I am looking for creative display ideas.

[JohnBrady]

I am looking for some creative ideas for displaying my landscape images.

Some background, I am a landscape photographer living in South Florida. I primarily work with a 8x10 and 5x8 wooden view camera and color film. I have my own gallery in Naples FL and show my work at about a dozen juried art shows during the winter months.

I try to control all aspects of my work, processing, scanning, printing, framing etc. I have a 52 inch Coda cold mount press that I use to adhere my images to gator board and then over mat. I currently produce framed pieces up to 4x6 feet. My favorite paper for printing my images on my Epson 9900 is Harmon gloss baryta.

I am trying to come up with a more distinctive way of finishing and presenting my images. I hate acrylic and glass because it detracts from the image. I am not a fan of canvas because I go to so much trouble to have massive amounts of detail in my images and I am afraid I will loose the high definition look that my work has. Also, many of the shows that I participate in do not allow photographers to display work on canvas.

I want my new work presented in a thick wood frame ( I currently use mat black aluminum and a white mat)

Is there any feasible option that any of you would recommend such as printing on a heavy weight paper and than coating with something that increases the d-max and protects the image? And What would you use for a backer board and how would you adhere it? Is canvas still the most logical solution?

I am looking to have framed pieces as large as 5x8 feet, I have access to a 11880 printer for this project and I have heard there are 5x8 sheets of gator board available.

I apologize for all the background Information and rambling as well as my lack of being able to articulate this better. I am hoping some of you pro's out there can give me some exciting new ideas or help point me down a path to a solution. 
Many thanks, 
John Brady
www.timeandlight.com

[Roscolo]

My workflow is similar, although I shoot 4x5, mostly B&W. I was making prints 40"x50". I was framing them behind glass. They look great but are a pain, to me AND clients. And a piece of glass that size is a great medieval weapon if it falls off the wall.

For me the solution was canvas. You may find some of your customers prefer it. I did. I use the smoothest canvas I could find that doensn't break the bank: Sunset Select Matte. No, it's not fiber gloss paper, but you may be surprised at how sharp and detailed your image is, particularly when you're printing up to the sizes you are. Someone from Lexjet referred me to a fabric, not a canvas, that he said was even smoother for photo repro than canvas, but stretches just like canvas, but I never got too far into it because I decided the canvas was right for me. Once the canvas is sprayed, it is safe from the scrapes and scratches that I'm sure you've found your mounted prints are susceptible to unless they are behind glass.

I still do work on other papers. Some folks laminate their papers. I hate that look. I've had the big pieces framed behind glass in juried shows, and canvas pieces in juried shows. Any show that would restrict an artist from printing on canvas or any other material that artist chooses to produce his/her work, I would avoid. Those same shows used to exclude prints made on your Epson. Before that they excluded digital cameras. Before that they likely excluded color photographs. Before that they were called painter snobs and they excluded photography altogether. Yes, the work behind glass looks outstanding on the wall, but everything is a pain. Framing, transport, hanging, disassembly are all just a drop away from a few thousand dollar loss. Folks hanging the show seem to prefer the canvas over the glass for the same reasons I do. It's much easier to handle and hang and it's not going to kill someone (or the artwork) if they drop it.

[JohnBrady]

Thanks for taking the time to reply Roscolo!

I have printed on several different canvas brands when a client requests it. It's still not my favorite media for a number of reasons. I love the idea of using canvas, durability, weight, mounting options etc. my goal is to come up with something outside the norm.

I would love to find a canvas type product that was smooth, but still prints well. I tried to research the fabric you mentioned from lexjet, but everything I saw on their site looks more like advertising and display material. I will call my rep there and inquire.

I didn't mention in my last post but I need to stay archival with whatever solution I come up with.

[dgberg]

No trade secrets given away here just a couple of ideas.
Geese shot is canvas mounted to Dibond with print mount ultra then over laminated with print guard luster.
The second shot is a print center mounted on brushed aluminum dibond with custom side frames from the same material.
The back shots are several options for hanging.
Archival? Now thats a tough one. Archival inks,sure.
Everything is adhesive mounted and laminated.
I would put that term back in the closet at least for this type of work,I have.

[Roscolo]

John, I THINK the product that was referred to me by Lexjet is the Water-Resistant Satin Cloth. I foolishly never got a sample, but this thread has me thinking about it again. Seems like maybe they didn't have a sample and I didn't want to gamble on a whole roll of the stuff. If you find something please post what you find here. I would love to find a stretchable canvas or fabric with a smooth surface that would rival paper.

[bill t.]

Fredrix 777 is quite smooth, it could arguably even pass for a fine art paper.  It's also thin and flexible which makes it a good choice for wrapping around the sides of panels in glue-mounting situations.  Last time I used it was more than a year ago, I hope it hasn't changed too much since then.

[JohnBrady]

Thanks for some very nice examples Dan, and thank you all for the additional advice.

I did some more experimenting today, I printed up one of my images on a very heavy watercolor mat paper. Then I spray coated the image with a gloss varnish. After that I cold mounted it to a piece of gator board.

I think this may be the start of the direction I would like to go, I was really happy with the look and feel of the textured mat paper once varnished.

So a couple more questions, do any of you have experience with a similar system for finished framed pieces done this way without glazing?

Do you think spraying Glamour II would be the right product or is there something better for this purpose?

Would you adhere it to gator board or use something else?

Would you use miracle muck to mount to backer or are there pitfalls with using a product like this with Matt paper?

Thanks again for all the help, it's nice to be able to lean on a community like this for help!

[dgberg]

Here are two more, both printed on fine art papers.
Pretty sure it was Epson hot press.
Sky pano is mounted to 1/2" gatorboard with print mount adhesive then sprayed with 2 coats of Clearstar FA. Ready to put in a frame.
The b&w image is mounted to the 3/4" multiply with the same print mount adhesive. It also has 2 coats of the Clearstar FA a solvent finish.
I make my own multiply panels from 4 x 8' sheets as that is easy work for a cabinetmaker.
Just cut to size on table saw. Sand all four edges on the edge sander. Spray the back and edges with catalized varnish. Ready for print mounting.
 The 1/2" multiply works great for my panos and is a much lighter finished product.
I use Glamor II and Miracle Muck but only on canvas.
You can buy gatorboard with an adhesive already applied.
 I use Bainbridge Adhesive Mounting foamboards but only for the 8 1/2 x 11" and under sizes.

[dgberg]

John,
Just saw your gallery,very nice. Your work rivals Clyde Butcher's.
Pretty hard to improve on those mounts.

PS.
I was born and raised in Lancaster County. We will have to talk.

[JohnBrady]

Thanks Dan! I have been fortunate to work with Clyde a fair amount, we are working together on a project in North Florida. He has definitely influenced my work.

[framah]

I didn't mention in my last post but I need to stay archival with whatever solution I come up with.

That horse left the barn as soon as you  glued the image to gatorboard. No gatorboard is "archival" and neither is any adhesive method of attaching it to the gatorboard.

[bill t.]

But if a piece doesn't sell, and I store it in the archives, that makes it archival, right?  Is a couple days enough?

In any case, the archives is a great place for archival art because the mere display of art is non-archival.

Does everybody here know that Miracle Muck and Lamin-All mounted prints can be easily removed?

[framah]

Groan!!

[Ray R]

I have started using aluminium composite and MDF, and I have been trying to find a way to hang them.
I have tried using picture wire and wood. As in the first photo, and then I came across the idea in the diagram.

It can be one piece of wood, cut at an angle as shown.

I have seen it used but not tried it myself (yet), but having a power saw, I think it will be a lot less messing about than before.

I print onto canvas and paper for the image, and used Breathing Color Timeless Matte. I have some Gloss which I will be trying soon.

I then use a sheet adhesive to stick the print to the backing.

I have tried PVA glue with the MDF but find it easier to use the sheet.

[framah]

Your diagram is called pinch cleating. Long used in the exhibit business for hanging the pictures of products that have to hang on the wall of the booth and still be removable.

Also used alot in the framing business. You need to also put a strip of wood the same thickness at the bottom of the panel so the panel doesn't hang at an angle and possibly come of the cleat. Not so much for small pieces but the larger ones need it.

I usually make the pinch cleat about 3" shorter than the width of the panel so they don't show from the side.

[Ray R]

Yes the one I saw had the strip at the bottom.

[JohnBrady]

That horse left the barn as soon as you  glued the image to gatorboard. No gatorboard is "archival" and neither is any adhesive method of attaching it to the gatorboard.

Not looking to start a debate but according to Coda, their Cold Mount one is archival and they claim that it creates a barrier over non archival products such as Gator Board.

I am trying to keep my pieces as archival as possible, my big pieces fetch a few bucks and I don't want the images quickly deteriorating in a clients home.

[framah]

Archival really means that the piece is reversible to its original state without any harmful chemicals being imparted into the medium by the mounting method used.  Any dry mounting adhesive is not archival by its very nature of being non reversible.

You need to take what companies say about the "archivalness" of their products with a grain of salt.  Their idea of archival is that their product is acid free.

What you would like is as you said... for the art to not quickly deteriorate in their home.

Both dry mounting and gatorboard will probably outlive both of us before any noticeable effects are visible. Well... at least outlive me! Not sure how old you are.

The problem comes when, long time down the road, if your art survives and becomes a collector piece of value for its rarity as well as its beauty, then how it was treated when it was new will have an effect on its value and its longevity.

I get  old stuff in here..early 1900's... that was glued to chipboard with horse hide glue. Some of these old pieces were originally cheap prints but over time they are coveted by collectors and good money is spent on some of them. They still look ok for their age and how they were treated but would look WAY better if they hadn't been glued down with horse hide glue to chipboard.

[bill t.]

I've got silver prints glue mounted on Masonite from the 70's, and they are still in good shape as far as the mounting goes.

I also have Type R prints that were mounted on aluminum from the same time period.  By the mid 80's, they had all separated from the aluminum after a short period where some of the adhesive oozed out from the sides of the prints.

Muck and other PVA glues are a good barrier, once they are dried.  You need molecular mobility to push reactions forward, and dried glue and coating doesn't allow that except at a glacial rate.  Any water that was present either escapes or gets bound up in various reaction products which can't go anywhere.

I like it that coated, glued canvases are hermetically sealed front and back.  I can't argue from measured data, but I am willing to guess that such a hermetically sealed print is better protected from atmospheric contaminants and humidity than prints mounted using archival materials and methods.   Archivally mounted prints are still left exposed to all the respiratory and chemical crud found in ordinary interior air, which make Muck and Glamour II seem benign by comparison.

[JohnBrady]

Archival really means that the piece is reversible to its original state without any harmful chemicals being imparted into the medium by the mounting method used.  Any dry mounting adhesive is not archival by its very nature of being non reversible.

You need to take what companies say about the "archivalness" of their products with a grain of salt.  Their idea of archival is that their product is acid free.

What you would like is as you said... for the art to not quickly deteriorate in their home.

Both dry mounting and gatorboard will probably outlive both of us before any noticeable effects are visible. Well... at least outlive me! Not sure how old you are.

Sadly, won't have that far to go to outlast me either! I'm building a new studio on my property with 14 foot ceilings. I told my wife it will make a great work-out room after I'm gone, she agreed.

Thanks for a clear definition of archival, I understand your point about adhering now. I think for the size I am doing these pieces it will be my best system though.

My goal is always to produce the highest quality finished product that I can.