IPF8300 printing woes

[vindog]

I bought a shiny new printer and installed it with loving care, reading the manual step by step (something I rarely do).  All things in place and the printer prints nicely...but then when about to cut it has a hardware error.  An hour on the phone with the vendor LexJet, two hours on the phone with Canon support and we need to get a tech out (I've only had the printer for 2 days.)   

They overnight a huge long box and another big box of parts.

Two days later the tech shows up, a kindly man who reminded me of my late father.  I'm 50 so you can understand what I'm saying.   

He looked aghast at all the parts and wondered why they sent all that to fix a cutter error.   Long/short is he spent all day dismantling the printer and putting it back together (almost) before leaving.  It did print, it did cut.   

It wasn't until after he left that I noticed some parts falling off of the printer...literally.  I did my best to put the parts back on and ran some test prints.   It started out printing just fine, then towards the last 4 inches of a print it began a magenta cast.   Everything after that has this cast now.

I called and complained, and they sent the next printer tech out; he put back the parts that were falling off, and ran some hardware tests and said it's all fine.  We printed some samples and I still get the magenta cast.  He says it must be the driver.   I do not agree since it was printing fine before the machine got exploded.


Now I've tried to "turn off color management" from the printer but I don't even know if I have that option.  When the driver comes up it is grayed out for Color matching.

I am trying to print from CS4 and the Print plugin, and also tried directly with the print driver.   I am using Mac 10.5.8, and also tried with Lightroom 3.  I have CS5 but was told the print plugin isn't 64bit so I have to use CS4 for that.

Anyway it seems like after this nightmare someone should be able to come to the office and run tests to see if the printer is printing correct color before they leave.   Do printer techs not know anything about color?  I thought they'd be better than I am..

[Scott Martin]

The plug-in works great in CS5 when CS5 is run in 32bit mode. The 64 bit version is due out soon. Sounds like your drivers and software are fine. If "no color management" is grayed out you're good.  You might have an air bubble in your lines preventing a color from reaching the head. Perform a nozzle check and clean if needed. Don't forget to calibrate to your favorite paper (and one that you'll have around for future calibrations). Don't give up! These wrinkles can happen with any printer - especially when knew.

[jgbowerman]

The plug-in works great in CS5 when CS5 is run in 32bit mode. The 64 bit version is due out soon. Sounds like your drivers and software are fine. If "no color management" is grayed out you're good.  You might have an air bubble in your lines preventing a color from reaching the head. Perform a nozzle check and clean if needed. Don't forget to calibrate to your favorite paper (and one that you'll have around for future calibrations). Don't give up! These wrinkles can happen with any printer - especially when knew.

Yes, make sure to run a calibration. Canon tech support failed on this critical detail by informing me calibration was automatic with initial startup when this is not true. Being my second iPF printer and having read Onsight's iPF8300 review, I did not take this advice and instead questioned my vendor, ColorHQ, and they confirmed the necessity of running a printer calibration and the fact it is not automatically done. Printer calibration is normally a one-time effort unless changing printheads down the road. However, only a limited selection of papers can be used for calibration purposes. I was advised by ColorHQ tech support to use the sample paper that comes with the printer for calibration, and then save the remainder in the event recalibration becomes necessary. This way, you won't be required to buy a roll of paper you might not otherwise have in possession for running future calibrations.

Another recommendation I'd consider is an upgrade to OSX 10.6.4.

[vindog]

Thanks all; a follow up to this story is that Canon and Pitney Bowes have come a total of FIVE times to repair the printer, so I've been unable to actually spend time printing.

I am able to get the color I expect finally, but only using the IPF plugin.  Lightroom printing is just bad no matter what I do so I'm giving up, and printing from CS4 and the 32 bit plugin.

Calibration has to be done every time you fart near the thing, so that got done and all is fine now.   

A RANT:   printing and color management is a pretty lame and overly complex process that should be handled in software FAR better (by a magnitude of thousands of times better).

1.  I should be able to drag/drop the paper profile to the printer, and it should automatically be available.  DONE
2.  The printing should be independent of viewing; the color management should be from my original mapped right to the printer and the paper profile with NO effort on my part.  Monitors and calibration come and go, but the file should be the main source of the color information
3.  Papers should have a mechanism for self profiling.  The printer and driver should always know what paper is loaded and what size it is with no effort whatsoever. If there was a standard for "reading paper data" from the backside of the paper, barcoding, whatever, we could load paper and the printer would know what it has.  This would be an improvement over #1. 

I'm just venting because I think the printer makers are so intent on selling ink and media that ease of use is the last thing on their minds.   Looking at interfaces on mac/pc, epson or canon; they all suck and way too complicated...if you think its easy its because you've trained yourself to think it is.   

[Doyle Yoder]

if you think its easy its because you've trained yourself to think it is.   

You've obviously trained yourself to think it is complicated. The internet is full of good information.

http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en#sclient=psy&hl=en&site=webhp&source=hp&q=color+management+tutorial&aq=1l&aqi=g-l8g-lm2&aql=&oq=color+mamangement+t&gs_rfai=CIMqqMDCNTJezCIzmNO-52agGAAAAqgQFT9AsbR0&psj=1&fp=ab5cdb1806fef4aa

[feppe]

You've obviously trained yourself to think it is complicated. The internet is full of good information.

http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en#sclient=psy&hl=en&site=webhp&source=hp&q=color+management+tutorial&aq=1l&aqi=g-l8g-lm2&aql=&oq=color+mamangement+t&gs_rfai=CIMqqMDCNTJezCIzmNO-52agGAAAAqgQFT9AsbR0&psj=1&fp=ab5cdb1806fef4aa

I've ranted about the same as the OP in the past - and while the internets are full of good information, it doesn't change the fact that color management is complicated.

Flaky "pro" printers taking 5 tech visits and countless lost work hours are adding insult to injury.

[Doyle Yoder]

I've ranted about the same as the OP in the past - and while the internets are full of good information, it doesn't change the fact that color management is complicated.

Flaky "pro" printers taking 5 tech visits and countless lost work hours are adding insult to injury.

A flaky printer or a tech that does not understand anything about CM is one thing, but that has nothing to do with a color managed workflow. If this is a new printer the OP should be able to get Canon to just replace it.

Post exactly what do you think is complicated about color management. There are many of us here that can respond to exactly what you have questions about.

[feppe]

Post exactly what do you think is complicated about color management. There are many of us here that can respond to exactly what you have questions about.

Color management is complicated to someone who's never done it before, regardless of IT proficiency. I'm very proficient, but learning the ins and outs of color management took hours and hours, and far too many sheets of paper. In any case, I'm not going to hijack the thread further as this is a pointless argument.

I have my color managed workflow in order, and don't have questions at the moment, but thanks.

[vindog]

You've obviously trained yourself to think it is complicated. The internet is full of good information.

http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en#sclient=psy&hl=en&site=webhp&source=hp&q=color+management+tutorial&aq=1l&aqi=g-l8g-lm2&aql=&oq=color+mamangement+t&gs_rfai=CIMqqMDCNTJezCIzmNO-52agGAAAAqgQFT9AsbR0&psj=1&fp=ab5cdb1806fef4aa

You've just made my point.  347,000 urls of helpful content that good software could eliminate.   Maybe inkjet printing is an artform unto itself, much like complex darkroom printing techniques of the past.  However, it seems like the major players have been in the game along time now, and that profiling simply would have made its way into the "workflow" with automation;  it hasn't yet and we've had some darn fine printers for at least the past 6 years.    Perhaps it was so much of clusterkludge before that old timers think this is a breeze but from a newbie's perspective it really it is a long way off. 

And I'm critical about software since that is what I do for a living (project manage software development.)   I just think there's plenty of "nuances all self-printers can worry about" without olor profiling, matching, paper profiling  to fuss over.  Maybe we are still in the pioneering stages still of inkjet printing.

[Doyle Yoder]

What would you like the software to do?

As it is now.

Calibrate your printer.
Correctly calibrate your monitor and then create a profile of it.
Capture your image tagged with the correct profile for your capture device or assign correct profile for it in PS or app of your choice.
Convert to working profile if not already tagged by capture device.
Adjust image to your liking in PS or app of your choice.
Print image from app (or with plugin) with assign printer paper profile based on media setting in driver for your printer.
Then select that media setting in print driver or plugin.
This assumes No Color Correction is set in the driver. With the plugin you just need to select paper profile based on the media setting.
All current iPF drivers will work correctly with the lasted apps that use Apple's new printing path as long the AppColorMatchingInfo.xml in the driver files is updated to include the latest applications.

Not that difficult.

http://canonipf.wikispaces.com/message/list/FAQ is a good source for all thing related to printing with the Canon iPF printers.

[jgbowerman]

Perhaps it was so much of clusterkludge before that old timers think this is a breeze but from a newbie's perspective it really it is a long way off. 

And I'm critical about software since that is what I do for a living (project manage software development.)   I just think there's plenty of "nuances all self-printers can worry about" without olor profiling, matching, paper profiling  to fuss over.  Maybe we are still in the pioneering stages still of inkjet printing.

I am a newbie, I've been printing for almost one year (iPF6100 and 8300). Having retired from my former career, I have devoted a full-time schedule to learn color workflow (you talk about an eye opener). I've read every well know reference two or three times in my struggle to understand. I also learned Photoshop at the same time, starting with CS4. The only thing more complicated to me than learning color workflow was learning Photoshop! I have no background in software. I had been shooting with slide film for 20 years before getting my first point-and-shoot 10 years ago, my first DSLR (D50) four years ago. When purchasing the D50, I remember the guy at the local photography shop (now out of business) trying to explain a histogram to me. I was completely baffled, looking at him like he was nuts talking such tech-speak. All in good time, sure enough, I got sucked into this vortex of learning digital photography from capture to print, changing careers in the process.

My first point: If I can do it, anyone can! Buckle down and figure it out. We have vastly more resources today than we had in the days of film enabling anyone who has the ambition to take photography anywhere their heart desires... if they have the passion and a positive attitude.

My second point: The more automated we allow our workflow to become, the more we will become stranded when the automation fails. Too much automation, and we have a Lexus without brakes. IMO, automation has practical and desirable limits. It is why I don't set my camera to AUTO.

[Doyle Yoder]

My second point: The more automated we allow our workflow to become, the more we will become stranded when the automation fails. Too much automation, and we have a Lexus without brakes. IMO, automation has practical and desirable limits. It is why I don't set my camera to AUTO.

Absolutely, this is exactly what Apple did with the new printing path that PS and LR use. Until the creators of printer drivers got their act together it caused all kinds of double profiling problems.