Continual dark prints on Epson 7800/7900

[Mcthecat]

Hi all, my first ever post on this excellent web site.

I used to always get dark prints so i did this....

My room is now a dark room, no light streaming through the window, i use a very heavy curtain to block out the light.
Monitor calibrated with a Colormunki. Bit expensive but its excellent and so easy to use.
Printer. Used to use Epson, moved to Canon. A delight to use, printer head so easy to change if needed but my Epson was ok. Bought my paper from a top company, Permajet, in the UK.

Now the important bit. I was informed there was a problem profiling through later versions of photoshop leading to dark prints. Went on the Adobe web site, downloaded free their Adobe Color Utility.
Got the free A3 colour patches from my paper supplier. Printed the profiles through the utility, not through photoshop. Try to match the closest type of paper to what you use i.e my paper Permajet Oyster is a lustre, a sort of semi gloss so my Canon has in its preferances a semi gloss setting. Ensure you turn off any adjustments in your Epson preferances to no color adjustment when you print the profiles. This is very important.

Sent the profiles of to my paper supplier. E-mailed me the profiles, installed with the touch of a mouse.

Then, went on EBAY. Bought a GRAPHICLITE PDV professional desk top viewer, the D50. This has a light source producing light at 5200 k normal daylight. Cost was very cheap, got it at a steal.

So when i now print, i print through photoshop, using the profile supplied, print first a tiny print, let it dry, view it in my light box, maybe do a very small adjustments and they all come out bang on.

Few, that was difficult. Better finish my bottle of wine and a few beers. Queens diamond jubilee today so any excuse for a few beers. Burp! Long live Liz and Phil. Got an extra day of work.

Mick

[benmar]

Randal, just checking - are you using 2.2 as your gamma choice when profiling your display not 1.8?

[randal21]

I am using gamma 2.2. Prints still dark even after a lower lumionance setting and viewing in a lighter area. Monitor matches artwork but print = darker. I beleive it's more to do with the Apple OSX handling of the file as my printer profile target guy said. Would love to solve it as  I give enough $ to Epson!

[Johnny_Boy]

What rendering intent are you using? Relative colormetric or perceptual? The latter will generally print brighter.

Can you also post the histogram of your image? Is it a bell curve with the hump in the middle of is the hump more on the left?

[randal21]

Ihave used relative colormetric for years as recommended by alot of photographers. Most of my histogram curves have the hump in the middle. Sometimes not. Then what do you do?

[Johnny_Boy]

Did you tell us how brightly you are lighting up the original painting? 5000K only tells us that it will match the color, but it will not tell us whether the brightness will match. What bulb at what wattage and how close it the light source from the painting?

I have a feeling that you are under lighting the painting. dark images on your monitors will tend to print way darker than balanced image on monitors printed.

(Also, try to print using a level adjustment on your image in photoshop, where you change the output level on the dark side by +20. This seems to work well for me for images that come out darker than usual)

[benmar]

Making some prints without using your custom paper/printer profiles might shed some light.  Is there a stock or "canned" profile from the paper manufacturer available for your printer/paper that you can print with and compare? Also, are you able to make a print using the "Printer Manages Colors" (rather than "Photoshop Manages Color") setting, and turning color management on in the color management part of the printer driver?  I'm wondering if there is something amiss with the printer/paper profiles you had made.

[randal21]

I always light the art work I am trying to match. I let Photoshop manage the color and use Epson profiles for the paper I use. Actually, I have not had this customized targets/profiles for this new printer (7900). It was such a hassle trying to zero in on the 7800 targets with someone who finally blamed the non matching to the Apple OSX. I scan most things with my Epson 1000xl and maybe my settings shift the colors? I choose no color correction with my scanner configuration. Even if a hi rez image is provided I still get stinkin DARK PRINTS! 

[elolaugesen]

Thanks guys. I calibrated my monitor (Lacie 324) this morning with a 90 luminance rather than the suggested PSE120 for LCD. It calibrated within a tight range. As I relook at my print from Digital Dog the print is still darker. When I manually lower my brightness it still is not as dark as the print. So now what? Do I keep lowering the luminance as I recalibrate? I had an imac a few years ago and it was way to bright to get within range so I sold it. I am using Photoshop CS4 and Mac OS 10.5.8    Are there alot of MAc owners out there who print on Epson printers who don't have dark print problems?

I know there are some out there who do not like what I am going to say but I too had problems with dark/saturated prints. 

There was a combination of OSX 10.5.8   Photoshop 4/PSE4/6 and some Epson print drivers that caused dark/saturated prints.      With the OSX 10.5.8 , Epson Drivers and PSE8 I had no problems.

Adobe admitted they had a problem with double coloured management in their latest software because of the changing apple Colorsync environment and recommended letting the printer manage colours instead of photoshop.

 It worked.    I moved on to Snow Leopard and had no problems.




Try to print using photoshop option printer manages colours as Benmar suggested  and see what the results are. (it may not be easy for force the right printer profile instead of epson's default profiles.  but it is possible.

[randal21]

"There was a combination of OSX 10.5.8   Photoshop 4/PSE4/6 and some Epson print drivers that caused dark/saturated prints.      With the OSX 10.5.8 , Epson Drivers and PSE8 I had no problems.

Adobe admitted they had a problem with double coloured management in their latest software because of the changing apple Colorsync environment and recommended letting the printer manage colours instead of photoshop.

 It worked.    I moved on to Snow Leopard and had no problems.




Try to print using photoshop option printer manages colours as Benmar suggested  and see what the results are. (it may not be easy for force the right printer profile instead of epson's default profiles.  but it is possible."


I think you are on to the real root of the problem. I did this a long time ago with my 7800. I just printed a piece I am proofing and still dark with some color shift. Maybe making the Snow Leopard jump and updating plugins is the answer. Appreciate it. May also try printing out of CS5 to see if it changes.