Clarification on Mac 101 printing/Cause to Epson driver issues w/Snow Leopard?

[Tim Lookingbill]

I've been reading this Apple doc...

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3771

...on Mac printing in Snow Leopard and notice specificities in the steps lined out that make me suspect the cause of  the recent headaches with Epson drivers discussed online lately. I'ld also like some clarification from others on how they followed the instructions stated in that linked page.

This all started today when I did a Apple Software Update check and noticed it had a new printer driver for my Epson NX400. The ASU details didn't necessarily address my printer model but did lead me to this page...

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3669#epson (dated October 27, 2011)

...where I noticed an (*) symbol next to my model in the linked document which indicates="Vendor software recently updated via Software Update". Not sure if "vendor" means Epson actually updated the code in the driver themselves and handed it off to Apple or if Apple updated the code themselves. Don't know if it matters.

However, what's confusing to me is the instructions in the first linked Mac 101 printing page which says...

Before you connect your printer...

Run Software Update.

I wonder if those updating their printer driver actually do this (disconnect their printer). And if they don't and just let the ASU download and install the updated driver, if this could be the cause of the trouble (color mismatch) with "Let Photoshop Manage Color" printing method in Snow Leopard some have been reporting.

I can tell you I never disconnected my printer when doing these driver updates, but then I don't use "Let Photoshop Manage Color" print workflow settings. I have to use non-traditional Epson driver settings that make no sense to get a screen to print match with the files RGB numbers written to sRGB in Snow Leopard. In Tiger the image had to be written in AdobeRGB using the same Epson settings.

As an aside don't you think the level of specificity in the instructions lined out in both linked pages points to something very complicated going on under the hood with Apple and printer drivers I don't feel they are being open about?

Just thought I'ld get some input on this and if it is a real concern.

[Wayne Fox]

No real answer here, just a couple of thoughts.

First I believe the statement does indicate Epson has updated it's driver and supplied it to Apple.  Apple doesn't write the drivers, but they do distribute them to make plug and play work for most consumer printers.

Most having problems with their Epson printers are running Epson's pro series of printers, not consumer. Those having problems with color at this point have an anomaly going on ... something is wrong in their system (I install several Epson printers a month, really don't run into this issue anymore). Epson is pretty good at keeping Apple software updated for their consumer lines, such as their all in ones, but this doesn't seem to apply to the pro series.  I know I never let Software update any Epson drivers, but I only run 49/79/9900 and 11880 printers.

Personally I think if you just run software update, everything will be fine.  As far as unplugging the printer, the advantage there is the act of reconnecting it will invoke OS X to automatically activate it for you making it available to print on.  If the driver isn't available when you plug the printer in, it can't do this or at least it won't be able to fully enable the printer specific features.

[Tim Lookingbill]

Thanks for your thoughtful and thorough response, Wayne.

I wasn't aware that those Epson drivers on the Apple site were for consumer grade models only. My mistake.

I was going by issues with Epson drivers currently discussed in the thread linked below and elsewhere on the web having to do with changes between Tiger/Leopard and Snow Leopard OS...

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=59025.0

And the Ctein article linked at the bottom.

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2010/05/returning-to-hell.html

So the R2400 and R800 mentioned in that workaround are considered consumer grade models?

Just trying to figure out why so many are having so much trouble after a decade or more of screen to print matching. You'ld think they'ld have it all worked out by now.

[Alan Goldhammer]

And the Ctein article linked at the bottom.

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2010/05/returning-to-hell.html

So the R2400 and R800 mentioned in that workaround are considered consumer grade models?

Just trying to figure out why so many are having so much trouble after a decade or more of screen to print matching. You'ld think they'ld have it all worked out by now.

That article is over a year old and the R2400 printer is not even state of the art in terms of Epson pigment inkjet printers any longer.  I would not go by this article in making any judgements.

[Wayne Fox]

As mentioned, Ctein's frustrations were from a while ago and most of that has worked out.  I also believe he was bitten with some of the anomalies I referred to.  One other problem is for some odd reason, version 4 ICC profiles seem to break between 10.6.3 and 10.6.4 ... no explanation and odd, and I believe Ctein was bitten by that as well.

As far as currently, version 4 profiles are still problematic with Snow Leopard but Epson drivers install version 2 profiles.  Most 3rd party profiles are also still version 2.  I haven't tested to see if Lion changed this ... I just keep using version 2 profiles because they work just fine.

Epson may be trying to update it's pro series drivers via Apple, but I don't know so I just do it myself. 

[Tim Lookingbill]

It's not just the Ctein's that I'm seeing. I just posted that because it was the closest thing I could grab.

I'm seeing quite a few current "prints too dark" after upgrading to Snow Leopard posts over at Photo.net Digital Darkroom as well as other PN threads I've posted in. The usual answer is Andrew posting the LuLa article by the same name and I'm suspecting it's got to be something other than folks viewing their prints under low light compared to their bright displays.

Each say they've calibrated and so on and so on. Nothing gets resolved and the poster just stops reporting back with a solution.

I started posting photos of the kind of dark prints I get from my NX400 if I don't use the Epson driver settings workaround described above. By the time I do that the OP has moved on.

As a general frustration driven comment why do folks still encounter printer problems after this technology has been worked through, up/down and around for over a decade? Why can't the printer manufacturers, OS platform vendors and Adobe get together and explain what the hell is going on under the hood that gets so screwed up on an upgrade?

After dealing with this crap for so many years you'ld think they'ld have failsafe measures in place to head off any troubleshooting a user has to go through on each upgrade.

IT'S JUST PRINTING! What is so damn complicated about it that makes it so fragile with an upgrade?

[Wayne Fox]

All of these threads about people "just upgrading" to Snow leopard?  It's been over 2 years since it was introduced. 

If you are just upgrading to Snow Leopard you probably need to search things that are a couple of years old back when everyone actually solved the problems.

I know you are "just printing", but computer technology, as good as it is, can have things go wrong.  I have several articles on my old blog that talked about fixing snow leopard problems ... I've had several who had to do a full clean out of their Mac's printer system then reinstall the new drivers.  Apple made some major changes to the printing pipeline which involved empowering colorsync across the entire OS with Snow Leopard (you can use color management to print from pretty much any app starting with Snow Leopard).  It broke a lot of drivers ... but that was over 2 years ago.

Don't follow current threads .. they are all just rehashing what happened a couple of years ago.  Try to find some old threads. 

Might take a look at my take on the problems from a blog post a couple years ago ...

[Tim Lookingbill]

Thanks for the link to your blog, Wayne.

I'm bookmarking it and will refer others to it I come across in future threads having these dark print issues after upgrading to Snow Leopard.

Geez! I guess I am behind the curve seeing your blog is dated 2009.

BTW, just took a peak at your gallery and you've got some stunning landscapes. The clarity and color is unbelievable.

[digitaldog]

First, NEVER let Apple software update install Epson drivers, kiss of death. I can go into details how this process can hose things and how you have to reset the print system and give a full printer Epson enema but why set yourself up? Update drivers you get directly from Epson!

Next, I and lots of others has zero issues or saw differences when upgrading to Snow Leopard! Did some? Yes. Why? Who knows. It was a small group considering the number of both Epson/SN users. Whenever a new Mac OS comes out and I install, I always print a target from the old OS, upgrade, print it again, measure and view dE in Colorthink. I haven't done the Lion upgrade as yet but soon...

[digitaldog]

I haven't tested to see if Lion changed this ... I just keep using version 2 profiles because they work just fine.

And currently, there is no advantages to V4 profiles (we need the major ICC vendors to support PRMG) when building these profiles