printing on z3200

[lighthunter]

hi all
i have Lr 3.5 and PS5 and z3200
1- which program is better in printing ?
2- should i make the printter manage colors or prgram manage colors ?
3- should i use sRGB or Adobbe 98?
how to make color i see in program as much as possible what i see in paper "i could live with 90% maching"?
note that all paper i have i profiled it using z3200

[Geraldo Garcia]

There is no simple or quick way to answer your questions. Each one could be a chapter on a book and some things you ask clearly shows that you need to learn some basics. The very best way to do that is to watch the tutorial videos from Michael and Jeff: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/videos/tutorials/camera_to_print_and_screen.shtml
There is no easier, faster and less expensive way to learn pretty much everything you must know.

But lets try to answer anyway.

1) I think LR is better for printing, even LR3.5. LR4 is the way to go IMHO.
2) Program manages colour, if you know what you are doing.
3) You should edit your images in Adobe RGB or Prophoto RGB 16bits to preserve colour information, when about to print you should softproof to the printer/paper profile, choose the best rendering intent and adjust the image accordingly.

Best regards

[Randy Carone]

"how to make color i see in program as much as possible what i see in paper "i could live with 90% maching"?"

You should also calibrate your monitor so what you print more closely matches what you see on the screen.

[lighthunter]

thanks alot

[lighthunter]

Hi again
I do the following
1- Callibrate paper using Z3200 buildin Spectro
2-use Lr4 to edit photo
3-in LR print tab color mangment i choose my paper profile
4-intent :Relative
5- in z3200 setting i choose color managed by application
when i print the photo color of the in preview screen of z3200 and printout  bais to red
What i do wrong ?

[Geraldo Garcia]

I would say don´t bother the colors on the print preview window from HP, that interface is only useful to check the print position and the colours are waaaaaaay off.

If your actual print came out too red you must check a few things:

A) Is your monitor a decent one and is it calibrated and profiled?
B) Besides selecting the paper and the rendering intent on LR and "color managed by aplication" on the printer´s settings you should also select the correct paper type on the printer´s settings.
C) You should softproof before printing, but to do that you need Photoshop or LR4.

Good luck.

[MonsterBaby]

hey lighthunter.

you are missing a step. at least here in your discription!

I do the following
1- Callibrate paper using Z3200 buildin Spectro
ONE-A ---- BUILD an ICC profile.. not only do the calibration!.
2-use Lr4 to edit photo
3-in LR print tab color mangment i choose my paper profile
4-intent :Relative
5- in z3200 setting i choose color managed by application

and most of the time perceptual works better for pictures then rel!

but you need to also build the ICC profile with the built in spectro!.. the calibration is only the basis for this!

[Justan]

I strongly recommend that you look into a program called Qimage for printing. There is a minor learning curve involved, but it’s trivial. Once you start using this application, you’ll never look back, unless you have to for some reason…

Also get something to color calibrate your monitor and use it every 4-6 months or so.

I have a 4 year old Z3100 and most of the prints I’ve produced with this have been made infinitely easier to produce by the use of Qimage.

[lighthunter]

thanks alot
i found when i choose printer manges colors i got a printout much closer to what i see in my monitor

[chichornio]

thanks alot
i found when i choose printer manges colors i got a printout much closer to what i see in my monitor

It shouldn`t be that way. There is no Color Management involved in that process... But let me tell you something: When I use HP OEM papers, this works for me too! And there is something extra: If you print 16 bits files skipping the printer driver, you`ll get best gradients and IQ in your prints. But as I said, you`re not controlling color this way. The printer does. But anyway, the z line seems to be very smart working this way.

[MonsterBaby]

"There is no Color Management involved in that process.."

thats not right!.. of course there is.. the printer does the color management as it says.. 

the built in tables of the Z transfer the color.

"If you print 16 bits files skipping the printer driver, you`ll get best gradients and IQ in your prints. "

thats not right either. you cannot "skip" the printer driver unless you use a RIP.

the PS version of the Z has the ability to apply its color tables to a 16 bit image and THEN calculate it to 8 bits for printing. still prints 8bits!
the normal version cant at all

[chichornio]

"There is no Color Management involved in that process.."

thats not right!.. of course there is.. the printer does the color management as it says.. 

the built in tables of the Z transfer the color.

"If you print 16 bits files skipping the printer driver, you`ll get best gradients and IQ in your prints. "

thats not right either. you cannot "skip" the printer driver unless you use a RIP.

the PS version of the Z has the ability to apply its color tables to a 16 bit image and THEN calculate it to 8 bits for printing. still prints 8bits!
the normal version cant at all

What I wanted to say it´s that there is no application managed color, so you can´t control color accurately (And soft proof your file before sending it to the printer) And I do own a z3200ps and you´re right about 16 bits printing... But why I get better IQ (specially smoother transitions) when I send an 16bits file using the RIP through the Embebbed Web Server instead of Application Managed Color? I asked the same question 2 years ago to HP Technical Support but I haven´t got a good answer.

[MonsterBaby]

oh the answer is quite easy.
the ICC tables are usually 16bit.

if you use the printer driver the software downgrades to 8 bits and then applies the colorprofile to the 8bit file.

if you send it to the PS rip the 16bit colortables are applied first and then it is downgraded to 8bit giving a maybe little smoother look as they are just better applied

[chichornio]

oh the answer is quite easy.
the ICC tables are usually 16bit.

if you use the printer driver the software downgrades to 8 bits and then applies the colorprofile to the 8bit file.

if you send it to the PS rip the 16bit colortables are applied first and then it is downgraded to 8bit giving a maybe little smoother look as they are just better applied

But it`s not same as sending a 16 bits file option using PS or LR, right? The software does the 16 to 8 bits conversion first, so in case I do not need a very critical CM, the right choice will be using PS rip and skipping the printer driver (considering that you have your paper color calibrated first).

[MonsterBaby]

hp says the only way you can use the 16bit color management is by sending it directly to the web server.

if you actually see that big of a difference?? not too sure ;-)

im not sure what you mean with critical color management?.. the color management is the same or even better if you send it to the RIP.

its just not as comfi as qimage f.e.

you do your editing in PS or LR.. save it as a TIFF in adobeRGB. and then just send it to the web server with the settings u like.. percept or rel.. and you get a perfect CM.
its def. slower than using the printerdriver. make sure you have the right ICC profile installed if you havent built it through APS.

the CM is the best you can get though. besides you wanna take the time and work yourself through onyx. i was able to get slightly better graduations and a bit larger gamut there.
but still for most jobs i just use the internal RIP or qimage

[chichornio]

you do your editing in PS or LR.. save it as a TIFF in adobeRGB. and then just send it to the web server with the settings u like.. percept or rel.. and you get a perfect CM.
its def. slower than using the printerdriver. make sure you have the right ICC profile installed if you havent built it through APS.

Actually I was talking about the method you´ve described. If I follow this workflow I get better results in tonal transitions (comparing the prints side by side, and believe me, it´s very noticeable) than printing using the applicacion with the same icc profile (in my case, I mostly use LR3 or LR4).