CR2 and JPEG colors

[shacharoren79]

hello everyone,

i've been working with LR for a while now and using 3.6

i'm shotting RAW+Jpeg and when importing i use jpeg and raw as seperate files.

now i understand that colors are very different, but,

i'm trying to match the CR2 from my Canon 5D Mark 2 to the jpeg with no luck!

i have tried using the "profile" menu in the "camera calibration section but again no luck.

i have also tried manipulating every single slider combination (allmost) and again, no good result.

is there a good fast and useful way of achieving a match between the raw and the jpeg?!

thanks much,


shachar oren.

[Rand47]

hello everyone,

i've been working with LR for a while now and using 3.6

i'm shotting RAW+Jpeg and when importing i use jpeg and raw as separate files.

now i understand that colors are very different, but,

i'm trying to match the CR2 from my Canon 5D Mark 2 to the jpeg with no luck!

i have tried using the "profile" menu in the "camera calibration section but again no luck.

i have also tried manipulating every single slider combination (almost) and again, no good result.

is there a good fast and useful way of achieving a match between the raw and the jpeg?!

thanks much,


shachar oren.

I'm going to guess the reason you've not received a response is because your question reveals a lack of understanding.
Let me take a stab at an answer, and then offer some advice.  The simple reason your processed RAW files don't look as good as the out-of-camera jpegs is simply because you don't know what you're doing.  I don't mean that to be offensive, it is just obvious on the face of it.  I think that may be why you've not received an answer here because many of us are thinking, "Where would we start trying to explain?"

So, the best advice I can offer is to recommend that you spend some money right here on this web site (I'm not affiliated in any way).
Purchase two tutorials.  The first being "From Camera to Print & Screen."  It will give you a very broad exposure to working with digital files, and making good quality prints.  It may overwhelm you at first, but watch the whole thing a few times and it will begin to make sense.  Second, buy the Lightroom 4 "complete" tutorials both intro and advanced (and upgrade from 3.6 to LR4).  After watching and applying what you learn to your post processing attempts if you're still loving your jpegs better than what you can produce in Lightroom, you may be the target person that the in-camera jpeg process was invented for.  And I truly mean no offense in that.  There are some photographers, even professionals, who have deadlines, time lines, and "end-purposes" that make out-of-camera jpegs a god-send.  Others don't care to get involved in processing their images and find jpegs "plenty good enough."  On this web site you mostly find us "obsessed" types who are constantly trying to wring the last n-th degree of image quality from our digital files, and/or who are obsessed with the creative possibilities that "being in full control of the process" brings (along w/ all the headaches!).

Learning to use any good quality post processing software to process RAW files "should" allow you to pull a much better product from your work, and allow greater flexibility in interpreting the image as you've seen it in your mind and not the mind of the folk who created the jpeg processing.

Best of luck . . .

[Walter Schulz]

I'm wondering, too. Why on earth do you want to process RAW to look like JPEG and not shooting JPEG in the first place? Blows my mind.

For whatever it is worth, you have to use DPP to achieve this. DPP reads the camera settings stored in a proprietary "maker notes" EXIF section and uses them to apply a conversion similiar to the one the camera uses.

Or use an extraction tool to read and store the JPEG file embedded in CR2.

Ciao, Walter

[jeremypayne]

I think we all start out this way with digital RAW ... at least I did.

My advice - forget the JPEG. 

Shoot RAW, get a good monitor and calibrate it well ... then learn how to use LR to process your RAW files in a manner that suits your taste and style.

[shacharoren79]

sorry for the long time but i have been away.

just wanted to clerify a few things,

i do understand that the potential in RAW images is far greater than the small jpeg but from time to time when i try to achieive better skin tones it seems very complicated.

i have noticed that sometimes the jpeg has a few "elements" that represent the skin tone i need, and therefore i asked how do i "bring" my RAW to the jpeg state.

obviously this is just as a starting point, i will never use that as a final and that's why i don't shoot only jpeg in the first place.

my question was simple, how can i acheive in LR what i can achieve in DPP?

"Or use an extraction tool to read and store the JPEG file embedded in CR2"  -

this is something i didn't understand, is that what can provide me with a solution?

thank you.

[Tony Jay]

The advice has been spot on.

Concentrate on the RAW file and processing it effectively in LR.
Learn the process as suggested.

Regards

Tony Jay

[Ellis Vener]

sorry for the long time but i have been away.

just wanted to clerify a few things,

I do understand that the potential in RAW images is far greater than the small jpeg but from time to time when i try to achieive better skin tones it seems very complicated.

I have noticed that sometimes the jpeg has a few "elements" that represent the skin tone i need, and therefore i asked how do i "bring" my RAW to the jpeg state.

Obviously this is just as a starting point, i will never use that as a final and that's why i don't shoot only jpeg in the first place.

My question is simple, how can i achieve in LR what i can achieve in DPP?


thank you.

Before starting I recommend you first update to Lightroom 4 or Lightroom 4.1rc , it really is better enough (actually more than better enough to justify the price of upgrading.

It doesn't have to be complicated but while you should be able to get close  I don't think you will ever get a perfect match. Assuming you are comparing straight out of camera JPEgs to the raw files first open both the JPEG and raw versions of the same photo. Start by finding a neutral gray tone in the JPEG and in the raw file using  the WB tool to adjust that spot's WB to closely match the JPEG.

Now look at your camera: in your camera styles settings what setting  are you using? Standard, Neutral, landscape, portrait, or etc.? for the raw file choose the camera calibration profile that best matches that description.

The next thing to look at is sharpening. Only God and Canon's engineers know what type of sharpening is being applied and how it is being applied. For the raw image , for a portrait, start with Adobe's Wide Edge (portrait) sharpening setting. The same is true for how Canon applies any noise reduction. Beyond Adobe's default setting for your camera model at different ISO settings you'll have to play with the Amount and Detail sliders here. Mostly just leave the color NR setting alone unless you are at high or very high ISO settings.

You should be 90 percent of the way home - except for one big thing that you need Lightroom 4 for: softproofing.

Your in camera produced JPEG has an assigned color space - sRGB or Adobe RGB(1998) (Actually these might be how Canon or Nikon etc. choose to interpret the sRGB and Adobe RGB(1998) settings but that is a different and more technical area I am going to ignore to keep this simple. It may also no longer be the case.) raw files have no color space assigned and Lightroom uses a version of the very large ProPhoto RGB color space for generating the on screen versions of your photo that you see in the Library and Develop modules. Lr 4 allows you to soft proof to either Adobe RGB(1998), sRGB, or device specific RGB (i.e printer, paper, ink combinations and displays ) that have an ICC profile.  If you have your camera set to sRGB(1998) try Lr 4's  softproofing using the sRGB(1998) profile.

Let us know if any of this helps.