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Author Topic: NEC Xrite calibrator?  (Read 3664 times)

netherscurial

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NEC Xrite calibrator?
« on: June 21, 2011, 07:59:28 pm »

Hello,

I have a NEC 271W LCD that came with the Nec branded calibrator. Can this be used for other mon-NEC monitors, like Samsung or Apple monitors?

Thanks

Kevin
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digitaldog

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2011, 08:01:38 pm »

Not optimally. Its got filters specifically for the NEC.
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shewhorn

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2011, 11:57:39 am »

Andrew, just curious... do you know for a fact that they're using filters? They only sell one SV package which means that the pucks aren't specific to the monitors. If that's the case then they've had to make general assumptions about the performance of their wide gamut monitors. The specific way in which the Spectraview software works seems to suggest that it's reading a correction matrix from the firmware in the puck and not relying upon filters. If they were using filters though then the corrections made for a display like the PA241W I would think would work equally well on an Asus PA246Q or Dell U2410, both of which use the same panel (the backlight may differ and that could throw a monkey wrench in my theory).

I'm just curious because from a manufacturing point of view maintaining a different part is likely to be far more expensive and much less effective (because filters can't compensate for the low tolerances inherent in the electronics) than using a test jig to measure the individual response of a given device and then generating a correction matrix based upon those measurements and an average of the tristiumulus coordinates for their wide gamut displays. Argyll CMS can do something similar by comparing a colorimeter to a spectrophotometer. It can then generate a correction matrix which can be applied in software which allows a colorimeter to achieve better accuracy when hitting a specific white point and luminance. That seems like a far more effective approach to quality control as this would correct error that's inherent in these devices as a result of the sloppy tolerances of the electronics which manifest as a very high device to device ∆E.

Cheers, Joe
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digitaldog

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2011, 12:00:27 pm »

They are not mated to individual displays, but rather specific models.
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JeffKohn

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2011, 12:03:40 pm »

They are not mated to individual displays, but rather specific models.
Hmm, when ordering the standalone bundle (software + puck), you don't need to specify a display; one SKU applies to all supported monitors as far I can tell.
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shewhorn

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2011, 12:10:25 pm »

Hmm, when ordering the standalone bundle (software + puck), you don't need to specify a display; one SKU applies to all supported monitors as far I can tell.

This is what I was thinking. The cost associated with maintaining different parts for specific monitors is NOT something that an engineering department likes to approve because it dramatically increases and complicates inventories and labor costs associated with assembling specific devices for specific pucks (which is why I'm a little skeptical).

Cheers, Joe
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digitaldog

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2011, 12:12:21 pm »

Not sure how its handled but what I was told at the time was, the Colorimeters were mated per model. Now that could mean (I suspect it does) that a 2690, 3090 might be one group, a PA271, 30” another.
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shewhorn

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2011, 12:41:11 pm »

Not sure how its handled but what I was told at the time was, the Colorimeters were mated per model. Now that could mean (I suspect it does) that a 2690, 3090 might be one group, a PA271, 30” another.

There are two versions of the puck. I can't recall if they are both i1D2's (or if the older version was an original i1 Display) but I did find a post from WillH indicating that a puck purchased with a 2690 would work fine with a PA series monitor:

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=45944.msg384860#msg384860

If they were mated for specific monitors though, I would expect that the SV package they sell would have a designation as to which monitor group it was intended for but they do just have the one. This is why I suspect that NEC's optimization is attempting to correct for the inherent inaccuracies that are the result of a sensor that was never really designed with wide gamut use in mind, and as a sensor that was designed to be relatively affordable (and thus, some sacrifices had to be made to meet a specific cost target).

If they can write these values into firmware that gives their puck value over an off the shelf i1D2.

Where's Ethan? Ethan, the 3rd party tweaked i1D2 you tested, did you test it specifically with that manufacturer's hardware and software or did you test it against some other display using your own in house tweaked software? If I recall the 3rd party tweaked i1D2 had a much lower ∆E as compared to off the shelf i1D2's from X-Rite.

Cheers, Joe
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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2011, 01:51:11 pm »

Just go to the NEC website and do a search on the Spectraview monitors.  There are eight of them and I think they all behave pretty much the same in terms of color gamut so that NEC only needs to source one kind of puck to do the readings.
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shewhorn

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2011, 02:30:43 pm »

The 2090, 2490, and PA231W are all standard gamut monitors so the gamut of those 3 are going to differ significantly from the P221W, PA241W, PA271W, PA301W, and LCD3090W.

That's another reason why I think they may be using a firmware based solution. If firmware is at play then they could have a correction matrix for an average of the standard gamut monitors, and an average of the wide gamut monitors. Using filters would however require at least two different models of the puck.

Cheers, Joe
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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2011, 03:58:11 pm »

The 2090, 2490, and PA231W are all standard gamut monitors so the gamut of those 3 are going to differ significantly from the P221W, PA241W, PA271W, PA301W, and LCD3090W.

That's another reason why I think they may be using a firmware based solution. If firmware is at play then they could have a correction matrix for an average of the standard gamut monitors, and an average of the wide gamut monitors. Using filters would however require at least two different models of the puck.

Cheers, Joe
But those are not marketed with SpectraView and a specially tuned colorimeter.  Are they addressable via a LUT in the same manner as the SV models?
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shewhorn

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2011, 04:16:34 pm »

But those are not marketed with SpectraView and a specially tuned colorimeter.  Are they addressable via a LUT in the same manner as the SV models?

They are marketed as SpectraView models and are 3 of the 8 models listed.

http://www.necdisplays.com

Click products, then click desktop displays. Scroll to the end of the "narrow results by" sidebar and then click Spectraview Series. Those monitors are 3 of the 8 that are listed as current SpectraView models.

2490 SpectraView model:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/632158-REG/NEC_LCD2490W2_BK_SV_MultiSync_2490WU2_BK_SV_24_Widescreen.html

PA231W SpectraView model:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/741786-REG/NEC_PA231W_BK_SV_MultiSync_PA231W_BK_SV_23_Widescreen.html

2090 SpectraView model:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/671192-REG/NEC_LCD2090UXI_BK_SV_MultiSync_20_LCD_Monitor.html
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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2011, 04:52:26 pm »

They are marketed as SpectraView models and are 3 of the 8 models listed.

http://www.necdisplays.com

Click products, then click desktop displays. Scroll to the end of the "narrow results by" sidebar and then click Spectraview Series. Those monitors are 3 of the 8 that are listed as current SpectraView models.


They are all listed as wide or ultra-wide gamut monitors on the NEC website.  This was my only point.
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a.c.

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2011, 06:25:10 pm »

This is a concern I had because I'm currently shopping for a new monitor.

So I actually contacted NEC myself about this, and here is the verbatim correspondence:

Q: Will NEC's Display Calibration Colorimeter (MDSVSENSOR2) work with:

  1) NEC non-Spectraview monitors; and/or
  2) non-NEC monitors?

A: The puck is an X-Rite Eye One 2 Display -- if the other hardware/software is compatible with that, then yes.
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howardm

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Re: NEC Xrite calibrator?
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2011, 07:35:33 am »

Work?  yes

Optimal?  maybe

It wouldn't be the first time tech support didn't have the 'full' answer.  Hopefully WillH (from NEC) who hangs around here can expand on the answer.  It's been my understanding (and the observation of others much more knowledgeable) that NEC sensor gives it's best on one of the listed 'supported' NEC monitors.  All others suffer a bit.
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