harassed on the streets of Toronto

[FrankG]

I enjoy walkabouts in the city and doing candid 'street' pics. I am often stopped by security guards (employed by the big corporate buildongs) & questioned and told to not do so on their premises, even it's outdoors in a very 'public' plaza type of space. Anyone else experiencing this in Toronto - what are our rights?
(is there a better forum to post this?)

[Dennishh]

I found this which might help. I also have been harassed many times from government workers to shop owners. I carry a copy of this and give it to those people. It might be out of date but still seems to work. Harassment goes both ways. I try to talk it out in most cases always trying to turn the discussion around to how much they really need photography that I can provide, have gotten a couple of jobs and some free tickets.  http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm

[FrankG]

Thanks for this. Great.
Does anyone know of anything specific to Canada ?

[RFPhotography]

It's happened to be twice and at the same complex both times - Commerce Court.  Once was inside the courtyard area, once was on the steps in front of CCW.  The time inside the courtyard I was allowed to stay, the other I wasn't.  Not a big deal.  There are plenty of other shots available.  You'll waste more time arguing with the cop wannabe's and lose more shots than you will if you just move along.  I know some will say I'm advocating capitulating or giving in and that's fine.  But there are enough other shots available that I really don't need to bother.  The only other time I was stopped, I was trying to set up a tripod inside BCE Place.  That's understandable. 

[RSL]

Frank, From his post I'd guess Dennis is wondering whether or not the stuff in Bert Krages little sheet is out of date. No it's not -- not in the United States. The rights Krages talks about in that sheet are embedded in the U.S. Constitution. But you're in Canada. You'd need to check with a Canadian lawyer.

[Dennishh]

Frank, From his post I'd guess Dennis is wondering whether or not the stuff in Bert Krages little sheet is out of date. No it's not -- not in the United States. The rights Krages talks about in that sheet are embedded in the U.S. Constitution. But you're in Canada. You'd need to check with a Canadian lawyer.

Thanks for the update. I just had another run in and used the Bert piece, the guy who was harassing me almost had a bird when I told him I was going to call the police about his public harassment.

[OliviaK]

This happened to me as well, although I planned to do a fashion shooting. Some security guards told me we were not allowed to take pictures there because it's forbidden although it was a public place (in front of a museum). I don't know if he was right or if he was joking with us but it was weird for me.

[Dennishh]

I don't think the Museum security guard can tell you to do anything if you're on public property. The problem comes when you're doing a commercial shoot on public property you need a permit. That's unless it's a fun shoot or portfolio shoot for you then you don't need anything.

[RFPhotography]

Stop trying to play lawyer. 

[Dennishh]

Stop trying to play lawyer. 

OK Mommy, is that the most help you can offer?

[Tim Gray]

I've been "kicked off"  TD Centre, Commerce Court, Mt. Pleasant Cemetery, BCE Place (but here only when using a tripod) but in all cases I was photographing on what is technically private property, so the only option is to shoot from the sidewalk.   I still shoot at TD Centre etc. but move fairly quickly so they don't have time to come out.   I've also shot quite a bit at Eaton centre, and have been approached a couple of times by security, but only because they were curious - I was never told I couldn't shoot there - so it's a matter of what policy the property owner has.  Also they allow photography in most parts of the ROM.

[RFPhotography]

is that the most help you can offer?

Since I actually went to law school, I could probably offer more help.  Since I actually live in Ontario, Canada I could probably offer more help.  But since I'm (a) not licensed to practice law and (b) not stupid enough to dispense legal advice on the internet even if I were licensed, I'll refrain.

Tim, interesting about TD.  I shot a timelapse segment at Bay/King from the top of the steps of the TD building on the SW corner, which is technically TD property, and never was approached at all.  I think it really does come down to whether the rent-a-cops have anything better to do at the moment or how lazy the particular ones on duty are.  I'd like to say it could be that they actually used their brains and thought 'he's not bothering anything so it's not a problem' but that may be taking it too far. 

[Farmer]

Sheesh - no one's trying to play lawyer. This is a discussion forum.  People are discussing.  Dennishh said, "I think..." and offered an opinion, not legal advice.

[mjdl]

Canadian laws affecting photography are nicely summarized at http://ambientlight.ca/laws/ with the disclaimer

"Disclaimer http://ambientlight.ca/laws/disclaimer-and-revision-history/

    This is not legal advice.
    I am not a lawyer.
    This is simply my interpretation of the laws surrounding photography.
    Information and Links are provided as-is, with no warranty, neither stated, nor implied.
    The laws that are applicable to you may vary by city, province and country.
    Not every law will apply to you, depending on your location and the type of photography you do, and there may be others that I have not discovered yet."

The pages were last updated in early 2011.

There are other Internet pages about Canadian laws & photography. A Delicious search for Canada law photography will turn up a few more.