Architectural Photography: Which digital back and camera system?

[JJ]

     For the past number of years I've been content shooting architectural assignments with my Canon 1Ds (original) with Zork Panorama Shift Adaptor and Mamiya lenses. This combination has served me well, but I'm ready to upgrade to a digital back in concert with either the arTec or Cambo system.

     There are so many digital back options on the market, from 20 megapixels to 65 and 80? In short, I have roughly between 50K-70K that I'm willing to invest in new gear and I would like to get some sort of idea what is an ideal set up. I would appreciate hearing your thoughts. Cheers,

Jeremy

     

[mediumcool]

The biggest thing to look for if you are going to be using movements is to select a back that does not have micro-lenses to concentrate light on photosites.

Backs like my [oldish] Aptus 22 (large sensor with large-ish photosites and no micro-lenses) are great for lens movement because there is little colour change; I have been stitching 2x images together with my Mamiya 50mm shifted left, then right, and often don’t bother to use LCC (particularly when I forget to take an LCC frame!). I also have a Toyo 23VX view camera, but the one lens I have for it won’t focus to infinity.



This is made from one frame shot centred, and the second shifted to the right (M645). That’s why it’s not a wide pano.

[Weldon Brewster]

Check out some of Chris Barrett's posts.  He's a great architecture shooter and has a pretty sweet setup.  I shoot with a Phase One and Cambo Wide DS and it works great.  I would check out some of the deals on a refurb P45+ or P65+ and get a Cambo or other Tech Camera.  Probably looking at 33k or so with a P65+, Cambo Wide RS and a couple of lenses.  Talk to Steve over at Capture Integration, he'll set you up.

[Christopher]

P45+ or IQ160 would be my choice. One could go with the IQ180 if you have the cash. I personally think that the P45+ is an amzing package. The image quality is amazing and can be bought a lot cheaper than the new IQ stuff.

When it comes to cameras there are 4 options, Sinar, Alpa, Arca, Cambo. If you need tilt, it would be Sinar or Arca. All of them are great cameras. If you want one camera with movments i think the Arca is the best choice, if you want one with movements and a second to walk around Alpa is the better way to go.

[pixjohn]

Cambo also have the tilt lenses

[Christopher]

As do Alpa, but only for some lenses and not to cheap.

[pixjohn]

I don't think money is an issue if the budget is 50k - 70k 

[heinrichvoelkel]

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=56265.0


get the alpa and a back you like, after testing the usual culprits on your camera, with your lenses.

[heinrichvoelkel]

by the way, I don't know the guy selling this

[Christopher]

50k - 70k can still be to little if you want an IQ180, an Alpa or Arca with a few lenses. Especially if you want something wide like the 23 or 32, which together I think would be over 12k.

[JJ]

     Thank you all for your input. I appreciate your thoughts.

     I would like to work with all these cameras and see which is most intuitive.

     Wednesday I will try the Alpa system with the p45. There's a lot to consider.

     Yes, Christopher, you're correct. The Alpa 23mm is 6K, and the Sinar 23mm is twice that. The money goes fast.

Jeremy

[ChristopherBarrett]

Thanks for the plug, Weldon!  Recently at the Phase One Architecture PODAS we were lucky enough to have André on hand from Alpa.  He had some really beautiful gear with him!  I'm quite in love with my Arca, but you couldn't go wrong with either brand.

As has already been mentioned, a P45+ is a hell of a back for the money and gives you the ability to do really long exposures.  I'm happy with my P65+, more so than an IQ180 if you're considering a Tech Camera...

I would start with the camera system... my recommendations are the Arca Rm3di or the Alpa 12 Max.  Lenses...  I like to have  35,43,55,70,90,120 probably something wider too, but I HATE shooting that wide.

Then look at the money you have left and either get a P45+ or an IQ160.

My 2 Sense.
CB

[TH_Alpa]

Jeremy,

Try to get an Alpa Max, with both V & H shift possibilities.

You know where to find me, should you have any question left open.

Best
Thierry

   Wednesday I will try the Alpa system with the p45. There's a lot to consider.
Jeremy

[Murray Fredericks]

Can't speak well enough of the Alpa system and a Phase back...

My advice would be to consider putting your cash into the camera and lenses, they will serve you well indefinitely and then lease a back and upgrade it whenever the lease runs out...That way you stay on top of the evolving technology of the backs.

Murray

[MHFA]

The Sinar 23 12k??, I bought it two years ago for 6k, so I can`t imagine this price...
The Sinar emotion 75LV is very fine for architecture and you can get it for much less than the new backs...

I think it was a wrong decision that Sinar disappeared from the forum-scenes because their products are still competitive...
The ALPA is the best camera I had in my hands, but for my architectural work I don`t want to miss the sliding back of my SINAR Artec.


Michael Heinrich

[stewarthemley]

A camera really worth investigating is the Hartbleu. One advantage is that it seems to take any back and any lens combination. So you could, for example, use the stunning new TSE lenses from Canon (17 & 24mm) and get what would probably be enough movement WITHOUT any of the silly colour shifts and fall-off that seems to plague the latest 80 backs. (Sure, you can do LCC's but you'll still find movements limited.)  Don't be fooled by the fact that they are Canon lenses and not proper large format lenses. You should give one a try.

[Robert Hart]

Hi,

Great advice here thanks.

What do you think is the BEST digital back for architecture interior? Sinar, Hasselblad, Phase-One or Leaf.

Gr

[Christopher]

It depends how you work. A nice P45+ is certainly one of the best when it comes to value. However, all modern backs have good and bad things, there is nothing perfect.

[TH_Alpa]

Robert,

It all depends what are your requests to this DB. There are issues like "long exposure times", "size of the sensor vs shift possibilities vs lenses to be used", "white shadings to be applied in a batch", etc ...

- When it comes to "long exposure times" (understand over 30"), I think everybody agrees that the PO 45+ is the winner of all categories available.

- Sensor size vs shift possibilities vs lenses used is something you have to think about carefully, depending on your needs.

- Now, concerning "white shadings" (LCC), there is something to think about. If there is just a few LCCs to be applied and a few files a day to be corrected this way, there isn't much of a concern, each back and software can handle it very well nowadays. However, should you have dozen or hundreds a day to correct, then you should be carefully thinking about which back. AFAIK, C1 is not able to handle such LLCs in a batch and automated process as can do it e.g. Sinar eXposure (unfortunately not longer available and not longer supported, and Captureshop did not integrate this part of eXposure). Architecture photographer Rainer Viertlböck (member here) is one of those photographers shooting exclusively architecture and in this having daily dozen of LLC corrections to do. He used to work with Sinarbacks and the eXposure SW, for which he helped to integrate the "batch process" for LCCs. Then happened what happened with eXposure and Sinar, and having spoken with Rainer recently I know that he is now working with a Leaf back and LC SW which is the best adapted for his workflow in terms of LCC corrections. I don't say that this is an important point for you, when shooting architecture, but it has to be considered when a lot of LCCs have to be processed daily. In this case choosing one workflow or the other can save hours of time in terms of LCC corrections.

Just my cent to the debate.

Best
Thierry

What do you think is the BEST digital back for architecture interior? Sinar, Hasselblad, Phase-One or Leaf.

Gr

[buckshot]

Don't forget about the Linhof Techno. You can see Sean Conboy shooting architecture with one here. Compact, superb build quality, a great range of movements (more than any of the other systems mentioned so far), no expensive helical mounts and will hold pretty much any lens bewteen 23 - 250mm without the need for additional spacers and the like. Bellows focussing may not be to your liking, but if you're shooting tethered or with an IQ back that should be a non-issue. Even without shooting tethered or using an IQ back focussing isn't that much of a problem - it uses high ratio gearing with fixed (and ajustable) infinity stops. Also, the acute groundglass offered by Linhof, whilst expensive, is a gem.