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Author Topic: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower  (Read 4643 times)

Mr. Rib

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Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« on: November 06, 2011, 06:36:53 AM »



Although each one of us realises how much work it is to do motion picture, feel the burden of these guys and what they're doing. Amazing stuff.
Also they have quite a few Epics I'd say ;)


« Last Edit: November 06, 2011, 07:23:21 AM by Mr. Rib »
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Ben Rubinstein

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2011, 06:58:39 AM »

wow, just wow.

Josh-H

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2011, 07:43:24 PM »

Quote
Also they have quite a few Epics I'd say

Indeed..48 RED Epics. That has to be the worlds biggest single collection  ;D

Amazing.

ChristopherBarrett

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2011, 09:12:41 PM »

Indeed..48 RED Epics. That has to be the worlds biggest single collection  ;D

Amazing.

Heh... James Cameron has 50.
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Mr. Rib

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2011, 05:57:13 AM »

That's because Peter Jackson has clearly run out of names for his set of Epic bodies.

Heh... James Cameron has 50.
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PierreVandevenne

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2011, 08:04:21 AM »

I find it amusing that they are essentially color correcting the actors and the sets to flashier colors which they will tone down in post-processing... 
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ChristopherBarrett

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2011, 11:46:26 AM »

That's because Peter Jackson has clearly run out of names for his set of Epic bodies.


Perhaps when he contemplated naming No. 49 "Mr. Winky" he realized it was best to stop at 48.
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bcooter

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2011, 12:01:31 PM »

I find it amusing that they are essentially color correcting the actors and the sets to flashier colors which they will tone down in post-processing... 

I knew this is something everybody would hit on, but when you look at the way they color a lot of Mr. Jackson's films they go to a very muted cool/gray and let a few primary REDs and yellows peek through, so if I had his budget and wanted that look, I'd do the same, regardless of the camera.

I get normal colors out of the MX sensor and good skin tones actually very nice skin tones but everybody shoots and works with a different strategy and style.

This screen grab is direct from a RED One daily with just some slight 5 minute clean up, no real correction.


Shot with practicals, the club lights in the bg and for a key a small hand held light panel.

IMO

BC


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Graeme Nattress

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2011, 01:55:52 PM »

The issues on the Hobbit are to do with that he's shooting stereo with a mirror rig, and the mirror tints green to one image, magenta to the other and pulls out saturation in general. Reducing saturation in post is more pleasing to them than adding it, so they oomph the makeup and sets so as to help in grading where they counteract the tints from the mirror.

Graeme
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PierreVandevenne

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2011, 04:03:25 PM »

Thanks for the explanation Graeme! While I wouldn't question Jackson's creative choice, I suspected there was a technical reason for this. An amazing amount of work is going into this, can't wait to see the result. Could be the movie that helps 3D TV sell.
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Graeme Nattress

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2011, 04:15:39 PM »

We just found out ourselves when asked the team on the Hobbit!

Graeme
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photo570

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2011, 04:31:09 PM »

Another point that a lot of people are freaking out about on the forums from the Hobbit blog was the skin tones. BUT. If you go back and re-listen carefully to what the makeup artist actually says, the Red's are actually picking up the difference between real skin, and the latex SFX pieces, so they are having to put more red into the makeup to get them to match up in the finished shot.

I have had similar experiences with MF backs picking up very subtle colour differences and making them obvious in the past. If you are aware of it, it is fine and really can be a positive, as it shows the depth of the file.

Cheers,
Jason.
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Graeme Nattress

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2011, 04:33:26 PM »

Yup, that's a camera accuracy issue where it's accurately portraying the difference between prosthetics and real skin. Unlike some video cameras, we don't put in a "skin" circuit that normalizes all colours around skin to a single hue.

Graeme
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Peter McLennan

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2011, 12:16:54 AM »

Graeme, I understand they're shooting 48fps.  Why? 
At this point, no exhibitors that I'm aware of can display 48fps material.

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Josh-H

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2011, 02:13:20 AM »

Graeme, I understand they're shooting 48fps.  Why? 
At this point, no exhibitors that I'm aware of can display 48fps material.




Isn't that a moot point? Even if a cinema can't display 48fps today 5k resolution - they undoubtedly will be able to in the very near future. Why not shoot in the best possible quality (clearly the budget allows it) ready for future displays.

Graeme Nattress

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2011, 07:09:38 AM »

Well surely the way to drive better quality projection is to create compelling content at the new higher frame rates. Cameron wants to do the same, but at 60fps and Trumbull at 120fps.

Graeme
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fredjeang

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2011, 07:26:19 AM »

Yup, that's a camera accuracy issue where it's accurately portraying the difference between prosthetics and real skin. Unlike some video cameras, we don't put in a "skin" circuit that normalizes all colours around skin to a single hue.

Graeme

ups, it sounds like Canon, doesn't it?
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Peter McLennan

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2011, 11:01:43 AM »

Well surely the way to drive better quality projection is to create compelling content at the new higher frame rates...
Graeme

Thanks, guys.  I thought that there might be some other post production reason for 48fps beyond "future proofing".
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Graeme Nattress

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2011, 11:08:38 AM »

Oh there is - it makes 3D look an awful lot better... The stutter from 24p is something we're used to in 2D, but it doesn't hold up the same way when you move to 3D hence the goal of the higher frame rates.

The reason for 48fps (rather than 60fps) is backwards compatibility with 24p for 2D or for places that don't have 48fps display.

Graeme
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fredjeang

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Re: Quite a few EPICs, quite a lot of work & manpower
« Reply #19 on: November 11, 2011, 05:52:20 AM »

I also think that the Red owner is a sort of Steve Jobs in this industry.

IMO, the big strengh of Red is double.

They have a really competent team

and

They have no past

We see that companies like Canon and Co are obliged to do politics that protect their respective departments. Red does not have this problem.

They can come with a complete system in one, while the competition will be embarrassed because it would compeat within their own products.

Red is free, has all the room to developp whatever killer product and they are pretty good at understanding the evolutions and needs of this industry at any level.

It's pretty amazing that their cameras can fullfill at the same time a small structure, the indy filmaker, the photographer that shoots video campaigns, or the most demanding Hollywood billionaire productions.



PS: in form of a wish hope, maybe tomorrow they will bring RCX to the next level, with real editing capabilities and it will be the end of the NLEs and the traditional dusty obsolete workflow as we know it. If a red customer who buys a Red camera can do everything from A to Z within the same software (except special FX), that will be another huge revolution. And my intuition tells me that it could be very possible.

That would really be a kick in the bottoms of all the arrogant software manufacturers that are maintaining ourselves on bondage with their workflows. Will be Red the Robin Wood (sorry, the Robin Hood) of the post-prod industry too?
« Last Edit: November 11, 2011, 06:07:00 AM by fredjeang »
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