Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas  (Read 7528 times)

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« on: May 07, 2010, 04:07:16 pm »

I'm wanting to try another canvas and I've narrowed it down to Fredrix 901WR matte, or Lexjet Sunset Select Matte.

What I want to see is the texture of these two canvases.  Does anyone here who prints on these have a closeup shot or a scanned image of the canvas that you can post here for me to see the texture?

It gets expensive when you order an entire roll of canvas and then find out the texture is not what you want.  I'm looking for both a smooth surface (portraits) to replace Black Diamond, and a more toothy, rugged texture (landscapes and artwork) to replace Canon.

Thanks!
Logged

dgberg

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2763
    • http://bergsprintstudio.com http://bergscustomfurniture.com
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2010, 05:01:30 pm »

Why don't you call and ask for a sample? I would just  buy a roll of each to test. Its not expensive at all a 17" roll of lexjet is less then $60.00
Also how have you narrowed it down if you have not printed on it yet?
« Last Edit: May 07, 2010, 05:05:49 pm by Dan Berg »
Logged

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2010, 05:52:57 pm »

I've narrowed it down to what I want to try, based on research and on price.

It's not that cheap here, I'm in Canada.  

Most places I've asked for a sample have ignored my request.
Logged

bill t.

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3011
    • http://www.unit16.net
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2010, 06:54:26 pm »

Lexjet Sunset is MUCH whiter than Fredrix 901, which is probably due to optical brighteners.  Sunset is capable of really bright, rich prints, and when comparing the gamut graphs considerably beats a well regarded canvas who's initial is "L".  901 by comparison is more subdued, definitely a few shades darker.

The overall texture of each is in what I think of as the middle range.

The single roll of 901 I have for reference shows a texture that is notably polarized in one direction across the width of the roll.  The unkindest comparison would be to the corrugations in cardboard, but much subtler and with texture in the 90 degree direction as well.  That's pretty standard for most canvases.

The texture on Lexjet is a little more symmetrical with only a very slight bias in one direction.  The unkindest comparison would be "screen door" but it actually doesn't come off that way on the wall.  Both landscape and portrait orientations prints on Lexjet Sunset can be displayed side by side without a noticeable textural difference, which is not the case for most canvases.

901 probably prints a tad sharper than Lexjet Sunset.  Neither prints as sharp as Fredrix 777 Vivid which also has one of the finest canvas textures I have seen.

Unfortunately Fredrix does not have particularly admirable quality control, which is why I have switched to Lexjet for medium and low end work.  Lexjet Sunset is one of the most consistent canvases I have seen, which really matters when you're doing production.  The last 10 or so rolls of Fredrix I have used had serious problems with improper winding that led to head strikes on the edges of the rolls, and also 2 or 3 conspicuous weave discontinuities per roll that were enough to cause rejected, 8 foot long pano prints.

I understand what you mean about the expense of testing.  But in comparing samples I have received with the actual on-the-roll product, there is often quite a difference.  Canvas textures sort of mutate over time, and I have seen sudden major changes in the texture and brightness of canvases more than once, as for instance a major sea-change in Epson Premium Canvas Matte about a year ago.  Best to order a roll of current stock of whatever canvases you are considering before buying any volume.
Logged

dgberg

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2763
    • http://bergsprintstudio.com http://bergscustomfurniture.com
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2010, 05:43:50 am »

I have very little to add to Bills excellent response other then I really want you to get off on the right foot. When I hear you have made selections based on price and internet searches alone I just cringe. Before I opened my gallery I took months printing samples. I got 8 different rolls of materials. I ordered 3 types of varnish for testing. I printed samples on matte on gloss on semi gloss. I mixed Glamor II every way you can mix it till I was blue in the face. I did stretch tests to see what kind of ink cracking I got with different topcoats. You start to get the drift of how the texture starts to dissapear if you put too many coats of glamor on. If you want your end product to have the best quality look and feel available it takes an investment in time and money. It was not possible from your post to determine if you have done this for 5 years in which case I am blowing in the wind. Almost all paper companies sell sample packs that include canvas. Usually only several sheets. Would be enough to look at and feel the texture which would at least get you started. Call around most if not all legit businesses today will be more then happy for a new customer and might just cut you a sample if can talk to the right person. Lexjet is my "2010 Canvas Workshop" sponsor and have been just great to work with. Call them in Florida and ask for Kelly Price. She will steer you in the right direction.
Oh by the way. Of the 8 rolls I purchased for startup I used 6 of them for printing samples and also printed the final 40 gallery wraps for the Gallery. Even the canvas that did not make the cut as my final choice was still used up.
 Good luck with your project.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2010, 09:27:49 am by Dan Berg »
Logged

cyberworldsinc

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 19
    • http://www.jackjohnsonphoto.com
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2010, 09:39:45 am »

Lexjet has a great 30-day money-back guarantee which I've made use of once in testing their products (quality of the product was great, just didn't match my needs). They are a great company to deal with - everyone I've spoken to there has been friendly and helpful.

I'm a very happy customer!

- Jack
Logged
Jack Johnson
[url=http://www.jackjohnson

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2010, 10:13:48 am »

Good to hear you're happy with them, cyberworld.  Customer service goes a long way.

Dan, I've been printing for about 8 or 9 years or so now.  I have tried lots of canvases out there.  Let me rephrase what I said and say that I narrowed the choices down to two for the "new" canvas I want to try now.

I have a couple of new clients that want me to print for them on an ongoing basis.  They don't want to pay a premium price for me to use a premium canvas.  They're okay with a middle-of-the-road type of canvas.  That's why I was looking for a cheaper alternative.

Up until about a year ago I never did any stretching or wraps.  Everything was printed, matted and framed.  About a year ago I began stretching and wrapping and the canvas I had been using all along started to give me problems when wrapping due to cracking.  Love the canvas, bright white, has great texture, but sucks when wrapped.

I have used a couple of different topcoats also and I've experimented the same way you described.

I know I've said this before, but things here in Canada are much more expensive and shipping fees are nuts.  We have to be careful of suppliers who use UPS exclusively as their shipping company.  When UPS arrives at your door in Canada they demand absolutely outrageous "brokerage fees".  Not everyone is willing to ship USPS, even if it means gaining a new customer.  I hate to say this, but it almost seems as though many US based suppliers don't want or care if they get Canadian customers.  I've talked to many people from many companies, requested samples etc... and I always seem "get lost" in their paperwork.  I'll wait weeks for something, call or e-mail the person again and they have no idea who I am and never sent anything out.  Once or twice I can see, but this is happening way too frequently.  So now when they "lose me" I stroke them off my list and I "lose them" as a potential new supplier.

Thanks for your insight and thoughts.  

Ken
Logged

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2010, 10:49:20 am »

Bill, You said you use Lexjet for medium and low end work.  I'm curious, what do you use for your higher end work?
Logged

dgberg

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2763
    • http://bergsprintstudio.com http://bergscustomfurniture.com
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2010, 11:12:49 am »

Ken,
Thanks for your reply as now everything falls into place much better. At around .90 a sq. ft. (IN US) the Lexjet Matte is really a steal.  When I purchased the first roll I was't sure what to expect because of the low price. I am happy to date with my only issues being some ink crack through on the back edge of the gallery wraps when stretching and stapling. A extra coat of Glamor helps but does not eliminate it completely. Always a work in progress this canvas.

bill t.

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3011
    • http://www.unit16.net
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2010, 01:55:03 pm »

Quote from: KenBabcock
Bill, You said you use Lexjet for medium and low end work.  I'm curious, what do you use for your higher end work?

By high end I mean my few collectors who specifically like the fine texture and (for canvas) sharp prints on Fredrix 777Vivid.  Collectors like to have something special.  Those prints are typically around 40" in the short dimension so they're printed on the widest rolls.

It almost seems like that for Fredrix the 24" rolls are made by a different manufacturer than the 36" inch and 44" rolls.  The QC on the wider rolls have been consistently better than on the 24" rolls.  Even the whiteness and texture are a different on the big Fredrix rolls, which are little less white and slightly more textured.  Or maybe they're just different batches and the 24" slitting and winding equipment stinks, who knows.  There are batch to batch differences in all canvases, particularly in the texture.

Visually I have to say that the Lexjet is capable of much more dynamic prints that 777Vivid, but dynamism isn't necessarily the best interpretation for every subject and it's nice the Lexjet can be throttled back when needed.

Middle range is everything else from art fairs to community centers to restaurants to country clubs to galleries, listed in order of profitability.  Low range is hotels and other bean-counting institutions.

Ken, do they still make Dura Canvas in Canada?  I tried some of their CAN901 a while back and it is truly an excellent canvas, fine texture and smooth coatings  I think the company name is Dura Textiles.  There was a glitch in the supply chain at that time, so I stopped trying.  I just searched "dura canvas" and got quite a few hits.
Logged

JeffKohn

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1668
    • http://jeffk-photo.typepad.com
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2010, 02:40:05 pm »

I don't know about Lexjet, but Fredrix makes 5-foot 24" sample rolls. Three of them showed up on my doorstep a week or so ago (901 WR, 777 Vivid, and 901 Pearl). I didn't even order/ask for them, I guessing it has something to do with having recently purchased an ipf6300 from Shades of Paper. Ironically they don't have canned profiles for the x300 series yet, so I haven't tried out the samples. I guess I'll need to do a custom profile first.

There's a page on the Fredrix website where you can request test samples: http://www.fredrixprintcanvas.com/PrintCan...estSamples.aspx. I don't know if your being in Canada will be an issue or not, though.
Logged
Jeff Kohn
[url=http://ww

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2010, 04:42:55 pm »

Jeff, I've filled out that form weeks ago and never heard anything back.  Will try again though.

Bill, Dura Textiles is a company in Quebec.  I was referred to them by someone else and was also told they produce excellent canvas.  When I tried calling Peter at Dura Textiles to speak with him, he was on vacation.  I do plan on trying their canvas though.  Shipping may be more reasonable since they are also in Canada.
Logged

Colorwave

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1006
    • Colorwave Imaging
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2010, 05:01:57 pm »

Ken-
You have a sympathetic ear here, regarding the shipping costs.  I'm in Hawaii, where we always seem to get an asterisk next to our shipping policies and costs.  From paying for shipping both directions here, I know that the actual costs are often ever so slightly higher than mainland US to US locations.  If I choose a vendor with free shipping or subsidized shipping ($10 or $15, for instance), then enter my location, it often jumps to $75 or sometimes even more for the same service.  I wind up picking and choosing vendors quite often based on shipping costs.  I can be charged anywhere from $20 to well over $100 for the same order from different vendors.  We don't even have the excuse of customs or tariffs for them to use.  I think it was quite different at one point to ship to Hawaii, and the old mindset often still prevails.  I go with the vendors that seem to want my business by not padding the shipping cost prohibitively.  I assume you do the same.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2010, 05:02:21 pm by Colorwave »
Logged
-Ron H.
[url=http://colorwaveimaging.com

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2010, 05:18:05 pm »

But you live in Hawaii - I'm jealous now!  hahah.

Shipping costs are bad enough to Canada, but when the UPS guy shows up with your canvas demanding another $75 on top of what was already paid for shipping, the canvas costs easily skyrocket to well over $200.

I have even researched coating my own canvas.  I found the company who sells the receptive coating to Dura Textiles, but it was going to cost almost as much to coat it myself.

Oh well.  You enjoy your nice weather in Hawaii.  I'll look outside and dream.  Only in Canada, 2 days ago it was over 30 degrees here, everyone sweating in shorts, A/C turned on.  Today it is below zero and just started snowing - in May.  Ahhh Canada.
Logged

bill t.

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3011
    • http://www.unit16.net
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2010, 05:32:04 pm »

Quote from: KenBabcock
Only in Canada, 2 days ago it was over 30 degrees here, everyone sweating in shorts, A/C turned on.
He means 30C, not 30F.  Canadians don't wear shorts until it's at least 2C, and save the air conditioners for heatwaves over 5C.
Logged

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2010, 08:23:46 pm »

hahahahahahaha - I literally laughed out loud at that because it's so true.  My wife wants to know why I'm laughing.

You'd be surprised at how many Canadians wear shorts in 2 degrees Celsius here.  Two weeks ago my two sons ( 4 and 8) were wearing shorts to school when it was just above 0 and so were all the other kids.  

Around the same time it was 8 degrees Celsius outside during the day/evening and I was putting the central air on.  So yeah, anything above 5C here is considered a heatwave - LOL
Logged

natas

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 269
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2010, 06:43:50 pm »

Quote from: KenBabcock
hahahahahahaha - I literally laughed out loud at that because it's so true.  My wife wants to know why I'm laughing.

You'd be surprised at how many Canadians wear shorts in 2 degrees Celsius here.  Two weeks ago my two sons ( 4 and 8) were wearing shorts to school when it was just above 0 and so were all the other kids.  

Around the same time it was 8 degrees Celsius outside during the day/evening and I was putting the central air on.  So yeah, anything above 5C here is considered a heatwave - LOL


Do you guys use the glossy lexjet canvas or the matt version? I noticed that the matte version is way cheaper.
Logged

bill t.

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3011
    • http://www.unit16.net
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2010, 08:18:09 pm »

Quote from: natas
Do you guys use the glossy lexjet canvas or the matt version? I noticed that the matte version is way cheaper.

I use the matte version, have never tried the glossy.  You can make matte look like luster with a heavy coat of glossy coating, or almost like gloss with a few heavy coats of glossy coating.  Or anthing in between by mixing matte & gloss coating.

If you are thinking of using gloss, check first to see if you need a solvent based coating, which is the case for the old style Epson gloss canvas shown on the Lexjet website.
Logged

KenBabcock

  • Guest
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #18 on: May 09, 2010, 08:19:14 pm »

Quote from: natas
Do you guys use the glossy lexjet canvas or the matt version? I noticed that the matte version is way cheaper.
I always use matte, then finish the print with a topcoat finish of the client's choice, whether it be matte, satin or gloss.
Logged

dgberg

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2763
    • http://bergsprintstudio.com http://bergscustomfurniture.com
Fredrix vs. Lexjet canvas
« Reply #19 on: May 09, 2010, 08:45:40 pm »

Another matte user that just controls the final sheen with different mixes of Glamor.
I purchased a roll of Lexjets Instant dry which is just a little too glossy for my customers tastes. Prints are super sharp and the best thing I can say about it is I have never had any cracks through the back edges when stretching and stapling. Its twice the cost of the Lexjet Matte. For me personally the sheen is more of an issue.
Pages: [1]   Go Up