Sinarback eMotion 75 LV ?

[KevinA]

So I have been looking at the various options of digi back, all the usual suspects, then I remembered Sinar do a range. So how do they compare against the Phaseone, Leaf and Hasselblad. I talked to the UK dealer he was a bit clueless about his competition, so I am not sure he knows where Sinar fit in the market. Are they worth considering?

Kevin.

[MHFA]

I am working 1,5 years with this back in architectural photography and I am quite happy with it.
File quality and workflow is really good. It is slow and high iso is rather bad. But in architectural work this doesn`t matter.
I think the relation between price and quality is one of the best of the market


Michael

[favalim]

It's 3 years I'm using it on view camera and Hy6, and I'm very happy for color precision. I compared it with Leaf 7 and Phase One and I preferd the eMotion because it doesn't apply any curve, it delivers a linear file giving you the choice to apply the curve you want on PS; some trouble with Hy6 wich is not very affordable about electronic system: before the leasing finished I give it back for repairing 4 times!!

[fredjeang]

I could check some sinar files some mouths ago in a friend's studio and I was very impressed by the render. To me, it looked different. I know that it doesn't mean anything but trying to explain my feelings, I would say that there was something very pure (almost too much) in texture and color. I found the render a little "flatter" (or less 3D if you wish) than the competition but on the other hand there is a sort of perfection or pureness that it's difficult to express but I was quite impressed to be honest.

[baudolino]

I've been using the eMotion 75LV for 18 months, initially with a Contax 645 and now with a Hy6. I really like the color and resolution and the fact that it can be really quickly, by the user (through adapters) switched to different camera systems - which in my case initially meant the most affordable digital-friendly MF camera on the market, with very high quality lenses that are plentiful on eBay (i.e. the Contax) and later was replaced with the - now newly "affordable" - Rollei/Schneider system, where the lenses are now coming to the market, at very attractive prices, from all the guys who are selling their Rolleis and buying the Leica S2  . Finally, the Captureshop program works as it should. Support from the Sinar people has been really good. Having said this, the 75LV is an older design and the ergonomics are not by far as good as the newest backs - the display is pretty useless and the back is relatively slow. By the way, the reason I went for the Hy6 was that it finally now can be used with the 6x6 film adapter and shot in the square format that I love...(even though I don't love scanning...)

[Lacunapratum]

I have one and I love it.  Very nice way to take advantage of the Hy6 and those wonderful Schneider and Zeiss lenses.  I recommend the 120mm Makro Planar, which never impressed me much on film but turned out to be wonderful together with the Sinarback.  Only complaint:  Captureshop is soso.  However, Sinar service is out of this world.  Never seen a company so committed to the customer.  Highly recommended. 

[Graham Mitchell]

I've been using a 54LV for years (and have played with a 75LV). They are great backs (adapter system, no vent holes, self-contained battery, built in memory, no wake up required, etc). The LCD screens are bad, as are all screens of their generation. However, there was an upgraded version of the 75LV available with improved high ISO performance and a larger screen. That's the one to get if you can.

[rhsu]

Had 3 HB units (3yrs) and eventually dumped HB. 

Spent nearly a year testing/comparing all then current DBs with several tech cameras (ie Alpa, arTec and WRS with HR23/28/35/40 lenses and movements).  IMO,  I've always liked the P45+ (39mp/6.8micron).  BUT got the 75LV (33mp/7.2micron) instead and using it for more than a yr now.  The support (the main deal breaker) and Sinar then had a 2yr warranty (std)!  I shoot mainly on tech-camera wide angle and works well!  The support that I get is amazing - truly 24/7 with no "*"!  (ie twice during weekend, in the middle of nowhere ventures and had a minor software problem.  Rang Sinar support via sat-phone - and immediately got a 1st hand diagnostic - (no 2 days later for a reply from elsewhere).

I only use the P45+ for exposure longer than 32sec!

75LV brings out the outstanding specs of the LF digital lenses line resolution of 5micron (ie Digitar and HR) - unless those mfgrs have recently refined their lens output specs.

75LV overall is well balance, like P45+!  Hardly any pixel diffraction with WA lenses and with movements.  As mentioned above, the contrast and colour are amazingly reproduced!

Internal 6gb solid state storage + CF slot an absolute plus!  The new LCD screen is great (but cannot compare to Phase for outdoor shinny day).  75LV allows you to target/spot neutral balance shot of your image – excellent in tricky environment!

Scrolling through the menu is on par to Phase and Leaf – ie quick and esay.

I have 3 interface plates – interchangeable – a PLUS:  HB, Phase/Mamiya and Hy6 rotating plate.  I mainly use the latter on my Cambo RS for the rotating function (slight re-modification needed with the Cambo adapts).

The software works seemingly well on par to C1.  The LCC workflow is how it should be!  Shame no WIN version – but that may be an advantage (hindsight wisdom).

When the technology finds a solution to the  Achilles' heel of WA lens and small pixel pitch sensor in LF system, I will then venture further with those other large sensor DBs with 6micron and 5.8micron.  At this stage, I don't need anything larger than 39mp for my work. (But the 48mp would be nice though if Sinar do bring it into the LV series).

Good luck.

[space_eos_am-1]

I used 75Lv for Hy6, Sinar m, Hasselblad H, V. I love it

[bdp]

Since this is the group hug thread for the eMotion backs, I'll throw my love in too.  

I've been using my genII eMotion 75LV for more than two years on a Contax, pretty much every day.

The back itself is great considering the vintage of it's 33mpx CCD - the high ISO is very respectable compared to other backs of it's generation, and the noise pattern is very fine so it looks nice. Shadows at 800ISO and underexposed shots show some low frequency banding that can't be removed with NR so exposures have to be done carefully. But up to 400ISO the files look great, even in the shadows and with a curve and some exp comp applied. Long exposures look fine too - I have done up to 32 seconds with low noise.

The software is basic compared to other brands, but is adequate for tethered capture, with fine tuning able to be performed later in LR or ACR as the files are DNGs. Once opened in either of those Adobe apps the files can no longer be read by the default Sinar software, so always work on a copy if you want to use the increased raw tools those apps give you. LR works well with eMotion files - it can pull lots more detail from the file than Sinar's software because it has highlight recovery, clarity etc and goes further with Saturation, HSL sliders etc and the NR or LR3 is awesome.

The backs interface is not that intuitive but once you get your head around how to get around the menus it is fine. Of course the screen is bad, but OK for histogram check.

They are a bargain for a 36x48mm MF back imho.

Ben

[lowep]

While considering your options, may be worthwhile keeping in mind that according to one US dealer factory upgrade from the first generation eMotion 75 to the 75LV model that has a superior LCD is no longer available.

[paratom]

I have used one for over a year but I am one of those who sold the Hy6 with the Sinar back for an S2.
I have to say that the IQ quality of Sinar back (specially skin tones) is very very good for my taste.
As said before the files out of camera come out slightly flat but with some easy PP the files come out very natural.
I also used it with Artec and the white shading functions of Sonar exposure work very well.

I switched because I wanted a faster and more DSLR-like system. If it was about pure IQ I would say I prefered the look of the Sinar back with the Rollei lenses over the S2 (slightly).
While the IQ is great sometimes I agree that its hard to judge images on the screen, and the software is not super stable.

Reading this thread I  miss the Sinar back and the Rollei lenses on the Hy6 a bit

[Morgan_Moore]

I love theimages from my 54 LV

but ..

I find the screen impossible to check focus (after a shot is taken)

I did have a back focus issue, (the backs have a shim system)

HB blamed Sinar, Sinar blamed HB

Mostly use it tethered in studio now LView SW is a joke,

Just check the shot after capture

I think having (for example) a HB body and a HB back is cool, becuase if it doesnt work you can just throw the whole bundle back at one dealers or service center and tell them to sort it out

[KevinA]

Thank you everyone. I am talking with the supplier, wether or not I jump to the MFD of any description is still under consideration. I have had a few jobs this year where it would of proven to be a better option. Wether or not that would translate to more or less profit for me is debatable.
Is the Sinar a good un-tethered choice, are 200 iso files good files.
A general MFD question :- The 12 stops or DR quoted is that just at base iso, does the DR fall off dramatically if you nudge the iso up a stop or two?

Kevin.

[Graham Mitchell]

Is the Sinar a good un-tethered choice,

It works great in untethered mode but you might find the models with the smaller screens a little frustrating. That's how it is with most MF digital backs. As I said, there was a 2.5" screen upgrade which might be worth looking at.

I just received a promotional email from Sinar regarding the 65LV back, which has a great 3" 640x480 screen (same as Nikon D3X screen, I believe). They are selling it plus one adapter for €5770. That's a 31MP back, which produces DNG raw files and JPG files in-camera and should be a great untethered option. Just FYI. See http://www.sinar.ch/eLetter/2011-02_int-09/index.html

[lowep]

Good, now all we need is the press release about the trade-in program! 

Meanwhile, any insights to share about how the 67 compares with the 75?