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Author Topic: Lightroom color banding  (Read 8678 times)

DigDeep_

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Lightroom color banding
« on: January 26, 2011, 10:44:50 pm »

Hi guys, Am having a bit of a problem exporting RAW images from Lightroom 3 to Photoshop CS5 (command - E). I am sending them 16 bit Prophoto RGB with no compression into CS5 (and staying in ProPhoto).

The problem is I am getting faint magenta, blue and sometimes green banding and posterization mostly in the skies or similar smooth transitions of light/color. This usually happens when there is a change in the contrast, doge burn, adjust darkness with colors (example convert to B&W then lower the luminance of blue to darken skies)

I also tried using Silver efex pro and am getting the same effect but without the posterization - smooth transition but with faint color bands. I have to convert to a greyscale profile to get the color banding out.

-The weird thing is the photos look perfect in the RAW viewer, Lightroom, ACR, and even tried Aperture. All have the same issue/ everything is great until I export to photoshop to do more touch up.

Do I need to just convert to a grayscale profile once it is in PS and live with it? Is this common? I have been search quite a bit and cant find a similar problem on the web.

Files are from a Sony Alpha 850 in standard colors setting.
Mac Pro, and monitor is calibrated.

Here is a link to the photo (cropped), http://jaminson.com/Samplestuff/_DSC0771crop.tif.

Please download! the pic and then open in Photoshop to see the color banding.

It will look great in your browser window, it Has to be downloaded and viewed in photoshop with ProPhoto Color profile.
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Schewe

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2011, 10:55:13 pm »

Are you looking at the images at a 100% view? It's like;y that you may be seeing a display artifact that might not actually be in the file. What is your display? Are you modifying the white point and gamma from the native display space? That can also have an impact in perceptible banding...
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Schewe

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2011, 11:00:01 pm »

BTW, I download the file in question and while I see what might print out as a bit of not optimal gradation about 1/3 of the way between the lightest and darkest areas, I see not color tinges on my display...which is an NEC PA241W wide gamut display profile at D65, gamma 2.2 (but that white point and gamma is set in the display at 10 bits precision so I don't ever see "banding" due to the display).
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DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2011, 11:07:31 pm »

Thanks for the fast reply!

Yes, 100% and beyond.

I am using a ViewSonic VP2365wb monitor.

Some odd things are that if I turn on Gamut warning (gamut color red) the color banding disappears and smooths out - and shows no gamut warning btw.

Also the photos look great in all the raw converters, just bad in photoshop as exported .tif

Thanks!

« Last Edit: January 26, 2011, 11:27:01 pm by DigDeep_ »
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Schewe

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2011, 11:16:00 pm »

I am using a ViewSonic VP2365wb monitor.

Calibrate to what and profile how?
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DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2011, 11:22:03 pm »

Spyder 3 w/ Coloreyes, gamma 2.2

Ok just checked again and Preview does not show it, sorry. It is only showing up in Photoshop and while in Silver efex pro. Great in all other apps.

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DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2011, 11:24:42 pm »

Here is more


Current Profile:

White Point Target:
D65, 143 cd/m2
Gamma Target:
2.2
Black Point Target:
0.555 cd/m2
rXYZ:
0.4528, 0.2429, 0.0034
gXYZ:
0.3648, 0.6498, 0.0827
bXYZ:
0.1467, 0.1073, 0.7388
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Schewe

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2011, 11:24:51 pm »

Then I suspect your display profile...have you calibrated to native white point and native gamma? If not, you are forcing a calibration modification in what is starting as an 8-bit/channel precision before the calibration which leads to display based banding. So what you are seeing in Photoshop maybe display based and therefore not real.
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DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2011, 11:30:20 pm »

Ok, I am really appreciating the help.

I am going to try and re-profile the monitor from the ground up.

Do you have any tips?
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Schewe

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2011, 11:35:54 pm »

You may have the ability to set the whitepoint and gamma at the display-which is optimal. Check, I'm not familiar with that display model.

Set the display to D65 and gamma 2.2 then when you create the profile, don't try to force the "calibration" but simply profile the state of the display. It may not be a "perfect" D65. gamma 2.2 but it'll be close.

The bennies of doing this is that you aren't forcing the change of whitepoint and gamma in the display card but just profiling the current state of the display. That's what's important and needed in Photoshop-the state of the display as indicated by the profile. This helps eliminate banding in the display pipeline as apposed to in the image.
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DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2011, 12:45:04 am »

Well I re-calibrated the monitor white point is now set at 6411k but the rest is the same. The results/problems are the same w/PS.

Another thing I noticed is when I look at the photo in the Preview app (file opened with Preview - the mac app) I see no color banding/posterization, But if I go through Photoshop to make a print and select preview in the print dialog it comes up in Preview (the app) with the color banding/posterization problem.

Pulling my hair out on this one!
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DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2011, 12:50:21 am »

More discoveries , Maybe this will help

When I am in Lightroom and in the DEVELOP mode I see no color problem BUT if I click over to LIBRARY or PRINT the problem is right there, just like I see in Photoshop.

Also keep in mind these photos are pushed really hard, from a pretty light sky to almost black before these problems start to arise.

Example is take a typical afternoon skyline and put it in Silver efex pro and use the "High Contrast Yellow filter"

Or if the photo is converted to greyscale in Lightroom and you turn down the Blue Luminencs slider just about all the way down until clipping occurs and a little beyond.

« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 01:18:12 am by DigDeep_ »
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ErikKaffehr

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2011, 12:54:01 am »

Hi,

I also don't see any banding on my screen.

There used to be something called Native Gamma setting. It means that there is no extreme manipulation on the RGB curves just to adjust gamma. It may help.

BTW, your images indicates some issue with my print profile when softproofed in Photoshop. Thanks for that!

Best regards
Erik

You may have the ability to set the whitepoint and gamma at the display-which is optimal. Check, I'm not familiar with that display model.

Set the display to D65 and gamma 2.2 then when you create the profile, don't try to force the "calibration" but simply profile the state of the display. It may not be a "perfect" D65. gamma 2.2 but it'll be close.

The bennies of doing this is that you aren't forcing the change of whitepoint and gamma in the display card but just profiling the current state of the display. That's what's important and needed in Photoshop-the state of the display as indicated by the profile. This helps eliminate banding in the display pipeline as apposed to in the image.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 12:55:34 am by ErikKaffehr »
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Erik Kaffehr
 

DigDeep_

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Re: Lightroom color banding
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2011, 12:07:03 pm »

OK, well I think I figured it out. It is a faulty Spyder 3.

I used Apples visual/eyeballed calibration in the display prefs and after going through it the colors are perfect B&W in all apps with no color banding. What the heck?

Colormunki here I come!

Thanks for all your help.
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