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Author Topic: Photography Workshop & Seminars!  (Read 25547 times)

Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2011, 12:58:12 pm »

So, what exactly is your monetary connection to this seminar?  Your posts reek of being "shameless plugs".  If you have some type of business connection with this seminar, please be honest and tell us.  If you do not have a business interest in promoting this seminar, please accept my apology.

Hey Bryan, i was at the seminar/workshop yesterday which lasted 12 hours. I am a great fan of playboy and playboy photography.
I always thought playboy photographers were very talented and to some extent i thought their work at pb didn't do justice to their
talent.

The workshops yesterday at shoot the centerfold were the best every i have seen, i am blown away at the knowledge and experience
Jarmo  and Arny and David shared with everyone. Lots of one on one training....simply the best seminar ever.

Sid

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Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2011, 01:03:27 pm »

Trying to get the hang of posting pics.

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Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2011, 01:05:09 pm »

Perhaps the subject is Shoot The Centerfold Seminar?

Thanks for the welcome, skeptisim is healthy  ;D
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Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #23 on: February 01, 2011, 05:53:08 pm »


Photoshop didn't invent retouching, it just introduced it to the masses.

Playboy was way ahead of the curve of the massively retouched image.

Even before electronic retouching, working on dye transfers, if you saw a acetate overly on a playboy centerfold work print, there was so many china maker corrections you couldn't see the model underneath the acetate.

Also the centerfold and cover were printed in Gravure.

At the time Penthouse took nudes to a more realistic look, a little older, less retouched, a little more real, though they used a David Hamilton Fog filter which I believe cut down on some of the retouching costs.

For brief moments, OUI was the the nude art magazine, but eventually came out in many styles, now I believe it's a wedding magazine.

The branding of playboy was the girl next door.

Penthouse, the lonely rich housewife.

Oui was the European encounter.

At least that's what I've been told.


BC



True...
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Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2011, 05:55:44 pm »

I think that the real problem with the Centrefold has always been the same thing: camera format.

I remember during all those years when I subscribed to the magazine that the foldout was always the single sad moment. The same shooters did beautiful 'general' stuff of the same girls in the normal parts of the issues, but the big format turned everything into still life, and that doesn't work with people. I wouldn't blame the photographers for that.

It's somethimg I always disliked about some fashion photography too: overlit, losing the whole point of the exercise, which is about look and emotional kick. But I believe it was a Hef thing. As he pays the bills... But then, some people also buy inflatable dolls, so perhaps plastic (rubber?) skin has its appeal and following.

Rob C

They did talk about this during the early session of the seminar. It was about pb format, i think photographers went beyond that and
created their own style within that format.l
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Spryseks

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PierreVandevenne

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #26 on: February 05, 2011, 06:24:14 pm »

Great pic - great composition. And you were careful enough not to use flash!
One can almost smell the dusty carpet.
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feppe

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #27 on: February 05, 2011, 06:55:03 pm »

They did talk about this during the early session of the seminar. It was about pb format, i think photographers went beyond that and
created their own style within that format.l

That's even more gibberish than text generated by Markov chains.

feppe

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #28 on: February 05, 2011, 09:48:16 pm »

What I have noticed over the last few years is that more and more photo workshops pop up everywhere. There's more money in selling the dream of being a photographer than actually being a photographer.

I see more shooters teaching classes and workshops nowadays. I would rather just do something else interely than the mundane of teaching others how to shoot the same thing over and over.

The strength of any type of art lies in the originality of the creators and not the repetition of all the emulators.

It's even more telling that some of the most well-known, established photographers with long and illustrious careers have several workshops - Joe McNally perhaps the best example. If even someone who's shot for National Geographic and LIFE sees more business in workshops, it's not very encouraging for pro wannabes.

Rob C

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #29 on: February 06, 2011, 05:29:27 am »

John and feppe - you both echo my own feeling on this. I was never up in the exalted and rarified air that some of these people are supposed to breathe, but I can assure you that I never had the least interest in, nor time to indulge at playing camera club host. There is something sad about it all right!

But then, it's not new within the arts: guess how many people exit art school to resurface within a short while doing the same thing but from the other side of the desk in some local school where they deal with kids not in the least interested in any of it. They are the fortunate ones. It seems that most such people pocket their diploma and head for the hills and become farmers, aim for that distant beach and become surf bums or drop into the last-chance saloon of the unemployment bureau. It also happened with photo-school leavers, but now it's caught up with those already established in their profession. Truly a bad career choice if you are still able to make choices and don't have that compulsion that might, just might, save you and let you succeed, though it will probably destroy you instead.

Rob C

LKaven

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #30 on: February 07, 2011, 05:11:23 pm »

That's even more gibberish than text generated by Markov chains.
As true as it is funny.

Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2011, 01:05:43 pm »

John and feppe - you both echo my own feeling on this. I was never up in the exalted and rarified air that some of these people are supposed to breathe, but I can assure you that I never had the least interest in, nor time to indulge at playing camera club host. There is something sad about it all right!

But then, it's not new within the arts: guess how many people exit art school to resurface within a short while doing the same thing but from the other side of the desk in some local school where they deal with kids not in the least interested in any of it. They are the fortunate ones. It seems that most such people pocket their diploma and head for the hills and become farmers, aim for that distant beach and become surf bums or drop into the last-chance saloon of the unemployment bureau. It also happened with photo-school leavers, but now it's caught up with those already established in their profession. Truly a bad career choice if you are still able to make choices and don't have that compulsion that might, just might, save you and let you succeed, though it will probably destroy you instead.

Rob C


Come to think of it, pretty much in every profession or field for that matter most come back to it even after reaching their peak and retirement, in
some form of a teacher, trainer, consultant etc. Take for instance football players as soon as they retire they are on espn as an expert commentrator or something. I simply think we are too hard on our profession, hobby or a photography enthusiast when it comes to things like these. Well being a
critic is okay but being a harsh critic it gotta produce some sort of challenge not negative mentatlity. My two cents on that hope i didn't offend anyone.

Sid
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Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #32 on: February 08, 2011, 01:10:51 pm »

It's even more telling that some of the most well-known, established photographers with long and illustrious careers have several workshops - Joe McNally perhaps the best example. If even someone who's shot for National Geographic and LIFE sees more business in workshops, it's not very encouraging for pro wannabes.

IMHO if i want to be someone like National Geographic or LIFE photographer that means i am impressed more on their career success rather than
their talent.

That LIFE magazine subject brings memories of TIME LIFE photography annual issue which contained the best photographers work from around the
world. I think i have dated myself here.
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feppe

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #33 on: February 08, 2011, 03:02:45 pm »

IMHO if i want to be someone like National Geographic or LIFE photographer that means i am impressed more on their career success rather than
their talent.

That LIFE magazine subject brings memories of TIME LIFE photography annual issue which contained the best photographers work from around the
world. I think i have dated myself here.

And here I thought you were a Markov chain - actual content :P

Getting in prestigious magazines is obviously not guarantee of "talent," but most photographers would almost kill to get on the pages of NG. Besides, Mr McNally is talented and successful, yet he still sees ROI on doing workshops. I've seen his spirited tutorials on Kelby Training and he's very good at teaching, and of course it could be that he just enjoys doing them - that's what everyone arranging workshops claims.

Schewe

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #34 on: February 08, 2011, 03:22:58 pm »

I've seen his spirited tutorials on Kelby Training and he's very good at teaching, and of course it could be that he just enjoys doing them - that's what everyone arranging workshops claims.

To be clear, yes Joe enjoys teaching...and yes, he's good at it. Not all good photographers make for a good teacher. Different mind and skill set. And yes, in this day and age, it makes a lot of financial sense to have a diversified source of income...it allows you to pick and choose what you shoot and gives you more flexibility–which is also a factor in how good of a photographer you can be.

I spent 25 years as an advertising photographer. I'm not a reformed ad shooter and teaching, writing and developing software allows me to pick and choose what I shoot. I no longer shoot for clients, I shoot for myself (which is a lot more fun).
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Rob C

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #35 on: February 08, 2011, 04:22:19 pm »

To be clear, yes Joe enjoys teaching...and yes, he's good at it. Not all good photographers make for a good teacher. Different mind and skill set. And yes, in this day and age, it makes a lot of financial sense to have a diversified source of income...it allows you to pick and choose what you shoot and gives you more flexibility–which is also a factor in how good of a photographer you can be.

I spent 25 years as an advertising photographer. I'm not a reformed ad shooter and teaching, writing and developing software allows me to pick and choose what I shoot. I no longer shoot for clients, I shoot for myself (which is a lot more fun).



And that's where we disgree fundamentally: without the client's desire/need for you to do something for him, there is just no buzz (for me). It's more about being thought of as essential to something than about the money. I know perfectly well this isn't good business, but it's still the basic motivator even if in practice you do use your business head first! I can't buy that in teaching where those who seek one out don't know much, because if they did they wouldn't need one's input. A professional level of client usually does know who and what he needs. It's about that informed external respect for what you can do, and the willingness to pay well for a part of it.

Who said it isn't an ego trip?

Rob C

Schewe

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #36 on: February 08, 2011, 06:23:18 pm »

And that's where we disgree fundamentally: without the client's desire/need for you to do something for him, there is just no buzz (for me).

Do you honestly think it's "fun" to shoot for today's clients? Really? Back in the day I used to say that my goal was to shoot "really neat stuff" for an "obscene amount of money" and for "really talented art directors"...any two of the proceeding three criteria would be sufficient. Today, it's really boring stuff for little money with people who don't know shyte. Heck, I would still be working of I could get one of the three criteria...but it just ain't worth the hassle...I much prefer going out to shoot, whatever....with no idiots, a$$holes nor tiny payments involved.

I got into photography for the love of the art...was willing to work in the field for lots of money and now I'm back to shooting for the love of the art. Over the years, I've learned a lot...I'm happy to pass it long–for compensation of course :~)
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Rob C

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #37 on: February 09, 2011, 02:55:45 pm »


 1. Do you honestly think it's "fun" to shoot for today's clients? Really? Back in the day I used to say that my goal was to shoot "really neat stuff" for an "obscene amount of money" and for "really talented art directors"...any two of the proceeding three criteria would be sufficient. Today, it's really boring stuff for little money with people who don't know shyte. Heck, I would still be working of I could get one of the three criteria...but it just ain't worth the hassle...I much prefer going out to shoot, whatever....with no idiots, a$$holes nor tiny payments involved.

2. I got into photography for the love of the art...was willing to work in the field for lots of money and now I'm back to shooting for the love of the art. Over the years, I've learned a lot...I'm happy to pass it long–for compensation of course :~)


Well, taking your (1) first: I have no idea about today's clients; I'm retired and I imagine clients were ever the same - the good, the bad and the downright ugly. But they needed what I could provide, and that mattered.

Moving on to (2): same reason to start as mine, but once I realised that I had a moneymaker too, I didn't like giving it away. Probably became a hooker by trade... but expensive enough to cut the clients down a fair bit, which might have been great for the ego but questionable for the bank.

But we do what we do, and there's no second chance.

Now, I would rather do nothing than spend it doing classes and demos. Frankly, I don't think I could. It was either for real or not at all. Just like love.

;-)

Rob C

Spryseks

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #38 on: February 09, 2011, 07:56:28 pm »

I consider Jarmo Pohjaniemi as one of the best in the industry. He has created his own style which few do, especially
being mentioned along with Steve McCurry, Marc Chagall, Guido Argentini etc..



This Art Basel display of work includes lot of great photographers. Among them is that famours NG cover picture of Afghani G
girl along with Jarmo's work. I could be a little biased since i am from Miami and so is Jarmo, but you don't see a lot of photogs
(whether they are from NG, Maxim, Time or Playboy) in that list of known names unless they are best at what they do.


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Rob C

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Re: Shoot The Centerfold Seminar
« Reply #39 on: February 10, 2011, 04:38:49 am »

This Art Basel display of work includes lot of great photographers. Among them is that famours NG cover picture of Afghani G
girl along with Jarmo's work. I could be a little biased since i am from Miami and so is Jarmo, but you don't see a lot of photogs
(whether they are from NG, Maxim, Time or Playboy) in that list of known names unless they are best at what they do.



Seems to me that all that's needed nowadays is a pair of oversized knockers and the hell with the rest.

Was a time that some notion of beauty and/or chic played a part; guess this new way is progress.

Rob C
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