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Author Topic: Doing well without power.  (Read 4377 times)

KirbyKrieger

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Doing well without power.
« on: August 13, 2013, 06:17:46 pm »

Hi.  Just returned from three-night hike in Baxter State Park (Maine, USA).  There is no power available inside the park -- a new experience for me as a photographer.  Can anyone provide some general hints (or links to same) for best practices?  Obviously, having plenty of dependable batteries is the first order of business.  I complicated things by taking a new camera (Sony RX1R*), which, delivered late, gave me little time to learn how to use.  I burned an entire battery the first day due to ignorance (not knowing the best settings for low-power use) and more ignorance (used a "soft release" for the first time -- this kept waking the camera in my small bag).  After paying to learn, I was able to use my remaining battery power judiciously.  My other concern is backing up my cards.  A camera that records files simultaneously to two cards would be re-assuring (anyone at Sony listening?).  Are there any practical in-the-field solutions to powerless back-up?

*Better photographers than me have reported on this exceptional light data recorder.  It's the most exciting camera I've had in hand since I first used a full-frame camera (Sony a850, exploded the price floor for full-frame in later 2009).  Fwiw, my current set-up puts AE toggle on the "c" button, and AF toggle on the AEL button.  I set the upper end of Auto-ISO at 12,800 and took full advantage of it.  If I feel brave, I may post more about this delightful camera -- but all that deserves its own thread.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2013, 06:20:57 pm by KirbyKrieger »
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Ken Bennett

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2013, 09:15:53 pm »

Yeah, I still have to remind myself to turn off the Fujis in the bag, lest the soft release continually wake them from sleep and kill the battery. Not an issue with my other cameras.

I think the key for anything like this is lots and lots of batteries. Did you have a car? How about an inverter or car charger?

Re: backing up. Interesting question. For a car camping trip I'd just take my laptop and recharge it from the inverter. For an upcoming trip to Eastern Europe I'm considering buying one of the Hyperdrive backup hard drive units, since I am very unlikely to take even my Macbook Air. I would incrementally back up my cards every evening so as to have a backup in case of total card failure or a lost or stolen camera. (I generally put a 32GB card in the camera and just keep shooting.)

Anyone still using a Hyperdrive? Michael has a nice review of them, but it's several years old.
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KirbyKrieger

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2013, 10:33:36 pm »

No car.  No power.  I did have cigarette-lighter (are they still called that?) adapters for the camera and for the phone, but left them with, understandably, the car.

The soft-release fell off and that was that.  It was a freebie that came with the Fotodiox hood and grip (each of which gets high marks from me, though the utility of the hood remains to be verified).

Once I got set up properly, I was able to get more than a day out of each battery.  Used the EVF, never the LCD (and turned its brightness to minimum, but still haven't figured out how to keep it from coming on when the camera wakes), no image review, no AF assist, never the flash, and set sleep to 10s.

wolfnowl

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2013, 01:33:19 am »

We have a friend who likes to go off kayaking for 4-6 weeks at a time.  He relies on both large battery packs and solar rolls for recharging.  He uses 12V auto connectors on everything, and then if needed he'll plug in a 12V USB adapter for example.

Mike.
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Rhossydd

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2013, 04:09:42 am »

My other concern is backing up my cards. ...  Are there any practical in-the-field solutions to powerless back-up?
Epson used to make a useful little portable back up device, the P2000, which lasted well in the field, you can still pick them up on eBay quite cheaply. The main problem is that capacity is pretty limited by today's standards.

This might be heresy, but do you really need to worry about it ? Although I've religiously taken back ups when ever I've been away for a week or more, in thirteen years shooting digitally I've never actually needed them.
I've very rarely(never?) read of people having to rely on in-field back ups of memory cards. They're proving to be a very reliable technology.
There's more risk in theft of the camera, but that's unlikely when hiking, or, more likely, carelessly leaving the camera behind somewhere.
If you take care of your kit, I reckon the risks are very low of in-field data loss.
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KirbyKrieger

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2013, 07:11:28 am »

We have a friend who likes to go off kayaking for 4-6 weeks at a time.  He relies on both large battery packs and solar rolls for recharging.  He uses 12V auto connectors on everything, and then if needed he'll plug in a 12V USB adapter for example.

Mike.
Thanks Mike. I'll look into solar rolls (didn't know about them).  I have 12V auto-connectors & 12V<->USB adapters.  The RX1/R allows charging the battery via USB.

KirbyKrieger

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2013, 07:31:05 am »

This might be heresy, but do you really need to worry about it ? Although I've religiously taken back ups when ever I've been away for a week or more, in thirteen years shooting digitally I've never actually needed them.

Excellent point.  I, too, have never had a card fail or lost any file recorded to a memory card.  As you've indicated, loss of the card itself is still a concern.

You've solved my powerless backup problem (by pointing out it is not a problem).  Thanks.  :-)

Ellis Vener

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2013, 08:44:37 am »

have you checked out the  Paul C. Buff Vagabond Mini Lithium Battery and a spare battery or two for it?  http://www.paulcbuff.com/vagabond.php
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mvsoske

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2013, 09:12:16 am »

I'll look into solar rolls (didn't know about them). 

Look into the Goal Zero products: www.goalzero.com

Mark

Ellis Vener

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2013, 10:05:11 am »

Thanks for the goalzero.com tip
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powerslave12r

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2013, 11:39:07 am »

Didn't look through the whole thread but you could get a couple of these for your battery concerns.

http://www.amazon.com/New-Trent-iCarrier-IMP120D-chargeable/dp/B003ZBZ64Q/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1376494458&sr=1-2

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duane_bolland

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2013, 01:39:54 pm »

I'd like to add that many people shoot far more photos than needed because digital photos are essentially free.  They only time they aren't free is when you are short on power or memory.  When on a long journey with limited power, shoot like you only have 3-4 rolls of film.  Before getting out the camera, stare at the scene for a minute and ask, "Is this something I would print or sell?"  If not, enjoy the view without taking a photo.  You'll be just as happy, and you'll get just as many keepers. 

I think backing up memory cards is a waste of time while in the backwoods.  Flash memory (as used in SD cards) is quite reliable.  Yes, there are card failures but they are rare.  (And software can salvage photos from many types of failures.)  A couple years ago there was a story about a P&S that was lost off a cruise ship and was salvaged several months later from the bottom of the ocean.  The images were readable and were used to find the owner.  What are the odds that your once-in-a-lifetime shot will be lost on a failed memory card?  You are probably more likely to get hit by lightning. 
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Rhossydd

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2013, 04:27:34 pm »

I'd like to add that many people shoot far more photos than needed because digital photos are essentially free.  They only time they aren't free is when you are short on power or memory. 
These are an interesting couple of issues.

Short of memory ? That really isn't much of an issue now, especially for landscape photographers. The OP's RX1 can probably get 1000 RAWs onto a 32gb SD card cost = £20 ($30). Even if you shoot 'digitally' ie copiously, having enough cards doesn't cost much or even take up a lot of space, even if back packing.

The power issue is more complex. Ironically a bigger DSLR can probably shoot more than a small compact, no power sapping LCD screens there. My 1DsII could shoot for days and over a thousand frames on one charge when new.
There's probably a good case for compacts with optical viewfinders that can shoot without using an LCD screen to keep going longer, but that's another thread really.
As the OP says, experience allows you to optimise your settings and shooting methods to maximise battery life. Then may be just add some cheap clone spare batteries and you should be able to keep going for quite a long time.
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When on a long journey with limited power, shoot like you only have 3-4 rolls of film.  Before getting out the camera, stare at the scene for a minute and ask, "Is this something I would print or sell?"  If not, enjoy the view without taking a photo. You'll be just as happy, and you'll get just as many keepers. 
Not so convinced about this.
It took me a long time to get out of the old 'don't waste film/money/resources' film attitude. As a result I find the freedom of guilt free digital shooting has dramatically increased by success(keeper) rate. I still find my best shot is usually the first of any sequence of a particular subject, but I wouldn't want to lose all the shots that got better after the first exposure. Sometimes the subsequent images aren't always 'keepers' but serve to remind me of the the original inspiration and help remind how I can optimise the best image in PP.
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Telecaster

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2013, 06:54:38 pm »

I use one of the current Colorspace Hyperdrive gizmos. When out & about I backup my cards to it then access the pics with my iPad over WiFi for quick & dirty in-situ processing. I've never had an SD or CF card fail in-camera, though an early CF fritzed out while I was copying a firmware update to it from my 'puter. That was over a decade ago. Still, sometimes things go wrong and it's good to play it safe.

-Dave-
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duane_bolland

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2013, 03:58:51 pm »

It took me a long time to get out of the old 'don't waste film/money/resources' film attitude. As a result I find the freedom of guilt free digital shooting has dramatically increased by success(keeper) rate.

Let me say up front that I do occasionally "spray and pray", but I really hate doing it.  I do it mostly at concerts and such where random luck plays a large roll in getting a great image.  IMHO, photography should be about capturing the "decisive moment" and I believe that part of our job is recognizing that moment right before it happens.  And with landscape photography, magic light can last for several minutes or hours so it's not like the "decisive moment" is fleeting.  Every great photographer from the film era had to conserve film and choose the best moments.  Trying to mimic that behavior in my life makes me happier, but your mileage may vary. 

The obvious solution to the OP's questions are "lots of batteries and lots of memory cards".  I was simply suggesting that there are other options.  Sometimes less is more.  Cheers.
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KirbyKrieger

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2013, 06:07:38 pm »

{ ... } but your mileage may vary. 

The obvious solution to the OP's questions are "lots of batteries and lots of memory cards".  I was simply suggesting that there are other options.  Sometimes less is more.  Cheers.

As the OP, summing up: "Lots of batteries and lots of memory cards" is, in fact, the solution.

It may be a little less expensive to carry, instead of "lots of batteries" a large battery that can recharge the camera batteries (a distinct possibility with the RX1/R, as it can be charged over USB), or one of the solar collectors/chargers, or both.

Despite the availability of powerless (and low-powered) in-the-field data back-up devices, I have concluded that the simplest and most reliable strategy is to rely on the memory cards themselves.  I still wish the camera I use would write the same file to two cards at once.

Storage capacity, as Rhossydd points out, is categorically not an issue.  Cards are cheap, capacious, and weigh, in effect, zero.

On my next camping trip I am going to take enough _power_ to record movies.  Taking enough cards to store the recorded data is trivial.

wolfnowl

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2013, 12:41:08 am »

Goal Zero has some great stuff.  Brunton is another company: http://www.brunton.com/pages/power & http://www.bythom.com/solar.htm
There's also PowerFilm solar: http://store.sundancesolar.com/porosepoposo.html

Mike.

P.S. If you're carrying/ using any AA batteries look into something like the Sanyo Eneloop XX - regular NiCads will discharge even if you don't use them; these don't, or at least only to a very small degree. http://www.us.sanyo.com/eneloop

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Rhossydd

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2013, 04:04:07 am »

Let me say up front that I do occasionally "spray and pray", but I really hate doing it. 
That's a pretty derogatory term and implies a laziness that isn't an automatic result of shooting more images.
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IMHO, photography should be about capturing the "decisive moment" and I believe that part of our job is recognizing that moment right before it happens. 
And with landscape photography, magic light can last for several minutes or hours so it's not like the "decisive moment" is fleeting. 
Actually that 'decisive moment' in landscape photography can be very fleeting. A shaft of sunlight might only happen for less than a minute or even less in fast moving skies. A bird flying in just the right spot might be good on the first shot, but be positioned even better a minute later. You really can't predict or control this sort of situation, so the ability to shoot freely allow you to really catch as perfect a moment as you see.
I've shot a lot inside medieval cathedrals. It's impossible to see what's happening outside, so good lighting has to be grabbed whenever it's happening, you really can't predict that things will get any better and if they do, you just need to be able to shoot again.
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Sometimes less is more.
and often less is less.

Digital photography has released us from the tyranny of frame counting, let's not suggest throwing that benefit away.
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nairb

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Re: Doing well without power.
« Reply #18 on: August 28, 2013, 02:29:19 pm »

Here's an interesting article about Goal 0 products and how the type of panel they use may not be the most suitable to conditions found when trekking.

http://www.modernoutpost.com/promotions/better-than-Goal_Zero.html
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