. unique location/light
2. technical quality - I'm shooting this to print big, really big. Some of my other sunrise shots form the same location have more interesting weather, but I've never been happy that my 35mm gear ressolves the small details in the hills for this shot. In other words, my previous efforts look good on the web but won't cut it in a big landscape print. Technical camera, P65 and shift stitching mean that this photo has detail far better than anything I've managed before from here. I'll post some 100% crop comparisons of this vs my previous Canon efforts when I get home so you can see what I mean.

That mainly just leaves the issues of aesthetics. I've been trying to work out how much to saturate and what brightness to go with for the sky and foreground, and have been pretty unsure myself how to approach this for this image (hence my primary reason for posting it here). My problem is that nature didn't bless me with a particularly interesting sunrise, so I've felt that I needed to make the colors fairly saturated for the sky to compete with the foreground (here, I am pleased with what nature has done - the variety of plant life is certainly the best I've ever seen here). I guess given the subject matter - the Land Before Time is after all a children's cartoon, and I'm thinking that if there's anywhere on earth you'll find a dinosaur, this is it - I'm also going for a bit of a magical reality type look, rather than a grim, gritty Ansel-esque black and white.

Because Slobodan's reply to the initial post was so horrified  :)  , I knocked up a mark 2 version with a much more understated sky. The image is composed of a two image shift stitch, with two separate exposures for sky and foreground, blended in post with a gradient in photoshop (rather than an ND grad suring the shooting stage, which I do about half the time). The gradient in the mark 2 version is not at all well done (the mark 1 version which posted with technical issues was more subtle), but it was midnight and I was really just trying to get the colors right so Slobodan would be able to sleep OK. I'll try and fix it properly tonight!

David, I'm glad it looks OK to you on your Eizo. I agree with the halo-like effect over the hills being an issue - out of interest, what is your preferred method of fixing this?   

Thanks all for your feedback anyway. I'll have a go at a Mark 3 version and see what the crowd thinks.
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Isaac

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2013, 03:20:27 am »

However, this is more of an artistic forum rather than an earth sciences one. The take home message for the viewer is that this is an ancient landscape that you are looking at....

The rock is ancient; the landscape is not.

As you say "the oldest evidence of life on earth may be in the Pilbara, in the Strelley Pool Chert", and not so far away you'll find a landscape where that form of life endures -- the turquoise hypersaline shallows of the ocean at Hamelin Pool, Shark Bay.

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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: The Land Before Time - Sunrise from atop the Pilbara's Chichester range
« Reply #19 on: September 10, 2013, 02:24:31 pm »

... Because Slobodan's reply to the initial post was so horrified  :) ... I was really just trying to get the colors right so Slobodan would be able to sleep OK...

Hey, mate, I was just trying to help!

I would not have bothered with a detailed criticism if I did not think your image deserves it (meaning the subject matter and your hardware used deserve the best post processing you can give it).

Coincidentally, we just got another thread with a similar scene, which also happens to be a fine example of restrained post processing.
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