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Author Topic: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back  (Read 4194 times)

Creative Gent

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Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« on: February 13, 2012, 03:06:52 am »

Hello Gang,

  I am looking for some input on few things I am thinking about. By way of introducing the topic and hence my questions, kindly bear with me. I am a professional photographer an artist. I stopped photographing weddings back in '06. While we did augment with small format 35 mm and then digital, the majority of my images where created on film using my Hasselblad V series cameras. I enjoyed using them, created some wonderful images with them and resisted the temptation to sell them.
  While I am happy with my Canon digital, I found myself increasing missing using my trusty "Blad's". As is my tendency to always look at things differently from time to time, more so during the slow times that come each winter, I got to thinking. Why not merge the older ways with the newer ways, using what I own. So here is what I am thinking about and looking for some direction or stories of your experience if you have followed a similar path.
  First up I am thinking of buying an adapter to use my Hasselblad lens on my Canon digital. Having done a fair share of teaching and being a bit of a techie, I am good on depth of field, f stops and related format size factors. What I am asking is have any of you tired it, did you like the results, could you see a quality difference, and is there any brand of adapter you would recommend?
  Second, at some future point, I may decide to get a USED (read that to mean dirt cheap) digital back for the V series Hasselblad ( yes I know how to capture manually, focus, exposure, etc). In a perfect world I would just go out and get the Phase One beauty, however this is reality so I am thinking I can pick up an older used back. What I am looking for is something with a screen so I can capture untethered, I have seen a few of the older Kodak backs, however I am not sure  if they where designed to be used on the V series.
  Third, is any one of aware of a true full frame digital back for the Hasselblad V series. I really love the square format and would love to capture that way provided my lens will give me the same field of view as they did with film? I do realize medium format is very limited in the amount of photographers using them, and that it tends to drive the cost up, I believe I read here that a manufacturer may only sell sixty digital backs per year.
  Thanks again for sticking with me this far, and I appreciate any input. Again just to keep everyone's focused on my questions and not infringe on anyones time, I have been a professional for thirty years now, I have taught lectured and spoke across the US most of the time spent teaching the science of photography, so I am on top of the technical stuff. Thank you in advance for any light you could shed, good health and God bless.

The Creative Gent
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Pics2

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2012, 04:19:16 am »

There is Hasselblad CFV16 digital back in square format (50mm*50mm), as far as I know. It is an older back, so it shouldn't be expensive right now.
For MF lenses on Canon, well, I put Kiev lenses via adapter, and I'm not impressed.
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John R Smith

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2012, 04:50:40 am »

Gent

Currently there is no full-frame square format digital back for the Hasselblad V system, nor is there likely to be. The CFV-16 mentioned above is 36x36mm, not 50x50, and it has a 1.5 crop factor. Most of the 645 format backs involve a crop factor of some sort, the CFV-39 which I use has a crop factor of 1.1, for example. The biggest problem in my view with the 645 backs is not so much the crop factor (because 1.1 is OK, your wides are still wide) but the difficulty one then has with shooting in portrait mode. A waist-level finder is obviously hopeless for this, so you are more or less forced into using a prism. However, Leaf do make DBs with a cunning rotating sensor which solves the problem.

All these things are still very expensive, even secondhand. The (relatively) affordable backs out there are cheap because they have a major snag, for example you have to use them tethered, or they have a tiny sensor with a huge crop factor. Frankly, unless you are able to afford something pretty decent you would be better off staying with film.

John
« Last Edit: February 13, 2012, 04:56:06 am by John R Smith »
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Hasselblad 500 C/M, SWC and CFV-39 DB
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yaya

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2012, 05:10:11 am »

Third, is any one of aware of a true full frame digital back for the Hasselblad V series. I really love the square format and would love to capture that way provided my lens will give me the same field of view as they did with film?

The nearest thing to a full frame back would be the Aptus-II 12R I believe. You can use its SensorFlex function and set it to shoot a ~40x40mm square image at 60MP on your Blad.
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Pics2

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2012, 05:19:24 am »

Gent

Currently there is no full-frame square format digital back for the Hasselblad V system, nor is there likely to be. The CFV-16 mentioned above is 36x36mm, not 50x50, and it has a 1.5 crop factor. Most of the 645 format backs involve a crop factor of some sort, the CFV-39 which I use has a crop factor of 1.1, for example. The biggest problem in my view with the 645 backs is not so much the crop factor (because 1.1 is OK, your wides are still wide) but the difficulty one then has with shooting in portrait mode. A waist-level finder is obviously hopeless for this, so you are more or less forced into using a prism. However, Leaf do make DBs with a cunning rotating sensor which solves the problem.


Ups, sorry guys, my mistake!
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ondebanks

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2012, 06:53:30 am »

What I am looking for is something with a screen so I can capture untethered, I have seen a few of the older Kodak backs, however I am not sure  if they where designed to be used on the V series.

Yes, the Kodak Proback and Proback Plus (slightly upgraded version) are for the V series. (Not the Kodak Proback 645X where X = M, C or H though!). Yes, they have screens, and CF cards, and yes they can capture untethered to a PC or laptop, but they do require cabling to a rather large external Quantum or Digital Camera Battery pack (the Proback 645 versions used a small clip-on camcorder-style battery). They are the first and oldest "portable" V backs, and hence the least expensive nowadays in the used market. Image size is 36.7x36.7mm square, 16.6 megapixels. The Kodak sensor (KAF-16802) is in fact the same as that in the Hasselblad CFV16, Phase One P20+ and H20, Imacon iXpress [V]96C and Flexframe 4040, Sinarback 44M, ...it was very popular and successful.

Two unique features stand out in the Kodak Probacks for the V series - that sadly you find in hardly any other digital backs. Firstly, they have an articulating LCD screen which can be tilted 80 degrees upwards to complement the WLF viewing experience (only 2 Leaf backs for the Leaf AFi camera also have a tilt screen). Secondly, they and their Proback 645 brethren also have user-removable IR filters - substitute an AA filter to reduce aliasing, or leave it off for hugely sensitive infrared shooting.

Downsides? Only 12 bit files, rather than the 14 bits needed for for finely sampled shadows (ignore the guff you'll read about 16 bits in medium format - the sensors only give about 14 bits of useful data). And there is no active cooling system in the back, so long exposures are more noisy than in, say, a Phase One P20+.

Oh, and it shoots ISO 100 only - but then so do nearly all other MFD backs - they just apply digital gain to multiply the output intensities by a constant 2x, 4x, 8x to simulate ISO 200, 400, 800, without any of the signal to noise improvement that comes with changing ISO in a CMOS sensor. So if you want to shoot at say "ISO 400", simply underexpose by 2 stops, pull up the levels by 2 stops in post-processing, and you're at the same result.

Ray
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jack gilbert

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2012, 12:35:13 pm »

I nave a v series 503CW. I purchased a well used Phase P 30 with a 1.3 crop two years ago. I have 80, 150, 250, and 40 lens that I use with it. You need C or CF lenses for the backs to work. The white balance and the LCD monitor on the back are crap compared to 35mm DSLR camera's and the 35cameras leave a lot to be desired and i curse them every time I use the back.
The back turns from landscape to horizontal  by removing the back and turning it to th orientation you require. there is a transparent veiwfinder mask marked for landscape, portrait, and square. square is a lot smaller than 6x6 a normal film hasselblad takes. You can crop the files though.
You have to take more care in focusing, work harder at white balanceand harder at producing what you require. You will get the drift that It is blooming hard work with the older P backs, but I wouldn't part with it for all the tea in China. By the way I it is just a hobby with me I am not a Pro.
One picture converted to Monochrome, and one Colour , if it works
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jack gilbert

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2012, 12:37:44 pm »

One loaded I hope this will be thew second
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hasselbladfan

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2012, 05:32:54 pm »

On your first point, I would never do this. MF lenses are great for MF, but not for 35mm. if you want better quality, go for Leica R lenses on your Canon. They are pretty cheap right now and will give you better results.
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David Watson

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2012, 05:42:54 pm »

Hi

Here is what I would do.  I would buy a good used H3D-22 and CF adapter so you can use your lenses.  The 22 on the H3D is a very good back which produces stunning images.

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David Watson ARPS

Creative Gent

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Re: Hasselblad, moving forward by looking back
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2012, 12:44:05 am »

Hello Gang,

  I want to thank everyone who was kind enough to take a few moments to write. It was very kind of everyone and deeply appreciated all the responses. I don't mean that to discourage more comments, I have read every response and I am still doing a good bit of investigation based on what folks suggested.
  I found an interesting company that seems to have created a nice niche with adapters and some other interesting hard to find items (Eye cups) you can check them out here; http://www.fotodiox.com/index.php
  I also have looked into a few more digital baks that where suggested, and found a PDF that I downloaded on the Kodak Pro back mentioned. Nothing like sitting by the fire place on a cold winters eve with a tech spec sheet!  ;D  Hey once a techie always one for life!
  Again a heart felt thanks to all and I look forward to hearing more on this and appreciate all responses. As mentioned I am more into the research phase now and have not made any concrete decisions, I will keep you up to date on that when I finally make a move. Until then good health and God bless.

The Creative Gent
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