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Author Topic: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24  (Read 8822 times)

Jeff Kott

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NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« on: July 02, 2011, 10:05:14 pm »

I'm finally ready to move up to a wide gamut display and have a few questions.

I've been using a two monitor set up with an Eizo CG 21 and a Viewsonic VP211b profiled with ColorEyes Display Pro and a DPT-94. I have a few questions.

1. It seems that for the same price as an NEC PA30W-BK-SV I can get a PA27W-BK-SV plus a PA24W-BK. Are there any disadvantages to doing so.

2. I understand the bundled Spectraview colorimeter and software is custom made for the NEC PA's, so I guess I should get that as opposed to using my ColorEyes Display Pro software and DPT-94, correct?

3. I also understand that the Spectraview colorimeter has a special filter for the bundled monitor. If I get a PA27W with the bundled colorimeter and software, will that colorimeter work as well on a PA24W or are the colorimeters bundled with the PA27W different in any way from those bundled with the PA24W?

Thanks in advance for any responses.

Jeff Kott
San Francisco
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neile

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2011, 10:29:19 pm »

For question #1, a friend of mine just finished reviewing the 30" NEC and couldn't justify keeping it. Blog entry is at http://www.ronmartblog.com/2011/06/review-nec-pa301w-30-display.html. His conclusion:

"Overall I enjoyed this display and it was nice to have the extra space. Once the display got to operating temperature it performed well and was wonderful for proofing large landscape prints. As I mentioned earlier though, for the price I’d much rather spend the money and get a PA271W-BK and a PA241W-BK which results in a lot more space and two outstanding monitors that are a brilliant together in a color managed photography workflow."

Neil
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Jeff Kott

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2011, 12:40:38 am »

Hi Neil,

Wow, talk about on point. Thanks, it obviously makes sense to me or I wouldn't have brought it up.

I'd still like to find out if anyone knows if I can use the colorimeter bundled with the PA27-SV with the PA24.

jk
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digitaldog

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2011, 10:53:58 am »

I'd still like to find out if anyone knows if I can use the colorimeter bundled with the PA27-SV with the PA24.

Yes, that will work.
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ronmart

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2011, 03:27:49 am »

Yes, that will work.

Yes, you can but at this point I'd advise going with the new Color Munki Display or i1Display Pro as they are better calibration devices than the bundled colormeter (or even better go with the ColorMunki PHoto if you can afford it). You still MUST buy the SpecrtraView II software (which is one advantage of just doing the bundle)
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Steve Weldon

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2011, 04:08:02 am »

I ran dual VP211b's prior to my NEC LCD2690uxi2's.. Actually I had two pairs, but as time marched on I stole parts from the first pair to keep the second pair running, and then one day I couldn't even do that..

I'm a strong believer in using two monitors of the same size on a proper dual display stand.  I wouldn't want to use two different sizes, especially if the physical dimensions (height) are different.  If this doesn't bother you then great, but it sure bothers me.  I'd rather have a single 30 inch.  If my LCD2690uxi2's went bad I'd replace them with two PA271w's on a proper stand.  I also included two NEC hoods in my order and they were easy to modify to span two monitors side by side rather than two single monitors.

And yes, you can use the colorimeter across all the Spectraview II supported monitors.  I use it and have no issues with how it profiles.  In fact, one of the more difficult things to do when profiling, is to get two monitors side by side to match perfectly and mine do.  I wouldn't hesitate to use the NEC puck nor would I feel the need to use another puck.  IF you need the additional capabilities another device provides (print matching, etc) then by all means..

Enjoy your new monitors!
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ronmart

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2011, 04:31:15 am »

I ran dual VP211b's prior to my NEC LCD2690uxi2's.. Actually I had two pairs, but as time marched on I stole parts from the first pair to keep the second pair running, and then one day I couldn't even do that..

I'm a strong believer in using two monitors of the same size on a proper dual display stand.  I wouldn't want to use two different sizes, especially if the physical dimensions (height) are different.  If this doesn't bother you then great, but it sure bothers me.  I'd rather have a single 30 inch.  If my LCD2690uxi2's went bad I'd replace them with two PA271w's on a proper stand.  I also included two NEC hoods in my order and they were easy to modify to span two monitors side by side rather than two single monitors.

And yes, you can use the colorimeter across all the Spectraview II supported monitors.  I use it and have no issues with how it profiles.  In fact, one of the more difficult things to do when profiling, is to get two monitors side by side to match perfectly and mine do.  I wouldn't hesitate to use the NEC puck nor would I feel the need to use another puck.  IF you need the additional capabilities another device provides (print matching, etc) then by all means..

Enjoy your new monitors!

Most people are going to have images in both landscape and portrait orientation. With two of the NEC PA series configured in a 27" for the landscape orientation and the 24" for the portrait orientation, I found them to be a great combo for typical photo editing and soft proofing.

The Spectraview puck will work, but my point was that the newer colorimeters by X-Rite (who makes the special wide gamut Spectraview colorimter for NEC) are using newer and more advanced sensors (and feature the benefit that they can also calibrate projectors should that need exist now or in the future). As a result, they are a great product to use. In the past the NEC puck was the way to go as the older i1Display 2 did not support wide gamut displays and the older X-Rite software seemed to perform poorly with dual displays. These issues have been resolved.

The 24 & 27" NEC PA series are identical in color performance based on my testing, but that's not true for the smaller PA series (the 23 doesn't do wide gamut color) or the big 30" (it's much less consistent than the 24 & 27". I've also had good luck with the PA241W being identically matched to the Eizo CG243W that I reviewed (despite them using different properitary software to store calibration data in in their LUT's).

You'll be very happy with the 24 and/or 27" PA series displays - they are excellent.


Ron
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Jeff Kott

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2011, 11:36:20 am »

Hi Ron,

Thanks for your advice. I got my PA24 with Sprectraview II bundle a few weeks ago and it's working well, except that I had to do some tweaks to the color balance coordinates in Spectraview II based on eyeballing the monitor to get rid of a slight green cast. I never had this issue with my Eizo CG21 and DPT94 colorimeter. I'm currently using the PA24 in landscape mode and my Eizo CG21 in portrait mode, but due to the larger gamut I am using the PA for most of my color correction work. I can see the point of working with two monitors that are functionally the same and will probably get another PA24 or a PA27 soon.

Jeff
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VitOne

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Re: NEC PA30 or PA27 + PA24
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2011, 02:58:46 pm »

I am using a SpectraView Reference 271 and a SpectraView Reference 301 monitor. This are PA monitor from NEC that come with a certification from basICColor about their performance and with the possibility to hardware-calibrate the monitor using the Profiler software from basICColor.

I am also using a Discus device and I also own the NEC version of the EyeOne Display 2. I think that the SVR301 and the SV271 perform in a very similar way. Talking about “quality” and not size the main difference is that the SVR301 has a slightly wider gamut (impossible to notice without the numbers) and the SV271 a better black point (noticeable if you are working in a very dark environment).

Here you can see the validation of both monitors:





And here is a graphic and numerical comparison made in ColorThink Pro:



Reading both certification that I have from basICColor of the 2 display I would say that they are consistent in the same way. In my case the 271 is a little bit worse than the 301.

I give you my 2 cents also about other points.

1)   I noticed a big improvement in the quality of the profile and on the quality on the calibration using the Discus device. I own and use a Spectrolino, an i1Pro rev D, a ColorMunki, an i1Display 2 with NEC matrix and other stuff, but I never got the same results that I am getting with the Discus. I don’t understand French, but if you go to 1:25 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7usvCURw9s you will see the same difference that I saw in the gradients. And this is not the only difference that you will see if you use a Discus. I don’t know anything about the new hardware from X-Rite and I will test it soon. At the moment I can only recommend the Discus.  

2)   There are many discussion about the European SpectraView monitor that I am using. Somebody say that they are useless at all; somebody will say that they will love them because of the software and now because of the Discus (at the moment you can use it only with basICColor software). I had many discussion with the SpectraView/basICColor tech support and I could never get an answer about the quality of the display that they use comparing it to the “medium quality” of the same display. I’ll try to be a little bit more clear: basICColor in Europe takes monitor from Nec and hand-pinks the “best” monitors (monitors that pass their tests, including uniformity tests) and then modifies them to allow the user to use basICColor software to hardware-calibrate the screen. Now the problem is that nobody really know what “best” means. Maybe all monitor will pass the certification (because they are all good). Maybe not. Now what I discovered speaking with them (but I really don’t know how much this can be true) is that the 241 and 271 monitor have usually no problems to pass the test. The 301 can have problems, and they pick “not a lot of units”. So what I think (I repeat: this is just what I think, and maybe is not true) is that some 301 monitor could not behave in the same way mine behaves and this is maybe why you can read on some reviews online that the 301 is not as good as the 271.

3)   For this monitors (271 and 301) in my opinion the best device is the Discus. Then comes the NEC i1Display2, then the i1Pro RevD, then the ColorMunky Photo. The spectros in my opinion give bad results in dark areas. If you are using this monitors (capable of a deep black) with a consumer-grade spectrophotometer you will probably get unwanted colour casts in the darkest area of your images.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2011, 06:44:48 pm by VitOne »
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