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Author Topic: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C  (Read 2381 times)

Kumar

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mac_paolo

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2012, 06:28:30 am »

Please post the plain text, if you can.
I don't have access to that platform. :)
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Pics2

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2012, 07:25:09 am »

Please post the plain text, if you can.
I don't have access to that platform. :)
PAYPAL = better check this out on change of terms & conditions
->> I hope this is relevant for some people. Do you use Paypal at all? If you do, Paypal has just updated their terms of use to state that you no longer have the option to sue them in court and are not allowed to participate in any form of class action lawsuit against them unless you write a letter opting out of that clause in their agreement by December 1st. The form below can be used as a template to fill out and mail to Paypal to opt out of this portion of their Terms of Use. I HIGHLY recommend everyone pass this around and make as many people aware of it as possible if you value your rights as a user of their services. You can find Paypal's new Terms of Use under the Notifications section on the right hand side of the page after you have logged in. The section of reference is 14.3.



MONTH __, 2012


PayPal, Inc.
Attn: Litigation Department
2211 North First Street
San Jose, CA 95131

Re: Opt-out Notice

To Whom It May Concern:

I do not agree to the Agreement to Arbitrate. By this letter, I am opting out of the Agreement to Arbitrate, including the prohibition on class actions, as authorized by paragraph 14.3.e of the PayPal User Agreement. This opt-out applies to the following PayPal accounts:

Email(s):
[list the email address(es) associated with your PayPal account(s)]

Sincerely,

[sign here]

YOUR NAME
YOUR ADDRESS
YOUR TELEPHONE NUMBER




->> Here is the relevant portions of the new terms of use related to this:

14.3 Agreement to Arbitrate. You and PayPal each agree that any and all disputes or claims that have arisen or may arise between you and PayPal shall be resolved exclusively through final and binding arbitration, rather than in court, except that you may assert claims in small claims court, if your claims qualify. The Federal Arbitration Act governs the interpretation and enforcement of this Agreement to Arbitrate.

a. Prohibition of Class and Representative Actions and Non-Individualized Relief.

YOU AND PAYPAL AGREE THAT EACH OF US MAY BRING CLAIMS AGAINST THE OTHER ONLY ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS AND NOT AS A PLAINTIFF OR CLASS MEMBER IN ANY PURPORTED CLASS OR REPRESENTATIVE ACTION OR PROCEEDING. UNLESS BOTH YOU AND PAYPAL AGREE OTHERWISE, THE ARBITRATOR MAY NOT CONSOLIDATE OR JOIN MORE THAN ONE PERSON'S OR PARTY'S CLAIMS AND MAY NOT OTHERWISE PRESIDE OVER ANY FORM OF A CONSOLIDATED, REPRESENTATIVE, OR CLASS PROCEEDING. ALSO, THE ARBITRATOR MAY AWARD RELIEF (INCLUDING MONETARY, INJUNCTIVE, AND DECLARATORY RELIEF) ONLY IN FAVOR OF THE INDIVIDUAL PARTY SEEKING RELIEF AND ONLY TO THE EXTENT NECESSARY TO PROVIDE RELIEF NECESSITATED BY THAT PARTY'S INDIVIDUAL CLAIM(S). ANY RELIEF AWARDED CANNOT AFFECT OTHER PAYPAL USERS.

e. Opt-Out Procedure.

You can choose to reject this Agreement to Arbitrate ("opt out") by mailing us a written opt-out notice ("Opt-Out Notice"). For new PayPal users, the Opt-Out Notice must be postmarked no later than 30 Days after the date you accept the User Agreement for the first time. If you are already a current PayPal user and previously accepted the User Agreement prior to the introduction of this Agreement to Arbitrate, the Opt-Out Notice must be postmarked no later than December 1, 2012. You must mail the Opt-Out Notice to PayPal, Inc., Attn: Litigation Department, 2211 North First Street, San Jose, CA 95131.

The Opt-Out Notice must state that you do not agree to this Agreement to Arbitrate and must include your name, address, phone number, and the email address(es) used to log in to the PayPal account(s) to which the opt-out applies. You must sign the Opt-Out Notice for it to be effective. This procedure is the only way you can opt out of the Agreement to Arbitrate. If you opt out of the Agreement to Arbitrate, all other parts of the User Agreement, including all other provisions of Section 14 (Disputes with PayPal), will continue to apply. Opting out of this Agreement to Arbitrate has no effect on any previous, other, or future arbitration agreements that you may have with us.

f. Future Changes to the Agreement to Arbitrate.

Notwithstanding any provision in the User Agreement to the contrary, you and we agree that if we make any change to this Agreement to Arbitrate (other than a change to any notice address or website link provided herein) in the future, that change shall not apply to any claim that was filed in a legal proceeding against PayPal prior to the effective date of the change. Moreover, if we seek to terminate the Agreement to Arbitrate as included in the User Agreement, any such termination shall not be effective until 30 days after the version of the User Agreement not containing the Agreement to Arbitrate is posted to http://www.paypal.com, and shall not be effective as to any claim that was filed in a legal proceeding against PayPal prior to the effective date of termination.



While you are at it, better check EBAY as well.

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/...html#arbitrate

->> Ebay has included a similar arbitration clause in their new terms of use as well. Here is their opt-out information:
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/...html#arbitrate


eBay Inc.
c/o National Registered Agents, Inc.
2778 W. Shady Bend Lane
Lehi, UT 84043


5.Opt-Out Procedure

You can choose to reject this Agreement to Arbitrate ("opt-out") by mailing us a written opt-out notice ("Opt-Out Notice"). For new eBay users, the Opt-Out Notice must be postmarked no later than 30 days after the date you accept the User Agreement for the first time. If you are already a current eBay user and previously accepted the User Agreement prior to the introduction of this Agreement to Arbitrate, the Opt-Out Notice must be postmarked no later than November 9, 2012 . You must mail the Opt-Out Notice to eBay Inc., c/o National Registered Agents, Inc., 2778 W. Shady Bend Lane, Lehi, UT 84043.


The Opt-Out Notice must state that you do not agree to this Agreement to Arbitrate and must include your name, address, and the user ID(s) and email address(es) associated with the eBay account(s) to which the opt-out applies. You must sign the Opt-Out Notice for it to be effective. This procedure is the only way you can opt-out of the Agreement to Arbitrate. If you opt-out of the Agreement to Arbitrate, all other parts of the User Agreement and its Legal Disputes Section will continue to apply to you. Opting out of this Agreement to Arbitrate has no effect on any previous, other, or future arbitration agreements that you may have with us.[/list]
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mac_paolo

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2012, 09:24:27 am »

Is it the same for European (Italian, fwiw) users?
Same address, same letter, same everything?
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Pics2

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2012, 10:42:41 am »

Is it the same for European (Italian, fwiw) users?
Same address, same letter, same everything?
"You can find Paypal's new Terms of Use under the Notifications section on the right hand side of the page after you have logged in."
I won't copy/paste anymore for you!  ;)
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mac_paolo

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2012, 10:59:56 am »

"You can find Paypal's new Terms of Use under the Notifications section on the right hand side of the page after you have logged in."
I won't copy/paste anymore for you!  ;)
Can't see anything like that on italian Paypal updates. Just minor ones.
14.3 (which wasn't changed) only tells we must obey to the english law. :D
« Last Edit: October 19, 2012, 11:02:36 am by mac_paolo »
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gdh

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2012, 01:33:41 pm »

I think pointing this out is important for everyone to know and appreciate the fact you brought it to our attention, HOWEVER, when you think about it, the arbitration agreement might be more beneficial than not. And, the last time I received anything from a class action as an automatically included party, the check wasn't enough to buy a cup of coffee at Starbucks.  Seriously, this could be to your benefit--I'm not opting out.  I'm not a fan of either paypal or ebay, believe me, but in analyzing the relatively small amounts involved in my personal business on either, arbitration is a benefit for me; not to arbitrate would make it way too expensive for the small amounts involved.  Somewhere in those agreements you originally accepted, I am sure there is a VENUE clause saying What State the action needs to be brought and what State's law applies--people from 49 states will have to file out of state or in Federal court.  Either way it will cost more in filing fees than most of my transactions, where as an arbitration agreement will actually make it easier in most cases to assert a claim against them.  As a trial attorney, I usually abhor arbitration agreements.  Medical Malpractice Insurance carriers all used to require arbitration as did many if not most doctors in California in patient agreements, but they soon found that arbitrators, if truly neutral, were more inclined to give awards than juries were and in larger amounts and soon abandoned most such agreements.  My only point here, is don't be too quick to opt out of the arbitration agreement unless your transactions are very big, because other than small claims court(only state of proper venue) it could be much more expensive to bring claims without arbitration.  What I have said here may not apply to people that have ebay stores etc--different story--I'm just talking about the small transaction people like myself.  :o

Kumar

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Re: Important changes to Paypal and eBay T&C
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2012, 01:43:29 pm »

Thanks for pointing out the pros and cons, Dennis. I posted it since the original poster on LFF asked for this information to be shared as widely as possible. I guess most people only look at the multi-million dollar claims and awards in class action suits, and forget that most of that money will go to the lawyers. I remember the Epson case a few years ago.

Kumar
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