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Author Topic: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.  (Read 3720 times)

Clearair

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Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« on: April 04, 2011, 03:53:35 pm »

I have been dabbling with this form of mounting my prints for over a year now. Here in the UK there are city based print houses that do offer this service at a cost that does not ring my bell.
My strategy is for a method of mounting for exhibition to show off the print. At a price point that is far more economical than full on art framing. I leave any possible customers to decide on their own framing requirements rather than put my work into cheap frames, a tactic by some galleries, or worse still foam board (warps in UK climate ). If they want a finished mounted print thats OK but I need to know what suits their need. It's a matter of taste.
I am surprised that Mark compares the price point of this process to traditional framing. It should be cheaper in my opinion.
Why?
Because we can do it ourselves.
One thing, the term Dibond is used a lot. Never seen it. Everyone seems to use alternatives. In mark's article I spotted the sheet name as Omega Board. Also all these products come painted on both sides. There have been reports I only saw today of bubbling a few months after mounting. Probable cause, surface not cleaned just protective film removed and adhesive sheet straight on to a surface designed for nothing or a solvent based paint. It is possible to get sheets with one side laughingly termed burnished. I am experimenting with this now as this is an unpainted side to the sheet and I am concerned with outgassing through the adhesive layer to the back of my prints from paint. Paranoid or what.

What I am doing is ordering stock in chosen sizes from distributers directly. Having sent a plan of the cuts so that I take delivery of twenty or so pieces cut exactly to my requirements.
I mount flush as per Mark's image right up to the edge. This does look stunning.
I don't use a huge cold press, can't afford toys like that.
Herma adhesive sheets or if lucky the roll version. It's non solvent and claimed archival. It is a gum like substance which even after days has a little pliability. Eeerr useful it the Alu starts to expand or contract due to temperature changes however small. This might save the print long term and stop peeling. Apply by hand. Release paper, tissue sheets cotton gloves, stacking with weights if needed, just be inventive. Not for a large output.
It takes a while to work out a work flow that gets it all lined up and no gummy on the print face but the real problems are in getting this material delivered clean cut and precise as this is key to the look and trimming the edges of the print. I have a batch that I had to smooth off (bad handling by the now ex supplier) and my blade tears at the print if the surface is not perfect. Smaller pieces do not need the mounting on the back to be as full on as the example in the article. I use Key hole plastic hangers, bit tricky to locate a supply. Glued near the top in the centre of width on the back. Some bump stops at each bottom side and thats it.

Just be careful not to cut yourself and the finished results do need careful handling to avoid nicks.
I have mounted;

Hahnemuhle Bamboo and their OBA free Photo Rag Baryta.
Canson Baryta Photographique.
Permajet photo art Pearl (some OBA?). Possibly a surface not in need of protection as it seems a bit tougher and moisture resistant than others.

 I really don't see the need to spray everything.
For one thing I was happy to ditch the dark room and all those chemicals for my health and possibly the environments so why now start squirting lord knows what into the air.

Regards

 
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feppe

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2011, 04:02:00 pm »

I've had mine on the wall for almost two years, in quite variable Dutch humidity, somewhat variable temperature, and it's as good as new. Was done by a local shop.

For one thing I was happy to ditch the dark room and all those chemicals for my health and possibly the environments so why now start squirting lord knows what into the air.

Aluminum production is one of the nastiest ways to produce metals, and also one of the most energy-intensive.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 04:32:45 pm by feppe »
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dgberg

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2011, 04:04:10 pm »

I have been dabbling with this form of mounting my prints for over a year now. Here in the UK there are city based print houses that do offer this service at a cost that does not ring my bell.
My strategy is for a method of mounting for exhibition to show off the print. At a price point that is far more economical than full on art framing. I leave any possible customers to decide on their own framing requirements rather than put my work into cheap frames, a tactic by some galleries, or worse still foam board (warps in UK climate ). If they want a finished mounted print thats OK but I need to know what suits their need. It's a matter of taste.
I am surprised that Mark compares the price point of this process to traditional framing. It should be cheaper in my opinion.
Why?
Because we can do it ourselves.
One thing, the term Dibond is used a lot. Never seen it. Everyone seems to use alternatives. In mark's article I spotted the sheet name as Omega Board. Also all these products come painted on both sides. There have been reports I only saw today of bubbling a few months after mounting. Probable cause, surface not cleaned just protective film removed and adhesive sheet straight on to a surface designed for nothing or a solvent based paint. It is possible to get sheets with one side laughingly termed burnished. I am experimenting with this now as this is an unpainted side to the sheet and I am concerned with outgassing through the adhesive layer to the back of my prints from paint. Paranoid or what.

What I am doing is ordering stock in chosen sizes from distributers directly. Having sent a plan of the cuts so that I take delivery of twenty or so pieces cut exactly to my requirements.
I mount flush as per Mark's image right up to the edge. This does look stunning.
I don't use a huge cold press, can't afford toys like that.
Herma adhesive sheets or if lucky the roll version. It's non solvent and claimed archival. It is a gum like substance which even after days has a little pliability. Eeerr useful it the Alu starts to expand or contract due to temperature changes however small. This might save the print long term and stop peeling. Apply by hand. Release paper, tissue sheets cotton gloves, stacking with weights if needed, just be inventive. Not for a large output.
It takes a while to work out a work flow that gets it all lined up and no gummy on the print face but the real problems are in getting this material delivered clean cut and precise as this is key to the look and trimming the edges of the print. I have a batch that I had to smooth off (bad handling by the now ex supplier) and my blade tears at the print if the surface is not perfect. Smaller pieces do not need the mounting on the back to be as full on as the example in the article. I use Key hole plastic hangers, bit tricky to locate a supply. Glued near the top in the centre of width on the back. Some bump stops at each bottom side and thats it.

Just be careful not to cut yourself and the finished results do need careful handling to avoid nicks.
I have mounted;

Hahnemuhle Bamboo and their OBA free Photo Rag Baryta.
Canson Baryta Photographique.
Permajet photo art Pearl (some OBA?). Possibly a surface not in need of protection as it seems a bit tougher and moisture resistant than others.

 I really don't see the need to spray everything.
For one thing I was happy to ditch the dark room and all those chemicals for my health and possibly the environments so why now start squirting lord knows what into the air.

Regards



I manufacture these in our mounting studio and can agree it is very labor intensive. Since labor is not free it makes it more expensive then most standard framing.
If your doing it for yourself and not to resell then thats a different story.
Most of what I mount on Dibond is canvas. It can be coated with a spray finish like Glamor II or Clearjet FA.
It looks really sharp with the luster laminate and really makes the blacks pop.
3mm Dibond is not that expensive at around $3.00 a square foot.
If your looking to save a little money you can make the same type of mount using Gatorfoam in 3/8" or 1/2" thicknesses at around $2.00 a square foot.
It is not going to stay as flat as the aluminum and really only saves you a couple of bucks.
it looks like you have things pretty well nailed down.
Let us know how it works out for you.

Mark,
Thanks,just found your article. Good job.
I know all to well what this process entails. Dust is just not acceptable and can make these throw aways.
Have done several with metallic papers but found when using canvas dust is hardly an issue.
The plexi facemounting is the mount that will stand for zero dust.
  
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 04:28:26 pm by Dan Berg »
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Mark D Segal

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2011, 04:21:33 pm »

The article is here: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/mounting_prints_on_aluminium_composite.shtml

The Omega-Bond is not painted.

The firm I use does an extensive amount of cleaning with air hoses and compressed air at EVERY stage of the process to insure there is no dirt between any of the layers.

The prints don't peel and they don't bubble.

The advantage of having this done professionally is that professionals have the experience and equipment to make sure it works properly and comes out clean each time.
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Clearair

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2011, 06:06:50 am »

Good point about the production of this material, I believe that our use of this material pales in comparison with others in construction and manufacturing all the cars, planes and consumer toys we love.
But I wish it was different and my voice is small. I still prefer to avoid sprays but accept that I don't know which are the nasties.

I have time on my hands to do the work for myself and here in the UK I am of the opinion that we pay more and have less choice than in the USA for example. I would be happy if that observation was challenged.

 I enjoy the look of mounting my prints from my iPF6100 this way and I think they will last.

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Sven W

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2011, 06:24:25 am »

One thing, the term Dibond is used a lot. Never seen it. Everyone seems to use alternatives.

I use the original Dibond. Are there copies?

/Sven
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Clearair

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2011, 06:25:57 am »

Mark, thanks for you points on the work and professionalism of the company that you used.

I did look at their website out of interest before posting and failed to find any real information on their process. But that is OK I was just curious.

I don't believe that all of the print houses here in the UK go that in their processes but again I stand to be corrected. I agree that mistakes mean failures when doing this yourself. Part of the fun?

When I read posts in LL I am often amazed at the length that some go to in their endeavours. So I think Alu Composite mounting is as valid to those on this site that currently frame traditionally, stretch canvas etc etc.......as anything else. So passed on my experiences to broaden the knowledge base.

Regards
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Clearair

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2011, 06:46:09 am »

Hi Sven, I looked at the link in your post and tried to find a distributer in the UK on the site. Seems you need to register first?
Anyway while searching for a supplier of Dibond a year ago I came across suppliers of other brands that some dismiss as Chinese copies.
Well, the Alupanel brand I have most experience with works well. Don't know where it's made.

I think Dibond is thin on the ground here in the UK because of cost. I have not found a supplier I can deal with. Also I think some businesses use the DiBond as a term to describe their product, a bit like Hoover, instead of vacuum cleaner. So searches bring up all sorts.

I use at this time

http://www.multipaneluk.co.uk/contacts.php

Regards
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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2011, 07:24:04 am »

I use the original Dibond. Are there copies?

/Sven

From the original thread: Alusuisse invented the process to create Alucobond more than 40 years ago, successive versions appeared, among them DiBond that has harder but thinner aluminium quality surface sheets. Polyester is used to lacquer the coated varieties. Some companies rebranded Alusuise qualities. With the patents most likely expired more companies could produce the same board. Alusuisse merged with Alcan and that company again with Alcoa if I'm not mistaken (not correct). Thermobonding describes the bond correctly but the actual process is the extrusion of a polyethylene sheet (transparent or a more grey recycled version) with the two aluminium sheets rolling of coils together with the extrusion so the hot polyethylene directly creates the bond, an ongoing inline process.

http://www.alucobond.com/40years-history.html

Most copies will be based on Alucobond instead of DiBond and could very well be rebranded Alusingen products.
Reynolds used to sell a quality but I guess they became part of Alcoa: http://www.alcoa.com/aap/north_america/en/product_category.asp?cat_id=1756
Alcan didn't merge with Alcoa in the end but was bought by Rio Tinto, I see that Alcan sells it under the original names even in the USA.

http://www.aluminiumcomposite.co.uk/index.htm

While the bauxite>aluminium-oxide>aluminium conversion needs a lot of energy the recycling of aluminium scrap material isn't requiring that much. The Alucobond core can be recycled polyethylene. Weight reduction and high weatherability make it excellent cladding material for buildings, ship interiors, freight trailor exteriors. I have been to a large aluminium melter in Germany once, we had to take off all metal and electronic stuff on our bodies before we were allowed to walk along/beneath the huge melters. Magnetic fields there that probably were the equivalent of a millennium of mobile calls. My brother worked for Alusuisse for about 30 years before he retired. An innovative company that could well stand on its own legs. At Alusingen they also developed a continuous process for Alucore an aluminium honeycomb + aluminium surfaces sandwich, till then only made non-continuous for the aircraft industry. This process made it affordable in more industries. Another interesting invention is the bimetal bonding of steel and aluminium for coach constructions.

met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst


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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2011, 08:53:23 am »

We have had quite a lot of road repair work going on in my neighborhood with portable signs posted.  I took a close look at one of them yesterday and they appear to be this type of aluminum composite (appropriately painted and lettered).  They are quite weather resistant and obviously reused which makes them even more cost effective.  As an amateur framer, using such materials for mounting is problematic for me though I like the look of the results that Mark got with his panoramic print. 
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Sven W

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2011, 10:32:01 am »

Ernst,
Informative as usual!

Clearair,
Here you find Dibond in UK:
http://www.aluminiumcomposite.co.uk/dibond.htm

And Schneidler Group (not Schneider) is a big distributor in at least Scandinavia, for Dibond, Forex, Kapa etc.

/Sven
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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2011, 11:02:35 am »



And Schneidler Group (not Schneider) is a big distributor in at least Scandinavia, for Dibond, Forex, Kapa etc.

/Sven


Forgotten to add that Forex has its origins in Alusuisse too, Airex AG to be precise. I always think that they got that idea after a chocolate manufacturer invented the foamed chocolate bar: hardly extra costs, improved taste and exorbitant profits


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst


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Clearair

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Re: Mark segal's article on aluminium sheet mounting.
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2011, 02:06:38 pm »

Sven many thanks I will contact them this week for a quote.

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