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Author Topic: Professional?  (Read 1137 times)

Jeremy Roussak

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Professional?
« on: May 13, 2011, 12:58:12 pm »

I spoke to a print shop in Manchester this morning, since they advertise large canvas prints (150cm x 60cm maximum, which is pretty big for me). I thought I'd about profiles for soft-proofing.

They told me that they don't use a printer profile: they print from Photoshop to their iPF8300 using "printer manages colours". They wouldn't tell me what canvas they use, other than that it's a polyester / cotton mix that's not a branded make, so I can't try to find a profile from the manufacturer's web site (not that it would be much use, given the first point).

They're not dramatically cheap (£125 for the maximum size, above, gallery-wrapped).

I was rather surprised and was left with the feeling that they would best be avoided. Am I being unfair?

Jeremy
« Last Edit: May 13, 2011, 12:59:50 pm by kikashi »
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ftbt

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Re: Professional?
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2011, 01:13:22 pm »

I can only tell you how I do it with my 8300: I print from Photoshop, but I use Canon's print plug-in, along with am1 and ICC profiles for the canvas or paper that I use. Works quite well for me.
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Ken

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Re: Professional?
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2011, 01:17:04 pm »

I was rather surprised and was left with the feeling that they would best be avoided. Am I being unfair?

If the prints look consistently good to you, then I don't see why how they got there makes any difference. But... it's important to know the inks/pigments and substrate they're using so that you can research the expected longevity, especially if you intend to sell the prints.
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mikev1

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Re: Professional?
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2011, 01:26:49 pm »

Sounds like they just hit Cntrl+P and hope for the best.

There target customer base probably doesn't care too much about color accuracy.

The canvas might be some no name stuff from China.

I recently won a large job based on the quality of the materials.  The customer showed me the samples he received and it was shocking how bad some were.  The worst was from a rather large company up here in Canada that I know does a ton of business.

That being said soft-proofing does take some skill/experience.  

Best to ask if they have any customer satisfaction guarantee or avoid them.
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feppe

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Re: Professional?
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2011, 01:46:15 pm »

I've ranted about this very topic here before. 90% of print shops are like that: they don't know what an ICC profile is, what are the recommended sharpening settings for their printer/paper combo, or longevity of their paper/ink combo. For the rest of 10% who actually know what they're doing you'll probably get half-assed service unless you are a high-volume customer (read: make them a lot of money).

Probably the customers who don't know any better are to blame. Then again, there are a few online print shops who offer ICC profiles.

In the end, you get what you pay for. Or print yourself.

Mark D Segal

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Re: Professional?
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2011, 01:57:15 pm »

I spoke to a print shop in Manchester this morning, since they advertise large canvas prints (150cm x 60cm maximum, which is pretty big for me). I thought I'd about profiles for soft-proofing.

They told me that they don't use a printer profile: they print from Photoshop to their iPF8300 using "printer manages colours". They wouldn't tell me what canvas they use, other than that it's a polyester / cotton mix that's not a branded make, so I can't try to find a profile from the manufacturer's web site (not that it would be much use, given the first point).

They're not dramatically cheap (£125 for the maximum size, above, gallery-wrapped).

I was rather surprised and was left with the feeling that they would best be avoided. Am I being unfair?

Jeremy

No you are not being unfair. I would do likewise. Even if they have printed samples showing decent looking output, when the firm is technically so shallow, what will happen if the requirements of your images need a bit more work than pushing the print button? Especially if you are selling the prints professionally, you should have the whole process under your control: soft-proofing the final adjustments using the printer's profile for their printer/media combination, and you should know exactly what media the image is printed on so you can answer customers who ask that question. I would recommend finding a serious professional printer who understands colour management, adopts best practice as a matter of routine, is rtansparent about the media they use (canvas and ink) and will give you the necessary profile for preparing the images correctly.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
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louoates

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Re: Professional?
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2011, 02:02:50 pm »

I agree that the proof is in your own eyes. By all means get a sample printed from your own file before committing business to them.

I recently had a local printer do some canvasses for me. (He is a sign printer with a large 72" solvent-based* printer and had never done fine art printing) The first canvas looked absolutely horrid with drastic color shifts. The sly fox that I am, I took the canvas outside and viewed it in indirect sunlight. The print looked somewhat decent as far as the color values. Turns out he didn't know what color profile his printer was using, if any. And in his shop he had a wild mix of the cheapest fluorescent tube lighting. So that skewed my first viewing of the print until I brought it outside. Since I normally print all my own paper and canvas prints I also had a test print that I wanted him to match for each image.

He ended up doing his homework and located a printer profile that matched the canvas he was using. Now his prints are very close to my sample prints (as close as solvent-based can come to my Epson 9800 ink set). His profiles, while more accurate when viewing the print in daylight color temps, do not have any settings for other light viewing conditions (or mixes of light) such as profiles from Image Print.

Side point and intensely personal opinion: I can see the value of having an outside print source but I think that with the low inkjet printer costs, compared with five or six years ago, a serious photographer should be making his/her own prints.

* Why solvent-based? A long story I'll go into here if anyone is interested.
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