HP Announcement

[David Budd]

Do members think there will be ramifications in light of this announcement by HP, and the possibility of a buy-in by private equity companies to the product range of printers such the Z3100/Z3200 and future large-format printer development.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14584428


David

[Ernst Dinkla]

At the sideline we all wondered what HP had in mind when it bought Palm and there have been more surprises like that over the last decade. Mr Apotheker's move may be the most surprising one but possibly the wisest at the same time. I do not think that there will be much changed for the water based wide formats, the Designjet category, not much happened for us over the last 2-3 years but the Z5200. The total group of HP industrial inkjets could be sold and can take care of the Designjets too while facing stiff competition from Canon and I guess Memjet soon enough. HP desktop printers is another category but relevant models for photography with Vivera pigments were not recently announced either. There is still potential technology available within HP's printer division but I doubt that it will deliver anything interesting for our branch right now. Vivera pigment inks squirted from Memjet stationary - page wide - thermal heads would be a nice outcome of this but is unlikely to happen. I am not worried about Z model supplies for the next three years, too profitable for HP or the next company to stop distribution. Right now the PC division, tablets, phones are discussed, not the printing division. All IMHO.

met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/

[David Budd]

Thanks Ernst for your insight.. I guess its just a case of "wait and see".

David

[Mark D Segal]

No - not "wait and see". HP is a huge corporation with huge internal and external problems. Has been for years. The turmoil and the policy gyrations have also taken their toll on product quality. After a succession of HP scanners and printers that ended-up either in the trash or recycling events, I have personally stopped buying anything from HP. Whether from the hardware or software/firmware, I've experienced fatal or near-fatal flaws in every single product I have ever owned from HP going back to the early 1990s. Right now I'm suffering through the last HP office inkjet I'll ever buy. HP undoubtedly houses many brilliant minds doing leading-edge fundamental scientific and technological research in domains many of us would scarcely ever know anything about, but focusing on what's relevant to most of us - the ordinary consumer end of the business, based solely on my own first-hand experience, my general advice is to buy from companies that have corporate stability and a proven track record in producing high quality, well supported products with proven performance.

[enduser]

It's worth noting that HP have a full line of highly respected commercial grand fromat printers used in the graphic arts and sign industries.  Several machines are 5m print width and highly thought of.   The whole print unit would make a good purchase, especially given the large growth in vehicle graphics applications.

[macawmatt]

To be fair though, with the exception of their latex line of printers, all of those grand format printers though came through aquisitions and not HP development. Nothing wrong with building a business that way but those printers are designed off of proven industry designs from previous independent companies and not HP.

[Ernst Dinkla]

It's worth noting that HP have a full line of highly respected commercial grand fromat printers used in the graphic arts and sign industries.  Several machines are 5m print width and highly thought of.   The whole print unit would make a good purchase, especially given the large growth in vehicle graphics applications.

It would if they had that division for sale, right now it is about selling the PC, tablet etc hardware, nothing else. HP gathered the industrial printing division over a decade, added printers like the Latex machines, added the web printing machines based on Edgeline head technology and the total of printing divisions deliver a better profit than the PC division does. They sell the PC part to make the other purchase in software technology possible as I understand it correctly.

I can not complain about the HP hardware I use, Including two wide formats, two office printers and a monitor. A desktop scanner went to the scrapyard, still functional after 15 years but now a big heavy unit with a low resolution. I had a Brother all-in-one office model and that one never did deliver a decent laser print.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

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[David Budd]

Mark, as a person who has heavily invested in HP technology, including two Z3100 I have really no other option given the state of the world financial system at present.

From where I live in Australia and similarly no doubt in the US, companies are either restructuring or just plain disappearing. Its this conundrum that we find ourselves in that creates a " wait and see " attitude... just look at the share market.

Certainly the two printers that I have invested in have given me excellent service and quality output over the years.

My only complaint is the level of service and support from HP Australia which is well below par, but then Epson wasn't any better, if not worse, when I was deciding what product to invest my money in.

I think Ernst answered the question by saying he was not worried by Z model supplies for the next three due to HP profitability in this area. At this stage I think that's a fair assumption given the state of play.

David

[Deepsouth]

No - not "wait and see". HP is a huge corporation with huge internal and external problems. Has been for years. The turmoil and the policy gyrations have also taken their toll on product quality. After a succession of HP scanners and printers that ended-up either in the trash or recycling events, I have personally stopped buying anything from HP. Whether from the hardware or software/firmware, I've experienced fatal or near-fatal flaws in every single product I have ever owned from HP going back to the early 1990s. Right now I'm suffering through the last HP office inkjet I'll ever buy. HP undoubtedly houses many brilliant minds doing leading-edge fundamental scientific and technological research in domains many of us would scarcely ever know anything about, but focusing on what's relevant to most of us - the ordinary consumer end of the business, based solely on my own first-hand experience, my general advice is to buy from companies that have corporate stability and a proven track record in producing high quality, well supported products with proven performance.

I partially agree with you, Mark. The HP products I bought (or used) from the mid 90s to the early 2000s were all very reliable and good values (for consumer/prosumer products). However, from the early 2000s on, the quality and service began to drop. The simpliest question (where can I get scanner cleaner sheets?) took 3 phone calls, one to a non-native speaker of English who barely understood what I was asking.  I bought an HP Pavilion PC in 2001 and it was junk from the outset, quickly replaced by a home-made Win-puter that lasted (with upgrades) until I went Mac.

When I was starting out as an electronics tech in the early 70s, HP test equipment was the gold standard, and their test equipment from that era still commands respect and a premium on the used market. That little hp badge on a piece of test gear produced a well-founded reverence for design, quality and integrity. Then they spun that business off (Agilent?) and that's when I think the link between quality and product got mangled.

From my POV, the current announcement is a good thing. Let's hope they can re-focus on making quality stuff again.

[Colorwave]

I'd be happy if they decided to retrench to the point that they became the world's premier ink manufacturer.  Only. 

No problems with profitability.  No problems with quality.  The new Epson 22990, featuring Genuine HP Ink.  Think about it.

[RFPhotography]

While the article says only PC, tablet and phones specifically; it also says HP wants to exit the hardware business entirely and focus on software and services.  That would seem to indicate that the printer side of the business is being exited as well. 

[JohnBrew]

No - not "wait and see". HP is a huge corporation with huge internal and external problems. Has been for years. The turmoil and the policy gyrations have also taken their toll on product quality. After a succession of HP scanners and printers that ended-up either in the trash or recycling events, I have personally stopped buying anything from HP. Whether from the hardware or software/firmware, I've experienced fatal or near-fatal flaws in every single product I have ever owned from HP going back to the early 1990s. Right now I'm suffering through the last HP office inkjet I'll ever buy. HP undoubtedly houses many brilliant minds doing leading-edge fundamental scientific and technological research in domains many of us would scarcely ever know anything about, but focusing on what's relevant to most of us - the ordinary consumer end of the business, based solely on my own first-hand experience, my general advice is to buy from companies that have corporate stability and a proven track record in producing high quality, well supported products with proven performance.

Sorry you've had those problems, Mark. I am totally enjoying my latest HP pc. It has been a revelation compared to the Dell products I used to own (knock on wood).

[Mark D Segal]

I don't doubt there are countless people who have had a mixture of good and poor experience with these products - must be the case given the scope and breadth of their market operations and depending on the specific product, kind of use etc. etc. Interestingly, I've generally had good experience with Dell computers both in an office and home environment over the many years I was on Windows before switching to Mac; but I know many people tore their hair out over Dell computers. Interestingly, there's no sign of Dell vacating this market - yet; even though to hear the financial gurus - it is said to be a "low margin" business. 

[Ernst Dinkla]

I don't doubt there are countless people who have had a mixture of good and poor experience with these products - must be the case given the scope and breadth of their market operations and depending on the specific product, kind of use etc. etc. Interestingly, I've generally had good experience with Dell computers both in an office and home environment over the many years I was on Windows before switching to Mac; but I know many people tore their hair out over Dell computers. Interestingly, there's no sign of Dell vacating this market - yet; even though to hear the financial gurus - it is said to be a "low margin" business. 

Little experience with Dell products but so far not bad. Low margin is always better than no margin and I do not think Dell has another choice than continue in that market, to enter the tablet market they have to compete with companies like Samsung, Asus, HTC and use Android or possibly a new ARM compatible Windows 8 version. HP's goal was entering the tablet, mobile market without being dependent on Microsoft, Google or whatever other choice. They thought it would be possible with WebOs but I guess Android's growth has been much faster than HP anticipated. It has to be seen whether Microsoft, Nokia can get/keep a market segment. One thing is interesting, did WebOs contain enough patent defences to keep Apple at a distance and is that value for another purchaser? Google must have bought Motorola mobile for that reason and might be interested in WebOs for the same reason. It is off-topic but this battle will make or brake some companies in the next ten years and every day a new move seems to be made.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst

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[Schewe]

One thing is interesting, did WebOs contain enough patent defences to keep Apple at a distance and is that value for another purchaser? Google must have bought Motorola mobile for that reason and might be interested in WebOs for the same reason.

I don't know HP's track record regarding it's IP filings...but the handwriting is on the wall...it's all about the IP. Google got stiffed in their bid to buy Nortel's patents earlier in July. Ironic that Apple teamed with MSFT to buy them huh? (well along with a few others) So Google bought Motorola Mobile...Not sure if HP had he IP to do battle with webos...if they have some good IP then in this market it's valuable. If they don't have IP then they are better off closing up shop. The number of patent infringement suits are going to skyrocket. Great if you are an IP lawyer...not sure it'll do much for the economy though :~(

[Colorwave]

Google got stiffed in their bid to buy Nortel's patents earlier in July.

I think that is what happens when you play games with billion dollar bids and decide to bid the value of Pi.  That, and deciding to back out of a back room deal to buy patents as a consortium.