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Author Topic: Printing proofs and samples  (Read 2958 times)

Alan Klein

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Printing proofs and samples
« on: January 16, 2011, 12:02:46 am »

Whenever I print, the first print usually is not right.  So I have to adjust the settings in PS and try re-printing again.  How do I proof, if that's the correct word, so that I can get variable strips  to compare on one print sheet and then adjust the settings to which strip result I want?  Is that possible?  I'm using a Canon IP4600 printer and PS Elements 8 in Windows.  Thanks.  Alan.

sm906

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2011, 03:06:29 am »

Alan,

I have never used/printed with Photoshop Elements. Provided that PE does not offer printing of more than one image on a single sheet of paper Qimage might be worth testing. Qimage is darn cheap (34,95 USD up to 89,95 USD depending on the version you buy). Qimage is a very good printing interface in terms of its printing functions. It lets you print multiple images on one sheet of paper. Simply produce the test files you want to proof and arrange them in Qimage for printing. Qimage has a soft proofing function, which gives you a first impression on how your print will look on paper and if there are major modifications necessary with your image.

Qimage is available as 30-day trial software: http://www.ddisoftware.com/qimage/

Thomas
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hsmeets

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2011, 07:34:53 am »

Although not familiar with PSE, I suspect it has no softproof functionality (simulate print output on screen) one possible way forward is the following:

1) if not yet done: calibrate your screen with one of the many solution available so that your screen displays colors somewhat as expected. This is a mandatory step before moving further!

2) create or get a custom profile created for your printer and the papers you use.

After creating the printer/paper profile I can softproof in the regular PS CS and get some idea about how the print will look like. The softproof shows (the same) differences I always have to correct to get it back at the original: a bit darker, a tad more contrast in the shadows, slight shift in colorbalance in the highlights)

3) So I went back into the software that created the profile from the measurements and dialed the correction into the (new) profile as this software allows to do this. It took a few iterations to nail the settings.

Now the non-softproof versus the softproof hardly differ and most importent the actual print is also okay, at least the differences are below my level of concern (YMMV ofcourse) and I only now do reprints if after some time I think that my creative decisions around the color need improvement. I almost do no reprints because of screen-print mismatches you suffer from currently.

Yes, the softproof and print still shows differences but that is because of the difference in paper/screen media, gamut differences between camera, screen and printer plus the effect of the chosen rendering intent how to handle the gamuts from device to device.

To summarize: get a custom profile created but one that will incorporate the standard adjustments you do to get a best possible screen-print match, that may not be possible with a remote profiling solution, you probably need someone to come on site or buy your own profiling hardware/software.

I don't know if PSE would be my choice of tool, I understand you might find the regular PS too expensive, but keep an eye open on Adobe Lightroom, although Lightroom still does not support softproofing, it's a much requested feature by users, I would not be surprised to see it in the next version. And that would also be one of the last features needed for me to switch over the much more friendly priced Lightroom......




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Alan Klein

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2011, 08:08:27 am »

Thanks for both of your suggestions.  I just checked and I see that Elements has Contact sheet printing. You can select multiple images for printing on one sheet.   I did all my adjustments until I was satisfied with the picture on my monitor.  I then created 2 duplicates of the image in Photoshop and  did my final print variables (basically contrast and saturation from my past experience of what doesn't usually match).   Then, I saved each so I had three slightly different files - the original plus 2 variables.    Then selected all 3 for printing on one contact sheet.

It's a little clunky.  Also, each image is not scaled to the actual size so that may throw off the whole purpose of trying to decide which of the 3 is the best to print at the full size.  I was wondering if anyone has tried contact sheet printing as a way of testing the print and has a better routine then this?  Especially one that would crop out the same section of each of the 3 files to the final scale of the paper?  Sort of what they use to do in film printing with test strips.  Thanks  Alan.

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2011, 08:23:30 am »

The idea behind a color-managed workflow is to take the trail-and-error part out of the equation (to the bigger extend at least).
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Alan Klein

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2011, 05:47:06 pm »

Color managed workflow seems to be a good idea.  However, my problem is not color fidelity as much as it is contrast and saturation.  What looks good on the screen tends to get flat on the printout.  It seems that's due as you said to the difference in the contrast levels between print and monitor.  So I still would like to try the "test strips".  If anyone can improve upon my suggestion above, that would be helpful.

John McDermott

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2011, 09:58:55 pm »

Qimage also has a test strip function wherein you canprint on say 4" x 6" a section of a 16" x 20" print. Just select the section that has the characteristics you are trying to measure and print. Saves a lot of paper.
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John E. McDermott

Alan Klein

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2011, 10:34:00 pm »

John:  Can you select let's say a test strip from three different image files to print on the same paper so you can compare?

sm906

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2011, 02:57:56 am »

is not color fidelity as much as it is contrast and saturation.  What looks good on the screen tends to get flat on the printout.

Alan, that is also part of the color management game! The best paper won't be able to give you contrast and saturation when the ICC profile is not suitable. Anyway, don't let you fool by todays high contrast and 98% aRGB flat screens of i.e. Eizo, Quato, or NEC. Paper (and inks) still cannot give this high gamut, for several reasons. So when you say color is okay, but saturation and contrast are not if may either because a color management problem and/or the wrong paper for your motif. Which paper(s) are you using for you color prints? Is it a glossy / baryt paper or a matte cotton rag paper?

Thomas
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hsmeets

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2011, 06:37:06 am »

Color managed workflow seems to be a good idea.  However, my problem is not color fidelity as much as it is contrast and saturation.  What looks good on the screen tends to get flat on the printout.  It seems that's due as you said to the difference in the contrast levels between print and monitor.  So I still would like to try the "test strips".  If anyone can improve upon my suggestion above, that would be helpful.

Apparent lack of contrast and saturation is not only a result of the differences in media (screen vs paper/ink) but you might also have set your screen too bright (with a undifined white-point) and you evaluate the print in too dim light (with possibly the wrong colortemp of the light source). Proper color management will take a lot of pain from you away.
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Clearair

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2011, 06:54:08 am »

Not much help but if you ever see the pattern print option in the PS plugin driver that goes with the Canon 9500 series you will see an elegant solution. I will print out a sheet with a central image as default and then either brightness+ contrast or just colour balance examples as many as you like. It can really get you out of a hole with one shot.
The values are printed so it's very easy to dial in the correction needed.
WHY Canon see fit not to make this available in drivers with other printers, like my iPF6100 escapes me. I rely on colour management and the occasional test strip. Fortunately the iPF6100 is a stable platform.

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John McDermott

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2011, 07:54:41 am »

No, I don't believe so. In darkroom days I used to create strips with three or four different exposer times on on strip. In Qimage I believe that you can just create a small secion to avoid printing large prints and wating paper.
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John E. McDermott

Alan Klein

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Re: Printing proofs and samples
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2011, 10:38:53 am »

I'd like to attack this logically to see if the problem is in the "monitor" or in the print process or both.  Can someone who has a calibrated monitor or even a non-calibrated monitor tell me if my gallery pictures are meeting "normal" colors, contrast, etc. according to your perception?  I'm not trying to match colors for a product ad.  However, flesh tones should be normal and landscape colors natural looking.   If they aren't then monitor calibration would be the first thing I should to do.  Let me know what's wrong with a specific picture so I can see if I see the same problem with my monitor.  If you think the monitor pictures are generally "normal", than the problem seems to be in the print process.
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