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Author Topic: H4D-40: Sample files  (Read 45100 times)

fredjeang

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #60 on: March 29, 2010, 03:24:15 pm »

Quote from: kipling
really? i'd pay james cash to watch a session of what he does.

i could care less about looking a true focused eyelashes, i want to see top dog jumping through flaming hoops.

true pressure, true sets, true workflow, true lighting, true stills and motion, true directing, true work.

what is false focus anyway..?
I think my post have been totally misunderstood.
You are talking about something else.
These posters did not pretend providing us an all session in the real world.
I agree with your point, but it is totally different.
This was just some files to give us an idea , and it has to be taken that way IMO.

Fred.
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robert zimmerman

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #61 on: March 29, 2010, 03:27:56 pm »

Quote from: fredjeang
I think my post have been totally misunderstood.
You are talking about something else.
These posters did not pretend providing us an all session in the real world.
I agree with your point, but it is totally different.
This was just some files to give us an idea , and it has to be taken that way IMO.

Fred.

any way you slice it i'd rather see the highest quality shot possible, either as a test shot or from start to finish.
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fredjeang

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #62 on: March 29, 2010, 03:38:40 pm »

Quote from: kipling
any way you slice it i'd rather see the highest quality shot possible, either as a test shot or from start to finish.
I'd like to see both, a sample with best quality possible, and a flat unpersonal one so that I can get rid off the work involved in the first one.
IMO.

Fred.
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MichaelEzra

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #63 on: March 29, 2010, 05:01:20 pm »

Quote from: fredjeang
I'd like to see both, a sample with best quality possible, and a flat unpersonal one so that I can get rid off the work involved in the first one.
IMO.

Fred.

So far we have the flat one, would certainly be great to see a fully finished image. If Hasselblad lends me the camera, I would be glad to create one:)
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John.Williams

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #64 on: March 29, 2010, 11:04:29 pm »

So much zeal on the board...

But it gets down to the real deal when it is time for the workflow demonstration. Conjecture is replaced with first-hand knowledge when shooting with the gear in your own hands. Those who have shot with the H4D have acknowledged that it works as advertised, super-fast auto-focus, and even the harshest critics have grumbled about the great big LCD screen on the back, curiously annoyed that it is available to anybody who wants to own the camera.

I have an open invitation to anyone who is interested in a hands-on demo of the H4D and Phocus in Atlanta. Want to shoot from start to finish? Me too. Bring your computer, lights, and other items (camera too?) deemed necessary for a qualified, bona-fide demo if you don't want to use mine. Light it how you see fit, stage it, then let's shoot it.

Can't get here? Atlanta in the Spring is not to be missed...

Southeast US? Fine, I'll travel to you.

But it is important to know beforehand that a.) you are going to be impressed with the technology that has been developed, and b.) you and I will know what went down in the demo, it will be up to you if you choose to post it here; this isn't about a showdown - it's about getting to the facts and history proves the most qualified statements are supported by those with experience.

Yep, I'm gonna hear plenty about this one...

John
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ziocan

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #65 on: March 30, 2010, 01:29:13 am »

Quote from: gwhitf
It's always been weird to me that these MF companies spend zillions designing these cameras, then they never hire a competent photographer to shoot RAW files for them, and then make them available for download, to learn the software. There's not a person I know that wouldn't want to download a RAW file from Demarchelier or Michael Thompson or Misrach or whomever, just out of curiosity, but also to really work the software hard.
I do not think MF companies are spending zillions to develop their cameras, otherwise they would produce something proper.

As for downloading those files from the photographers you mentioned, I do not think it is viable because of costs of the right of use.

To give you an example: Michael Thompson is a guy that did not even shoot a polaroid to a friend, for free.
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ziocan

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #66 on: March 30, 2010, 01:37:54 am »

Quote from: fredjeang
Gwhitf,
I totally agree with your points, so as I agreed with what BC was saying, BUT, if you are right to point a minimum of decence, I think a flat pic with no post prod is a better way in these cases to provide enough information.

You won't tell me that looking and examinating some boring flat Raw pics, you are not capable of anticipating the kind of quality that can be acheived when used properly and post-produced accurately.
I agree.
It is actually possible to see what the camera can do from those flat files.

The irony of all those who complained about the lighting, make up and hair, is that very likely, most of the files they produce on their own regular work, before they pass the photoshop man, are probably as bad as the ones Michael quickly took at the trade show.
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David Grover / Capture One

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #67 on: March 30, 2010, 01:54:31 am »

There is no generic solution that pleases all for this kind of event.

If you shoot it like a 'real' situation, somebody will complain it is not flat enough to see potential, or it is not their style of shooting.

Shoot it like it was at the above event, it is not perfect for all.

The idea of the event in New York was to get the camera in as many hands as possible.. More than 1400 people actually.  They could come and go as they please at the time that was convenient to them.

Stage a dogs jumping through hoops for a couple of hours and not everybody would be able to stay, find it interesting etc etc...

Ultimately if you want to do the big proper production test, then use somebody like John to do it with you.

David

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David Grover
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Kitty

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #68 on: March 30, 2010, 02:03:09 am »

Quote from: kipling
then i called my rep all excited by my hasseblad business plan and he said: oh sorry, there's no trade up for the h4d40, you'll have to sell your h3d on your own and buy at full price...
I have no idea who thinks this stuff up, maybe it's really good business sense, i don’t know, but it really cleared my head for a second, and i realized that none of these companies are thinking about my business or my profession. i don't even think canon intentionally moved in a direction that was intended to change any certain line of photography. it's all just a bunch of tech that's crammed into a black (or brown grey) box and presented as the next shabam for silly named target groups. call it something jazzy an see what happens.

I thought Hasselblad upgrade or trade-in is not as good as phaseone.
They don't trade-in their own back here while Phaseone trade-in any DB.
That makes the aftermarket value of Hasselblad DB less.
That is why my 2nd DB is still phaseone.

I really wish they will improve on this. I really like files from Hasselblad DB.
But not their business policy.
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bcooter

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #69 on: March 30, 2010, 03:51:27 am »

Quote from: David Grover / Hasselblad
There is no generic solution that pleases all for this kind of event.

If you shoot it like a 'real' situation, somebody will complain it is not flat enough to see potential, or it is not their style of shooting.

Shoot it like it was at the above event, it is not perfect for all.

The idea of the event in New York was to get the camera in as many hands as possible.. More than 1400 people actually.  They could come and go as they please at the time that was convenient to them.

Stage a dogs jumping through hoops for a couple of hours and not everybody would be able to stay, find it interesting etc etc...

Ultimately if you want to do the big proper production test, then use somebody like John to do it with you.

David

Then you achieved your goals and I hope the sales were good.

But to be clear, I never suggested taking an image through heavy retouching and post processing, though now that it's been mentioned,  I do think it would be a good idea to see how well it holds up in comparison to less costly still cameras.

I think that might make a good demonstration, take two images, one with a h4dIII-40 (I hope I go the naming right) and a 5d2, take them to Pascal and video tape the results.

My ONLY  suggestion was to put better material in front of the lens, but once again since your happy with the results, you need no other comments, you're where you want to be.

From a professional standpoint you buy a camera for two reasons.  To improve your art and hopefully your bottom line.

Looking at the changes in our industry, the advent of the 5d2, 7d, or even the smaller cameras  that seems to be in every housewife's hands shooting micro stock so they can take the family out for one extra dinner at Denny's it makes me think it is time to put the magic back into hands of the photographer, which probably means producing something that just can't be done by the next door neighbor, which for me means tomorrow we are pricing out a RED system.

Best of luck.  Honestly.

BC
« Last Edit: March 30, 2010, 03:54:21 am by bcooter »
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fredjeang

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #70 on: March 30, 2010, 04:24:13 am »

Quote from: David Grover / Hasselblad
If you shoot it like a 'real' situation, somebody will complain it is not flat enough to see potential, or it is not their style of shooting.
Ultimately if you want to do the big proper production test, then use somebody like John to do it with you.

David
That was exactly my point.

What can be done here on a website is limited. If we are talking about testing the use in a real pro session, then there is no other way than doing what John suggested.

Also guys,  talking about real life shooting, I've never seen here or somewhere else, a test made in such a way that they provide all the chain involved informations, that including the time measured in seconds for thethered, displaying etc...
And for a good reason: then you'll have people that will complain about the processor used, the sofware inhability, the type of connectors that were wrong etc...,and will denie the results.
It is virtually impossible and ( and I may have understood the BC point badly, if so I apologyse ) that is why I said that the BC point was not realistic in that case.

On the other hand, the "good" point of having flat, unartistic or non professional images, is that there is no room for debating this or that choice and everybody can take its own conclusions when seeing the files.

Remember the freaky fashion shot in the Bahamas made by Leica for the S2 ? That was marketing, but do you see something like that more, let's say, "scientifical" ? They did a test here that I remember compeating with a Phase, but was it a real work situation? Did they had the pressure, the art director behind ? etc...I doubt we'll see that one day.

Yes, comparing the high-end 35mm to H will lead this forum into another battle 35mm vs MFD I'm afraid, where passion, exagerations (in the best case) will be the tone.
I'm not sure this would be a good idea...  

Fred.




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KevinA

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #71 on: March 30, 2010, 04:30:40 am »

Quote from: gwhitf
I got it. Thanks.

http://hasselbladusa.com/products/phocus-video.aspx

Love the emphasis on GPS in the video. Who uses that? (T. Richardson? So high, he forgot where he shot the job?)

I would, I think anyone that uses a camera in different locations  would welcome GPS. My hat is off to Hasselblad for making it an easy option and I wish Canon would take note.
Anyone that shoots travel or Journalist should find it a God send, GPS helps pinpoint location and saves hours when keywording.
I shoot Aerials mostly with Canons  and long for a built in solution for GPS.

Kevin.
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David Grover / Capture One

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #72 on: March 30, 2010, 04:30:48 am »

Quote from: bcooter
Then you achieved your goals and I hope the sales were good.

But to be clear, I never suggested taking an image through heavy retouching and post processing, though now that it's been mentioned,  I do think it would be a good idea to see how well it holds up in comparison to less costly still cameras.

I think that might make a good demonstration, take two images, one with a h4dIII-40 (I hope I go the naming right) and a 5d2, take them to Pascal and video tape the results.

My ONLY  suggestion was to put better material in front of the lens, but once again since your happy with the results, you need no other comments, you're where you want to be.

From a professional standpoint you buy a camera for two reasons.  To improve your art and hopefully your bottom line.

Looking at the changes in our industry, the advent of the 5d2, 7d, or even the smaller cameras  that seems to be in every housewife's hands shooting micro stock so they can take the family out for one extra dinner at Denny's it makes me think it is time to put the magic back into hands of the photographer, which probably means producing something that just can't be done by the next door neighbor, which for me means tomorrow we are pricing out a RED system.

Best of luck.  Honestly.

BC


I agree a Post Production video would be a very nice thing.  I may have something along those lines..

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David Grover
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robert zimmerman

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #73 on: March 30, 2010, 06:18:52 am »

Quote from: David Grover / Hasselblad
Stage a dogs jumping through hoops for a couple of hours and not everybody would be able to stay, find it interesting etc etc...
Ultimately if you want to do the big proper production test, then use somebody like John to do it with you.

David

: )

I'll try and not use metaphors in the future.
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David Grover / Capture One

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #74 on: March 30, 2010, 06:58:17 am »

Quote from: kipling
: )

I'll try and not use metaphors in the future.


I was metaphorically replying..

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David Grover
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robert zimmerman

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #75 on: March 30, 2010, 07:10:55 am »

Quote from: David Grover / Hasselblad
I was metaphorically replying..

then make a production video with that h4d40 where the photographer is busier than a one-legged woman in an ass kicking contest, and i'll watch.
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David Grover / Capture One

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #76 on: March 30, 2010, 07:19:59 am »

Quote from: kipling
then make a production video with that h4d40 where the photographer is busier than a one-legged woman in an ass kicking contest, and i'll watch.

But it still might not fit the way you do things?

Why would you not try yourself?
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David Grover
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Dick Roadnight

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #77 on: March 30, 2010, 07:59:52 am »

Quote from: bcooter
Dave,

 ...If I was selling a high megapixel, leaf shutter lens camera, I would ... show the ability to crop a full length vertical from a horizontal.  (we do this all the time, now that 1/2 of all still imagery is shot on white).

BC

This is from an H3D11-50 picture of four people 3/4 length.

It was a semi-photojournalist type picture of politicians canvassing.
[attachment=21152:Clive_4_...Spencer2.jpg]

Edit...
Since posting this I have calibrated my monitor, and it now looks awful!
« Last Edit: April 07, 2010, 03:06:08 pm by Dick Roadnight »
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Dustbak

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #78 on: March 30, 2010, 08:10:50 am »

Dick, did you use a lot of fill and/or recovery in this image? It shows that typical orange translucency in the skin that you get when you add this too much.

I thought I was going nuts doing so much work on white. Good to see I am not the only one
« Last Edit: March 30, 2010, 08:14:10 am by Dustbak »
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David Grover / Capture One

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H4D-40: Sample files
« Reply #79 on: March 30, 2010, 08:17:43 am »

Quote from: Dustbak
Dick, did you use a lot of fill and/or recovery in this image? It shows that typical orange translucency in the skin that you get when you add this too much.

I thought I was going nuts doing so much work on white. Good to see I am not the only one

It looks very underexposed, too underexposed to be rescued well.
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David Grover
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