5D Mark II vs 7D

[daethon]

I'm thinking of fully retiring my 20D and making my 40D my backup with one of these two as my primary camera.

My work is primarily low light conditions: Concerts, Parties and shows, etc. I operate without a flash 95% of the time but do own a 580EX if necessary. I had been holding out for the 5D Mark II but the more that I read about it, the more I feel like it was a dud. Now that Canon has released the 7D I wonder if I should just keep with the crop sensor and go with the 7D. Money is rather tight, so the 800 dollar savings would be useful, but I could always use that money to add the Sigma 20MM f/1.8 to the lineup, or spend an extra 200 overall and buy the 7D and a used 5D.

Fast frame shooting isn't that important to me. Effective auto focus, particularly in low light is highly useful. Better sealing could be of benefit in the case of a spilled beer. Right now I operate moderately well at 400 ISO, but I'd like to be able to work in 1600 ISO without worrying a *ton* about quality. I do have trouble getting "wide enough" particularly at fast lens speeds today with the 24 being too cropped in for much of the time.

Thoughts? My gut is telling me to go with the 7D, perhaps the 7D/5D combo.

Thanks in advance.

In case it is useful these are the lenses that I'll be using with the camera.

Canon 17-40 f/4
Canon 24MM f/1.4 Mark I
Canon 50MM f/1.4
Canon 135MM f/2
Canon 180MM f/3.5 Macro

[tokengirl]

I had been holding out for the 5D Mark II but the more that I read about it, the more I feel like it was a dud.

The 5DMkII is a dud for the people who wanted the autofocus and weather sealing of a 1D series camera without paying for it.  For those of us with realistic expectations, the camera is fantastic.

That being said, if you need more cross-type autofocus points and more reach for the type of shooting you do, maybe the 7D fits the bill better.  I think the 7D handles ISO 1600 pretty well from the samples I have seen.

The 5DMkII does a terrific job at ISO 3200 (assuming correct exposure to begin with).  Some recent samples all shot at ISO 3200 with available light only (with the 85L, which is not exactly the champion of fast focusing).  PP in LR3 Beta, chroma noise reduction set to 50, no luminance noise reduction:

[Jonathan Cross]

Hi,

Don't know where your comment about the 5D MK2 being a dud came from.  I have both a 5D MK2 and a 40D.  The 5D MK2 is my primary camera, and I use it both for landscape work and for photographing visiting speakers under tungsten or flourescent light in a lecture theatre with no natural light, and not using flash.  The results at 1600 or 2000 ISO are great.  I shoot RAW.  Old film buffs cannot believe the results.  I use a Canon 24-105 L IS lens handheld for the lecture theatre work and the images are used by an organisation of which I am a committee member.  Even at 3200 ISO the results are fine as long as people are still.  Exposures are often of the order of 1/15 to 1/25 sec.  The only post processing I do is to tinker with the white balance and maybe the curve.   An image taken with no flash of a group of about 45 people on the steps inside Westminster Hall in the Palace of Westminster in London was fine printed at A3.  I keep my 40D as a back-up and for wildlife.  The biggest focal length I have is with a 70-200 L IS lens with a 1.4 extender, giving about 420mm equivalent when used on the 40D.  I bought the 5D Mk2 for the larger pixel count and larger individual pixel size.

I do not regret the 5D purchase at all, and now hardly use my 580 flash unit.

Jonathan

[stever]

the 5D2 may not be the fastest focusing, but i haven't really had a problem and the low light performance is great, certainly one stop less noise than the crop-frame Canons

from my experience, once you start shooting a 5D2 you will find no reason to use the 40D - a 1.6 crop from the 5D2 is as sharp as a 40D image

[LKaven]

With the 5DII you could:

* Downsample to reduce noise, taking advantage of the inherent low noise of a larger sensor

* Focus manually in very low light when necessary with a large viewfinder

* Go wide when you need to

* Produce very high quality 1080p video clips

* Produce very large prints

[K.C.]

I had been holding out for the 5D Mark II but the more that I read about it, the more I feel like it was a dud.

I have the 7D and 5DII. They're both great cameras and neither of them is a 'dud' by any stretch of the imagination.

IF you can continue to work with the 1.6 factor then buy a 7D and you'll never regret it. For autofocus in low light both perform wonderfully. Different, yes, significantly, no.

I shoot concerts and events with both and it's really nice to be able to put the 16-35 L zoom or the 17 TS-E on the 5DII and get crowd shots or full stage views with audience in the foreground. Picking up the 7D with a longer lens on it is pretty hard to beat. With the 70-200 IS and and the 1.4 teleconverter you'll be able to work at high ISOs and get shots that would cost thousands more with comparable focal length lenses on the 5DII.

You'll enjoy your 180 Macro on either camera. The 180 is one of the sharpest lenses Canon has ever made and only now has the new 100 Macro come close to it.

As for a spilt beer, that's a hazard of the environment you're in. I wouldn't worry about either camera suffering terribly from it. Both are better built cameras than the ones you own now.

[daethon]

Excellent feedback guys!

Thank you very much. I think I'm going to go with either a new 5D Mark II or a Used 5D. I went into a store and played with the Mark II and the 7D with two of my lenses. I had almost forgotten the wonder of a full frame shot. I borrowed a 5D once at a concert for a few minutes, the views were incredible and opened so much possibility. In order to get the FOV that the 17-40 or even just the 24 could give me with a 1.6 crop I'd need a 15MM lens and as far as I can tell there isn't a 15MM lens out there with a 1.4 f/stop. Closest being the f2.8 14MM and that's the cost of the 5D Mark II.

[stever]

in terms of IQ a used 5D is incredible bang for the buck - a very big improvement from the 40D - you will love full frame.  I find the most important features of the 5D2 to be:
- liveview for landscapes and macro
- ergonomic improvements - really nice to have ISO displayed
- AF micro-adjust, but with most lenses i never found this a problem with the 5D which has pretty low pixel density
- even better high ISO performance than the 5D2
- movie capability

consider that we're about mid-point in the 5D2 product life and in another year or so a used 5D2 will also be a bargain

[JohnKoerner]

I have the 7D and 5DII. They're both great cameras and neither of them is a 'dud' by any stretch of the imagination.
IF you can continue to work with the 1.6 factor then buy a 7D and you'll never regret it. For autofocus in low light both perform wonderfully. Different, yes, significantly, no.
I shoot concerts and events with both and it's really nice to be able to put the 16-35 L zoom or the 17 TS-E on the 5DII and get crowd shots or full stage views with audience in the foreground. Picking up the 7D with a longer lens on it is pretty hard to beat. With the 70-200 IS and and the 1.4 teleconverter you'll be able to work at high ISOs and get shots that would cost thousands more with comparable focal length lenses on the 5DII.
You'll enjoy your 180 Macro on either camera. The 180 is one of the sharpest lenses Canon has ever made and only now has the new 100 Macro come close to it.
As for a spilt beer, that's a hazard of the environment you're in. I wouldn't worry about either camera suffering terribly from it. Both are better built cameras than the ones you own now.

This is a great perspective, from a person who actually has both, so thank you for posting.

I am going essentially the same route you did: a 7D and a 5D; the only difference is I am waiting for the 5DMkIII so as to get the better weather-sealing, the next generation video, as well as the next-generation AF.

The 7D is the first truly professional crop-camera, and right now it just dropped $100 at B&H. I believe the next iteration of the 5D will have all the duckies in a row, and if not then the 5DMkII will drop in price to such a degree as to make it a steal when the time comes.

Jack

BTW, I am also waiting for Canon to put the next-generation IS in the both the antiquated 100-400 as well as in the 180mm macro before I pull the trigger there too  




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