Epson 3880 - To RIP, or not to RIP?

[loonsailor]

First, my thanks to those on this forum who've helped me come to the conclusion that purchasing an Epson 3880 will be a good move.  Now the question is which version to buy.

The printer comes in two versions, the Standard Edition for $1295, and the Graphic Arts Edition for $1495.  The difference is that the GA Edition includes a ColorBurst RIP.  $200 for the RIP seems like a good deal - ColorBurst sells several versions of their RIP of which the cheapest is the X-Proof for $495 - but I've never used a RIP and have no idea if it would be helpful to me.  Also, I can't really tell exactly what the features of the included version of the RIP are, because it's not clear which version of ColorBurst it is, or whether it's stripped down from any of the ones described on their web site.

I'll be using the printer purely for my own work.  I'm a serious amateur photographer with no professional aspirations (been there, done that), though I do show my work sometimes.  I'll be using it only to print photographs, usually from Lightroom, sometimes from PS.  I've been using mfg.'s paper profiles, but I'm considering buying a ColorMunki.  Since I'm not a commercial lab, merging multiple print streams, I guess I'd be using the RIP as an enhanced printer driver.  

In looking at the features of the RIP, there are some (Pantone, Postscript compatibility, network "hot directory", job manager) that I'm pretty sure I'll never need.  There are some that are referred to as features on the ColorBurst site (TCP/IP printing, Bonjour) that I think are simply included in the 3880 directly.  Then, there are a few that I don't really understand, so I don't know if they'd be useful.  Quoting from the ColorBurst web site:

• "Completely neutral black and white prints — no metamerism" - How can a RIP help with metamerism problems?  Isn't it a function of the ink?  Helpful?
• "Pre–configured Linearization and ICC profiles"
• "SpectralVision Pro included to perform linearization and build custom ICC Profiles with an X-Rite Spectrophotometer" - SpectralVision helps create CMYK icc profiles.  The site says that SpectralVision "gives you complete control of the black build, including Black Generation, Black Ink Limiting, and an adjustable Black Ink Curve". Is this any different, or any better, than the mfg. paper profiles, or ones that I'd create with a colormunki?  And what is "linearization", anyway?
• "Separate RGB, CMYK, and Grayscale Input Profiles" - What is an input profile?
• "Ink limiting technology with CMYK curve adjustments for complete color control" - This one might be interesting.  The site says that "The Black Preservation feature allows ColorBurst to achieve a deep rich black by not limiting the Black channel in relation to the Total Ink Limit. This feature enables users to get a great black with Epson’s Photo Black cartridge even on Matte and Fine Art papers."  Is this feature something one would use, say, to help increase dMax?
• "Ink Curves", "Bezier Curves" - Useful, or no?

As I said, I'm not even sure if all of these features are included in the version that comes bundled with the 3880-GA.

My goal is simply to make the finest, most beautiful photographic prints that I can.  My question is, would a RIP like this help me, or not? Or, is the basic Epson driver all that I need?

Thanks, in advance, for any advice.

[Wayne Fox]

I'll be using the printer purely for my own work.  I'm a serious amateur photographer with no professional aspirations (been there, done that), though I do show my work sometimes.  I'll be using it only to print photographs, usually from Lightroom, sometimes from PS.  I've been using mfg.'s paper profiles, but I'm considering buying a ColorMunki.

The output quality using the standard print drivers is exceptional.  No need to complicate the workflow by using a rip.

Most manufacturers profiles should be fine ...there are a few that may be problematic but I wouldn't bother with the colormunki until you decide which papers you like and how good the profiles are.

[Mussi_Spectraflow]

After reading your questions the short answer is, I don't think you need the RIP.

The version that ships with the printer is stripped down in the respect that it does not allow you to make your own media profiles, you can only relinearize existing media sets. Linearizations work in conjunction with the ICC profile to perform the initial ink limiting and to create a more linear response between input values(rgb/cmyk) and the measured printed output. Other than that it's basically the same, ColorBurst is not really a bells and whistles kind of RIP. It puts ink on paper in a very accurate way without much fuss. If you're not printing postscript files, such as those out of illustrator, spot colors or doing proofing then you're not taking advantage of a lot of the advantages the RIP can offer.

That said the main selling point for Colorburst is that it simplifies color management through media sets, lets you queue multiple prints, and gives you access to it's Epson profiles(the non epson version gives you access to many different paper types but the Epson bundle locks you into Epson papers) This is all really targeted at the proofing world where people need to produce contract proofs to simulate an offset press. The RIP also attracted a number of followers when the Epson profiles were subpar and the black and white output was not so good.

On older printers ColorBurst was much better at delivering good looking BW prints than the epson driver and it minimized illuminate color shift (metamerism) by using a different screening that generated a black with less colored inks. On the 3880 I find the BW rendering to be quite good.

I wont say that the RIP won't offer you some benefits but they are going to be pretty minimal I think. The OEM Epson Profiles are really quite good now, and if you're going to be printing on 3rd party papers then the RIP isn't going to be much help there either.

[Light Seeker]

I looked at the same bundle when I purchased my 3800 a year ago. I reached the same conclusion as Wayne. The standard print drives are exceptional, and I would likely spend time with the RIP that would better be spent elsewhere.

Terry.

[digitaldog]

In looking at the features of the RIP, there are some (Pantone, Postscript compatibility, network "hot directory", job manager) that I'm pretty sure I'll never need.

You just answered the question. You don’t need a RIP. And some of this stuff is available in products like Lightroom.

[simplify]

Rip should stand for RipOff.  I really regret spending $1000 on a RIP for my Epson 9800.

[loonsailor]

Thanks for the clear and rapid replies!  I ordered the printer today, standard edition of course.

[Fantome]

HI I have to wade in on this - perhaps a bit late. I just purchased a 3880 and decided to upgrade my Imageprint RIP even though everyone i spoke with suggested that i'd be foolish to do so.
I've been delighted with the printer and have done some tests using the Canson Baryta Photographique paper.  At first blush I thought gee - i've just wasted my $$ on the RIP however after some more careful observation i see that the whites are indeed much cleaner and the ink lays down much more evenly with finer degree of gradation and detail. I am thrilled with the prints I'm doing and have absolutely no regrets.

[Gemmtech]

HI I have to wade in on this - perhaps a bit late. I just purchased a 3880 and decided to upgrade my Imageprint RIP even though everyone i spoke with suggested that i'd be foolish to do so.
I've been delighted with the printer and have done some tests using the Canson Baryta Photographique paper.  At first blush I thought gee - i've just wasted my $$ on the RIP however after some more careful observation i see that the whites are indeed much cleaner and the ink lays down much more evenly with finer degree of gradation and detail. I am thrilled with the prints I'm doing and have absolutely no regrets.

Can you explain yourself a little clearer?  Whites are much cleaner?  Meaning less GD?  I can only make the GD go partially away if I knock the whites down to about 240.  What about blacks?  Can you get closer to the dye?  I would buy a rip if it would solve the GD problem.  It's a shame Epson wont include a GLOP with their professional printers.

[loonsailor]

So, if you're using the RIP with Canson paper, does that mean that you bought the full RIP, or paid to upgrade the stripped down version that comes with the 3880-GA?

[Jongallo]

Let me add my five cents.  For about a year I have been using ImagePrint 8 with a 2880 printer and felt that the cost of the RIP was well worth it in increased image quality.  I print primarily using Epson and Ilford papers.  I bought a 3880 about three months ago to replace my 4000.  (Wanted the wider format; didn't need the roll option of the 4880; wanted a printer that was lighter and had a smaller footprint)  I used it without a RIP and my opinion (just using eyeballs in various lighting environments), the prints that I was getting from the 3880 using Epson and Ilford profiles simply were not as good as I was getting from the 2880 with ImagePrint 8.  By good I mean color fidelity and detail.  So I took a deep breath and purchased the license for the 3880.  Again, just using eyeballs, the prints I am now getting from the 3880 with ImagePrint 8 have the same color fidelity and detail that I get from the 2880 with the RIP.  So, for me, it was worth the cost.

[digitaldog]

I haven’t used IP since I think version 6 but every time I did a comparison, I did see a difference too, preferring the dither out of IP. I usually built a custom profile using both methods instead of doing an apples to oranges comparison just in the two profile processes (at the time, I found IP’s blues shifted magenta).

[Gemmtech]

Let me add my five cents.  For about a year I have been using ImagePrint 8 with a 2880 printer and felt that the cost of the RIP was well worth it in increased image quality.  I print primarily using Epson and Ilford papers.  I bought a 3880 about three months ago to replace my 4000.  (Wanted the wider format; didn't need the roll option of the 4880; wanted a printer that was lighter and had a smaller footprint)  I used it without a RIP and my opinion (just using eyeballs in various lighting environments), the prints that I was getting from the 3880 using Epson and Ilford profiles simply were not as good as I was getting from the 2880 with ImagePrint 8.  By good I mean color fidelity and detail.  So I took a deep breath and purchased the license for the 3880.  Again, just using eyeballs, the prints I am now getting from the 3880 with ImagePrint 8 have the same color fidelity and detail that I get from the 2880 with the RIP.  So, for me, it was worth the cost.

Are there any specifics?  Does the RIP help with the GD?  Can you achieve a blacker black, closer to the dye printers?  Are the differences so minor that it wont show up on a scan you could post?

[PeterAit]

Are there any specifics?  Does the RIP help with the GD?  Can you achieve a blacker black, closer to the dye printers?  Are the differences so minor that it wont show up on a scan you could post?

I would like to see an objective comparison. No matter how hard an individual tries to be fair, the fact that they have spent a small fortune on ImagePrint is going to bias their opinion.