Nikon PC E 3,5/24 mm- worses shift lens ever made or wrong centered?

[RomanN.]

Hi,
I tested now a Nikon PC-E 24mm on a Nikon d800 and the quality is a big catastropy!
I am really shocked. the edges are soft and not sharp even at 11. By  shifting the edges are bad, bad, bad- it can not be worse.
Even the old Canon 24 mm would be great lens compered with this, and this was a very poor lens compered with 24 mm II.
My quastion is: is the lens so bad or is Nikons lensproduction- end controll so bad.
Is here somebody who send the lens to nikon to service/center the lens? Do Nikon this or is the service as poor as this lens?
I dont want to buy so much kopies of the lens till I find a one that could be useble. What is your experiance with Nikon service?

[BernardLanguillier]

There is probably something wrong with your copy it would seem. My 24mm ts is outstanding on the D800.

It is clearly a bit weak in coners when shifted to the max, but a great lens otherwise.

Cheers,
Bernard

[kers]

my copy says -
you need d9-d11 to get a planar surface sharp... it has a field curvature
at d5,6  it is very very sharp in the center. One of my sharpest lenses.
It is a very good macro lens - also shifted- stitched- use d16
if you use it for architecture shifted - use d9- d11 and check the whole  image at this aperture in live view- choose a compromise and it will be very good.
so not a bad lens at all - could be better for sure- but worth the 1600 euro. ( since it is in fact a 24mm MDF lens at a low price)

[JeffKohn]

My 24mm ts is outstanding on the D800. It is clearly a bit weak in coners when shifted to the max, but a great lens otherwise.

IMHO the 45 & 85 PC-E's are outstanding, the 24 is merely good (but definitely not bad). I thought more highly of it when used with D300.  On full frame it only has about 8mm of useable shift on the long axis of the sensor, because the edge of the image circle deteriorates quite a bit.

There does seem to be a bit of a learning curve to getting the best possible results with the 24 due to field curvature and distortion (the latter of which can be somewhat tricky to correct if you're using shifts).

[BernardLanguillier]

IMHO the 45 & 85 PC-E's are outstanding, the 24 is merely good (but definitely not bad). I thought more highly of it when used with D300.  On full frame it only has about 8mm of useable shift on the long axis of the sensor, because the edge of the image circle deteriorates quite a bit.

Yes, indeed.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Rob C]

In effect (and it grieves me to conclude this, being a life-long Nikon user), it sucks?

I used to have a 35mm Nikon PC lens many years ago and thought it very good for all the jobs I'd used it on, and recently I thought about getting another (having once briefly traded away all my 35mm gear!) to replace it. So, I scanned a few shots I'd thought good, and they were terrible! I forgot about that lens and now have a used 2/35mm AIS instead. No shifts, but perhaps it might be fun.

Rob C

[Paul2660]

Based on comments on this site and others, I was hoping that the current Nikon 24 TS-E would work for me.  I tried 3 different lenses, 2 from B&H and 1 from a local shop.  The 2 from B&H were both visibly off on the left side of the frame non shifted.  The one from the local shop was the closest, but it still had pretty harsh fall off when shifted.  I also had a very strange vignetting on the 3rd example such that I really only could use about 9mm of the shifted image. 

The issue of tilt and shift no being in the same plane also bothered me.  I realize you can "send" the lens off to Nikon, but IMO this should be standard.

I also did found the fact that the aperture had to be controlled only by the ring on the lens a bit odd.  I may have not been working the lens correctly, but I was only able to change aperture with the lens ring, not with the camera.

Coming from Canon and the new 24 TS-E II, I decided to wait to see what Nikon would come out with in future designs.  I am also on the list for the Samyang 24 TS-E.  If it's as good as the 14mm, then it may be a keeper. 

I am sure that there are good versions of the lens out there, however after 3 different versions, I gave up for now. 

Paul Caldwell

[JeffKohn]

I also had a very strange vignetting on the 3rd example such that I really only could use about 9mm of the shifted image. 

Using full shift on the long axis of the sensor will show vignetting, but with a good copy it shouldn't show at 9mm.

The issue of tilt and shift no being in the same plane also bothered me.  I realize you can "send" the lens off to Nikon, but IMO this should be standard.

It's actually a pretty easy DIY (there's a pictorial guide on the net somewhere), but only for the 24. The 45/85 need to be switched by Nikon. I do wish the two axes were not fixed and could be rotated like on the newer Canons.

I also did found the fact that the aperture had to be controlled only by the ring on the lens a bit odd.  I may have not been working the lens correctly, but I was only able to change aperture with the lens ring, not with the camera.

Turning the ring all the way past smallest aperture will allow camera control of the f/stop.

I am curious about the new Samyang 24 tilt/shift.

[drb]

I don't have the PC-E 24mm although I have used one in the past.  I do have the 45mm PC-E and had the 85mm PC-E.  Nikon definitely has quality control issues with these lenses and from my experience with their lenses in general.  The first copy of the 45mm PC-E I sent back (the tilt marking on each side of the lens didn't agree with each other), and two copies I tried of the 85mm PC-E I sent back (the first copy was showed a serious asymmetry).  One way you can test for asymmetry is to rotate the lenses on it's axis (the lens has this control on its mount) and see if the softness switches to the other side of the lens.

I'm also on the list for the Samyang so hopefully that will work out.  I want the ability to change the orientation of the shift/tilt axis.

[Quentin]

My copy is ok, with some falloff at the edges when shifted but nothing too dramatic.  Useful lens. 

An example using tilt, to keep the font in the foreground and stained glass window both sharp.

[kers]

My copy is ok, with some falloff at the edges when shifted but nothing too dramatic.  Useful lens. 
An example using tilt, to keep the font in the foreground and stained glass window both sharp.

Especially for interiors like these the lens its field curvature is a bonus... very sharp results at every distance

[stevesanacore]

I just finished a four day architectural shoot with the 24 PC-E Nikon and it was excellent. I was expecting to be disappointed as I also own the Canon TS-E lenses which are superb, but the Nikon lens was excellent on my D800E. Couldn't find a flaw with it.

[Rob C]

What are we seeing here, dreadful quality control or differing expectations and standards?

I would think: dreadful lack of final inspection allied with generally low expectations. In short, Nikon doesn't seem to think much of its punter base. There should never be any lemons amongst lenses; that's what final inspections are supposed to ensure. Of course, you need to have such a department first...

Rob C

[BernardLanguillier]

I am wondering whether some photographers wouldn't be using the lens without locking the shift/tilt dials?

This is recommended with this lens, albeit a pain since the lock dials are tiny.

Cheers,
Bernard

[rethmeier]

I have to agree with Bernard.
Make sure it's all locked before the shot.
I have all 3 PC-E  lenses as well and the 24 is certainly good enough.
W

[stevesanacore]

It would be interesting to hear if those who are dissatisfied with the lens are locking the tilt/shift dials.

I always lock shift lenses although the the Nikon lens, is very hard to lock down in the shift axis. That little finger torture locking knob is extremely hard to use, but it does work if your really careful. If it's not locked very tight, there is some slop in the mount. I also wonder how exact the swing axis is even when locked. It may have some slop which would really create havoc on sharpness across the field. Shift lenses really have to be overbuilt to be great, as the new Canon TS-E's are. But like I said in an earlier post, the Nikon 24 PC-E I used this week was excellent.

[RomanN.]

Thanks a lot for so much informations!
I gave my bad copy lens back and purchased now a used one, that was really cheap and the owner promised me good quality- as this lens could be....
What make me very disappoited and very angry is the way that traditional high Quality Producer like Nikon treat us- I mean professional users.
This lens as every shift-tilt lenses is a professional line lens, that must have high standart of end control. As we can see Nikons end control is bad or not existent. Maybe it is the foult of us- of the users, that we dont protest in official way and complain about it. I think in this way Nikon could loose his reputation and this would be a good pressure to the company.
I have read much information about experiance with this lens, so much people complain or use this lens only , becouse there is no alternative, but they are not really happy with it. It seems not to be a problem with this lens itself but a problem of end control, of very exactly monting of the lenselements One example: one guy from Gemany complain about the bad quality, send the lens to nikon service and get the stupid standart answer that the lens quality is OK and the mistakes are normal. He made really presure on Nikon and at the end he could send the lens for second time. Tis time the lens was serviced in the right way, that means the glasses were centered new. The guy get a perfect lens, as it should be at the beginning! So you see-the problem is the Nikon service. I made one time my experience with Nikon service with my scanner some years ago and i thought it was an exeption....
Anyway I have some years experiences with shift lenses, with all Canon TS-E, old and new, Schneider PC 28 mm and 120 shift lenses from Pentax, Mamiya, Schneider ( not to mention large format lenses, but this is an other story). I know how they should perform, I never expect the Nikon 24 mm as good as Canon 24 mm II, but the copy that I had was years after the the poor Canon 24 mm Version 1. Not to compere with the Schneider PC 28 mm- made in 80/90 ties- the schneider is not perfect, but compered with Nikon a dream.
I will give Nikon last chance with the lens that I purchased now, if the lens is also so poor I will contact Nikon officially and make they reaction or answer public.

[kers]

Do not forget the lens was made in a 12 MP era....
The Canon was made in the 21 MP era...
And now we test it in a 36MP era..
For sure a new 24MM PCE lens from Nikon would be a good idea and i suspect it to be about 2500 € at least.

[Rob C]

kers, I hope your price guess(?) is mistaken. I still fancy a good 24mm shifter (tilt doesn't concern me much) and as I, too, have said before so many times, it's totally unacceptable that the customer is the de facto final quality control in the whole process. Such a philosophy is an insult to the buyer. Were I able to start again, I'd buy a Canon and their 24mm lens, if only because I haven't read as many bad reports about either.

Rob C

[RomanN.]

It doesnt matter, when the lens was produced. The S. Angulon PC 28 mm that I used was made in 80- ties, at that time digital technik does not exist! and this lens is much, much better that this Nikon. I also use now 30-40 years old Mamiya 645 shift lens on the nikon d800 and it works good. The nikon lens is the same genaration as Canon 24 mm II, has so called Nano couting- whatever it is. So it should be a superior lens.