How to soft proof Epson Advanced Black & White?

[robgo2]

How does one do proper soft proofing for an image that will be printed using the ABW driver?  If I do not have a specific ABW profile for the particular paper that I will be using (such as Eric Chan provides for some papers,) do I use the "Working Gray - Gamma 2.2" custom setting?  Eric does offer custom ABW profiles, but I do not know if he has been able to overcome some difficulties with Snow Leopard yet.

Rob

[natas]

How does one do proper soft proofing for an image that will be printed using the ABW driver?  If I do not have a specific ABW profile for the particular paper that I will be using (such as Eric Chan provides for some papers,) do I use the "Working Gray - Gamma 2.2" custom setting?  Eric does offer custom ABW profiles, but I do not know if he has been able to overcome some difficulties with Snow Leopard yet.

Rob

I don't think there is a way (or atleast none that I have heard). This is one thing that has always annoyed me about the ABW mode.

[Ernst Dinkla]

How does one do proper soft proofing for an image that will be printed using the ABW driver?  If I do not have a specific ABW profile for the particular paper that I will be using (such as Eric Chan provides for some papers,) do I use the "Working Gray - Gamma 2.2" custom setting?  Eric does offer custom ABW profiles, but I do not know if he has been able to overcome some difficulties with Snow Leopard yet.

Rob

There is only one way to do it and it is a limited method. A QTR custom B&W profile created for the paper and specific ABW contrast and color tone settings. The softproof is based on the L greyscale curve in the profile and the a+b color curve representations. With the ABW settings changed the softproof will not correspond anymore. I think Eric Chan's profiles will act the same. That means every other setting of the ABW controls asks for another QTR profile to get a correct softproof.

ABW has its own tone and color simulation preview but that is a more generic method and the same for all output.

In driver color mode and the B&W image color toned itself or not you can depend on normal ICC profile color softproofs. With Epson drivers the B&W print then will contain more CMY composite grey color mixing than with the HP Z drivers in color mode and more CMY composite grey than in Epson's ABW mode.


met vriendelijke groeten, Ernst Dinkla

Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions for Photoshop
http://www.pigment-print.com/dinklacanvaswraps/index.html

[Farmer]

This might prove useful:

http://people.csail.mit.edu/ericchan/dp/Ep...bw_gray_profile

[robgo2]

This might prove useful:

http://people.csail.mit.edu/ericchan/dp/Ep...bw_gray_profile

Yes, I am already aware of Eric's excellent website.  I have been using his ABW profiles for GFS and Canson Infinity Baryta, and I find that they work quite well.

I am expecting a shipment of the Canson 17x22 inch paper in about a week.  If it also shows scratches coming out of the printer, I will have to try a non-baryta paper.  Any suggestions?  Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Pearl interests me, but it is frightfully expensive.

BTW, I am not at all pleased that a professional level printer, such as the 3880, should have such a problem.  There should be no way that standard sized paper should be coming in contact with anything that can damage the printing surface.

Rob

[madmanchan]

Hi Rob, that's a good question. Unfortunately I don't think there's an easy way to do a soft proof unless a profile is available. That is, there's not a way to get a preview/simulation of the paper tint, and the relative dynamic range compression that will happen due to the paper/ink contrast limits.

[John R Smith]

I am a little bit puzzled as to why this is such a problem.

I have been printing B/W photographs for the last three years using an Epson R2400, always using the ABW, and using the Harman gloss FB paper mostly - before that the Innova USG. My monitor is a pretty basic Philips 19 inch panel, profiled using Spyder 2. My prints always match what I see on my display to my satisfaction - I never get any nasty surprises, my highlight and shadow areas match up just fine. And after years in the wet darkroom, I am pretty sensitive to variations in brightness and contrast. I have never felt any need for soft-proofing in the ABW mode at all. So I would feel that if there is any significant difference between your print and the display in terms of luminance values, you should sort out your monitor profile and your paper profiles first. As for the ABW tint (if you use that for toning) there is no way to soft-proof that other than by doing a small workprint (say A6) which only takes a minute or so. And once you have your favourite ABW tints (such as h2 v10) worked out you can incorporate them into a Lightroom template and just use them as required. Once I got them set up for the paper types I use I have never changed them anyhow.

John

[Alan Goldhammer]

I am expecting a shipment of the Canson 17x22 inch paper in about a week.  If it also shows scratches coming out of the printer, I will have to try a non-baryta paper.  Any suggestions?  Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Pearl interests me, but it is frightfully expensive.

BTW, I am not at all pleased that a professional level printer, such as the 3880, should have such a problem.  There should be no way that standard sized paper should be coming in contact with anything that can damage the printing surface.

Rob

I think it's a result of the lack of vacuum support in the drive path.  The larger Epson printers all have this and it ensures that the paper stays flat during printing.  The Canson (and Ilford GFS) paper is quite thin and flexible.  As ink is loaded onto the surface you get the buckling of the paper which is visible as it come out.  I've noticed that this is more pronounced for 81/2 x 11 paper than 13x19 (I have not printed on 17 inch wide paper).  Rag based paper are thicker and more rigid.  I print on a number of different rag based papers and you don't see anywhere near the type of curl as with the alpha-cellulose papers.  I like Museo papers a lot and they are the most stable in this regard.  I tested Photo Rag Bayta this past weekend and it seemed to come out flat.  It is more expensive than either the Canson or Ilford papers.  Such is the trade off that we are faced with.

Alan

[robgo2]

I think it's a result of the lack of vacuum support in the drive path.  The larger Epson printers all have this and it ensures that the paper stays flat during printing.  The Canson (and Ilford GFS) paper is quite thin and flexible.  As ink is loaded onto the surface you get the buckling of the paper which is visible as it come out.  I've noticed that this is more pronounced for 81/2 x 11 paper than 13x19 (I have not printed on 17 inch wide paper).  Rag based paper are thicker and more rigid.  I print on a number of different rag based papers and you don't see anywhere near the type of curl as with the alpha-cellulose papers.  I like Museo papers a lot and they are the most stable in this regard.  I tested Photo Rag Bayta this past weekend and it seemed to come out flat.  It is more expensive than either the Canson or Ilford papers.  Such is the trade off that we are faced with.

Alan

Alan,

You may be correct about the lack of vacuum to hold the paper flat, but the printer is designed to print on 17x22 inch sheets, so I see the scratching problem as a design flaw.  I also think that baryta surfaces are exceptionally fragile and prone to scratching.  Strangely, I have had no problem with the 8.5x11 and 13x19 inch sheets.  The one trick that I have not yet tried is printing from the front manual loader.  Possibly, the paper will lie flatter.  I have sufficient space behind my printer to at least give this a try.

Thanks to all for the advice.

Rob