Sinar m and 65LV

[fredjeang]

Hi,

-Anybody actually works with the Sinar m camera?
I would like to have some informations-impressions from the field. About also the possibility to actually extend the modular system to a view camera.
-And what about Sinar digital backs like the 65LV? it seems that they have a wide range of adapters. I do not know any user to ask for and reviews are rare.

Thank you very much.

Fred.

edit --------I just saw the prices, they are crazy!!! not worth the interest?-----------but I'm surprised that we do not hear more about Sinar digital backs in the MFD forum. Wonder why.

[Dustbak]

It is kind of like a unicorn... everybody knows about them, very few have actually ever seen one.

[Kumar]

I think 'ynp' on this forum has/had a Sinar M.

Kumar

[Khun_K]

Hi,

-Anybody actually works with the Sinar m camera?
I would like to have some informations-impressions from the field. About also the possibility to actually extend the modular system to a view camera.
-And what about Sinar digital backs like the 65LV? it seems that they have a wide range of adapters. I do not know any user to ask for and reviews are rare.

Thank you very much.

Fred.

edit --------I just saw the prices, they are crazy!!! not worth the interest?-----------but I'm surprised that we do not hear more about Sinar digital backs in the MFD forum. Wonder why.

I don't own one but I see it in action a few times, very close.  It is a beautiful camera, actually the concept is quite good, but somehow not well PR so it did not reach to a very wide spectrum of customers, the lens selection is not very big but enough for many high end works. From the images I saw from this camera, easily comparable to the best.
Sinar does provide a wide range of adapter to make their backs acceptable to a large range of camera, if I am not mistaken, perhaps the widest range of cameras and platforms.

Regards,K

[ynp]

I think 'ynp' on this forum has/had a Sinar M.

Kumar

Yes, we have two Sinar-M systems here. One is the Sinar-M on the p3 (with the p2 base)  and a full AF system with the second M body.

The M is relatively  cheap secondhand,  CAB lenses  (for P3) are being sold for $1,000-1,500.

And I cannot find a reason to upgrade from my 54H, it works, it delivers real colors in 4 shot mode, it is stable,
and I do not print A1 or bigger.

Please PM if you have any questions.
Yevgeny

PS
And the Zeiss AF lenses are fantastic!!!
I wonder why  Sinar cannot manufacture an electronic adapter to mount the AF lenses on the s2?

[fredjeang]

Hi,
So if I understand well, finding a second hand m, then a 54 22MP back, a Sinaron zeiss and mirror module and you have a kind of MFD-FF that delivers a better IQ than any current FF camera? And for a "decent" price?
What I do not catch is the possibility to use Nikon 35mm lenses...does that makes sense?
[attachment=20688:11791683...inar_m_b.jpg]
But, beautifull, isn't it?

[Dustbak]

I doubt it will be for a decent price since the M always commanded quite a hefty price. If (and this is a big if) you can find all of these secondhand I wonder if you would not be better and even cheaper off buying the cheapest current P1 or Hasselblad solution.

The M could take a module for Nikon F lenses. That is how it could be used with those. This module is now no longer in production. During the period MF backs came in 24x36 format this did make sense. BTW even larger sensors can use 35mm lenses. The image circle of many of them is larger than necessary or 35mm.

Another thing you could look into is the DigiFlex II. It takes V-mount backs and Nikon F lenses (not the G-type).

[Christopher Arnoldi]

I have two Sinar m, too. One on my Sinar p3 with the Sinarback 54H and one with the mirror module, the Sinarback eMotion 54LV and the 4 Zeiss AF lenses.

The advantage is the changeable viewfinder and that you can focus the AF lenses over the MacBook. And you have a back up body when you have 2 bodies, because the m body for the view camera and for the SLR camera are the same.

The tilt and swing axles are with the m body on the p3 (not on the p2) correct, and they are displayed in the LiveView. You have a LiveView button on the sinar m to switch it on and off. The big advantage of the p3 with sinar m over the p3 without sinar m, but with CMV lenses is that you have auto aperture.

The sinar m as SLR has focus bracketing, focus trap and you can justify the AF lenses in the menu of the sinar m.

[evgeny]

I have two Sinar m, too. One on my Sinar p3 with the Sinarback 54H and one with the mirror module, the Sinarback eMotion 54LV and the 4 Zeiss AF lenses.

The advantage is the changeable viewfinder and that you can focus the AF lenses over the MacBook. And you have a back up body when you have 2 bodies, because the m body for the view camera and for the SLR camera are the same.

The tilt and swing axles are with the m body on the p3 (not on the p2) correct, and they are displayed in the LiveView. You have a LiveView button on the sinar m to switch in on and off. The big advantage of the p3 with sinar m over the p3 without sinar m, but with CMV lenses is that you have auto aperture.

The sinar m as SLR has focus bracketing, focus trap and you can justify the AF lenses in the menu of the sinar m.

Hi Christopher,
Is there a Sinar M guide for download from the Internet, which describes in deep details these and all other functions (how to use focus bracketing, focus trap and justify the AF lenses, etc)?
It seems that only the way to master the camera - is by experience, mostly via Capture Shop user interface..
Thanks

[Christopher Arnoldi]

Hi Christopher,
Is there a Sinar M guide for download from the Internet, which describes in deep details these and all other functions (how to use focus bracketing, focus trap and justify the AF lenses, etc)?
It seems that only the way to master the camera - is by experience, mostly via Capture Shop user interface..
Thanks

Hi evgeny,
I just uploaded a german guide to my Server. Here's the link:
http://www.arnoldi-design.com/97_0_kurzanl..._sinar_m_de.pdf
The philosphy from Sinar is, that you have to ask a rep. for deeper details.

[Christopher Arnoldi]

Here's the Sinar m with the new left side battery grip. And an other picture to illustrate the dimensions.

[fredjeang]

Thanks for the pdf, I could not find that in the Sinar web.
Does the M accepts others backs than Sinars?

[Christopher Arnoldi]

Thanks for the pdf, I could not find that in the Sinar web.
Does the M accepts others backs than Sinars?

That makes no sense. One feature of the Sinarback eMotion: when you push the off button on the back, the Sinar m turns off, too. The Sinar m takes over the ISO from the back. With an other back you can't use all features of the Sinar m.

[Christopher Arnoldi]

With the Sinar tripod adapter plate the Sinar m stands on a table without tipping over. Between the back and the viewfinder is enough space for the nose.

[fredjeang]

This is an impressive design that really talks to me. I discovered it reacently as my interest for MFD and view cameras is growing.
I'll try to find some samples 100% to see what kind of IQ is expected, but according to the posts, the very best available.

[evgeny]

That makes no sense. One feature of the Sinarback eMotion: when you push the off button on the back, the Sinar m turns off, too. The Sinar m takes over the ISO from the back. With an other back you can't use all features of the Sinar m.

Christopher, thanks for the pdf. I have it in English.
Can you list please a few features which are not available, if any, when 54H is attached to the Sinar M?

Edit: I looked at your images, what bag/case do you recommend to transport Sinar M to a location? Is there any suitable backpack for the Sinar M with 80 up to 120 lens attached?

Thanks

[David Klepacki]

Thanks for the pdf, I could not find that in the Sinar web.
Does the M accepts others backs than Sinars?

The only supported backs for the M camera are from Sinar (except for their 65LV, I think).  Currently, the maximum sensor from Sinar is 33MP.  If you need more resolution, you will need to machine your own adapter plate, which is fairly easy to do.  You can build a dumb adapter plate (ie, no electronics) and simply attach a PC sync cable from the M sync port on the camera body to the sync port on the MFDB.   The M sync port can trigger a MFDB in the same way that a Hasselblad lens leaf shutter triggers a MFDB.  This will allow your M camera to trigger any MFDB that will trigger via PC sync.  Your shutter speed will be limited by the sync speed ability of the MFDB (anything higher than 1/500 may not be possible).

[Christopher Arnoldi]

Christopher, thanks for the pdf. I have it in English.
Can you list please a few features which are not available, if any, when 54H is attached to the Sinar M?

Edit: I looked at your images, what bag/case do you recommend to transport Sinar M to a location? Is there any suitable backpack for the Sinar M with 80 up to 120 lens attached?

Thanks

Since the Sinarback 54H has no display, noCF-Card and no buttons, you have to do all settings over the MacBook, everthing else is the same. One thing is better with the Emotion backs than with the SB 54H: you can pull off the FireWire cable and stick it in again without crashing Captureshop. And you can use Sinar exposure. On the pictures you see the SB 54H with Sinar m on the Sinar p3.

I transport my gear with Pelican case 1650, see the images. Since the Hasselblad V / Zeiss lenses fit on the Sinar m, I have the Hasselblad CB 60 in my case. Also 2 Sinar Extension tubes. If I peel out the foam I can put the Sinar m into the case with attached 180 lens.

[fredjeang]

Does someone could post here a 100% detail jpeg sample taken with the M and Sinar back?

[Christopher Arnoldi]

When I'm climbing through the vinyards of our region, I use an older LowePro Commercial AW bag. It has space enough for the Sinar m with the side battery grip and also with the big bottom battery grip, and the 3 other lenses. But it's a heavy package.