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Author Topic: Nikon D3s or D3x  (Read 15973 times)

douglasf13

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« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2009, 03:40:46 am »

It'll be interesting to see what Canon does about the color in the next high megapixel 35mm camera. Hopefully they stay away from the "yellow" red channel that they've been doing since the 50D/5dii in order to improve high ISO noise. I'd personally go Nikon.
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eronald

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« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2009, 04:18:37 am »

Quote from: douglasf13
It'll be interesting to see what Canon does about the color in the next high megapixel 35mm camera. Hopefully they stay away from the "yellow" red channel that they've been doing since the 50D/5dii in order to improve high ISO noise. I'd personally go Nikon.

I think their CMOS technology is more and more geared to video - it can work with low light and gives very smooth images which many say are ideal for film-makers. Most of us who really want really good low-light AF and sharp hi-ISO images with good color have moved to N already.

This is not to say that Canon are bad - it's just that N have come back from nowhere to score a home run with the D3, D700, D3x and D3s. Canon needed a kick in the pants, it has now definitely been administered.


Edmund
« Last Edit: December 07, 2009, 04:21:25 am by eronald »
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BernardLanguillier

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« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2009, 07:55:46 am »

Quote from: eronald
Bernard,

 Do yourself a favor, compare the long lenses yourself.
 I swapped from C to N, but that doesn't mean that C gear is always inferior.

Edmund,

Not saying that it is inferior, only that it cannot be much superior in the particular case of the 300 f2.8.

Do you own the Nikkor 300 f2.8 VR?

Cheers,
Bernard

eronald

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« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2009, 12:29:51 pm »

Quote from: BernardLanguillier
Edmund,

Not saying that it is inferior, only that it cannot be much superior in the particular case of the 300 f2.8.

Do you own the Nikkor 300 f2.8 VR?

Cheers,
Bernard

No, the only "real" tele I own is the old Canon 200/1.8 which is quite decent for an antique. See attached image.

You really shouldn't underestimate the "good" Canon teles if you haven't tried them. I tried the Nikon 200 F2. ROTFL.

Edmund
« Last Edit: December 07, 2009, 12:31:32 pm by eronald »
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achrisproduction

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« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2009, 06:30:23 pm »

Quote from: eronald
No, the only "real" tele I own is the old Canon 200/1.8 which is quite decent for an antique. See attached image.

You really shouldn't underestimate the "good" Canon teles if you haven't tried them. I tried the Nikon 200 F2. ROTFL.

Edmund
I have the Canon EF 300 f/2.8L IS too and its a stunning lens.  However, after the push from Nikon I am Canon will release Mark II with hybrid IS for all current teles except 282 IS and 856 IS.   Now back to Canon vs Nikon. lol
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Ray

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« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2009, 11:37:19 pm »

I own a Nikon D700 and Nikkor 14-24/2.8. This is a replacement, or upgrade, to my Canon 5D with Sigma 15-30.

Unfortunately, I cannot find an upgrade in the Nikkor repertoire to the Canon 24-105/F4 IS, nor the Canon 100-400 IS, two lenses which I use a lot.

Image stabilisation is a great invention and, in my view, more significant than any moderate increase in sensor pixel count. A D3s with some good quality Nikkor lenses featuring the latest and best VR technology, would probably be irresistable for me.
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douglasf13

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« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2009, 01:55:32 am »

Quote from: eronald
I think their CMOS technology is more and more geared to video - it can work with low light and gives very smooth images which many say are ideal for film-makers. Most of us who really want really good low-light AF and sharp hi-ISO images with good color have moved to N already.

This is not to say that Canon are bad - it's just that N have come back from nowhere to score a home run with the D3, D700, D3x and D3s. Canon needed a kick in the pants, it has now definitely been administered.


Edmund

 I think it's less about the CMOS tech, and more about the cfa they're putting on top of it. CFAs are becoming more and more transparent with worse color seperation.  Nikon falls between Canon and Sony in this regard.
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BernardLanguillier

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« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2009, 02:30:24 am »

Quote from: eronald
You really shouldn't underestimate the "good" Canon teles if you haven't tried them. I tried the Nikon 200 F2. ROTFL.

Are you talking about the current 200 f2.0 VR?

It is universally considered to be one of the best lenses ever designed for any mount.

Cheers,
Bernard

eronald

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« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2009, 03:19:01 am »

Quote from: BernardLanguillier
Are you talking about the current 200 f2.0 VR?

It is universally considered to be one of the best lenses ever designed for any mount.

Cheers,
Bernard


Bernard,

 Some  lenses are special, unique to their users in some way, and do not really have substitutes.
 My N 85/1.4 is sadly in no way a replacement for my old C 85/1.2. although the N lens is very nice.
 My *old* 200/ 1.8 C lens also seems to be in a class of its own, the new C 200/2 is not quite an equivalent for some reason, I believe, nor the N 200/2.

Edmund
« Last Edit: December 08, 2009, 06:22:46 am by eronald »
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paratom

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« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2009, 09:47:16 am »

Quote from: eronald
Bernard,

 Some  lenses are special, unique to their users in some way, and do not really have substitutes.
 My N 85/1.4 is sadly in no way a replacement for my old C 85/1.2. although the N lens is very nice.
 My *old* 200/ 1.8 C lens also seems to be in a class of its own, the new C 200/2 is not quite an equivalent for some reason, I believe, nor the N 200/2.

Edmund

Edmund,
I own the N 200/2.0VR and dont see how a lens could me much better than this.
At f2.0 it is already sharper than the 70-200/2.8 stepped down to f4.0.
It focuses blazingly fast, super sharp, and creamy bokeh.
Sorry - even if one lens is a little better or worse I dont see how anybody could not be satisfied.
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achrisproduction

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« Reply #30 on: December 08, 2009, 06:42:05 pm »

Quote from: eronald
Bernard,

 Some  lenses are special, unique to their users in some way, and do not really have substitutes.
 My N 85/1.4 is sadly in no way a replacement for my old C 85/1.2. although the N lens is very nice.
 My *old* 200/ 1.8 C lens also seems to be in a class of its own, the new C 200/2 is not quite an equivalent for some reason, I believe, nor the N 200/2.

Edmund
few lenses that Nikon has to catch up with.  EF 24 f/1.4L II, EF 35 f/1.4L, EF 50 f/1.2L, EF 85 f/1.2L II, EF 100 f/2.8L IS, EF 135 f/2L, EF 180 f/3.5L....etc.
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achrisproduction

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« Reply #31 on: December 08, 2009, 06:43:06 pm »

Quote from: paratom
Edmund,
I own the N 200/2.0VR and dont see how a lens could me much better than this.
At f2.0 it is already sharper than the 70-200/2.8 stepped down to f4.0.
It focuses blazingly fast, super sharp, and creamy bokeh.
Sorry - even if one lens is a little better or worse I dont see how anybody could not be satisfied.
Canon's EF 200 f/2L IS is the same too but ages ago Canon already had EF 200 f/1.8L.  
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BernardLanguillier

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« Reply #32 on: December 08, 2009, 09:08:17 pm »

Quote from: achrisproduction
few lenses that Nikon has to catch up with.  EF 24 f/1.4L II, EF 35 f/1.4L, EF 50 f/1.2L, EF 85 f/1.2L II, EF 100 f/2.8L IS, EF 135 f/2L, EF 180 f/3.5L....etc.

More to be found at www.bythom.com

Nikon lens line up has many holes in it, no doubt. I would say though that they have gotten many of their recent releases right... this being said 90% of my images are shot with a Zeiss lens...

The true beauty of stitching is that changing system has become a whole lot easier... were Canon or Sony to release something really appealing in the high end, I would be able to invest in that, buy the very best lens available for that mount between 80 and 120mm and keep shooting the exact same way. Life is great!  

Cheers,
Bernard

achrisproduction

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« Reply #33 on: December 09, 2009, 04:58:48 am »

Quote from: BernardLanguillier
More to be found at www.bythom.com

Nikon lens line up has many holes in it, no doubt. I would say though that they have gotten many of their recent releases right... this being said 90% of my images are shot with a Zeiss lens...

The true beauty of stitching is that changing system has become a whole lot easier... were Canon or Sony to release something really appealing in the high end, I would be able to invest in that, buy the very best lens available for that mount between 80 and 120mm and keep shooting the exact same way. Life is great!  

Cheers,
Bernard
Benard, I think it doesn't matter what system.  The image is the main thing.  I like your images, your landscape work is the best landscape work I ever seen to be honest.

Cheers,

Chris
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paratom

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« Reply #34 on: December 09, 2009, 05:59:26 am »

I dont feel that the Nikon 24PCE, 28/1.4, 35/2.0, Sigma 50/1.4 for Nikon, 85/1.4, 105DC, 135DC, 180/2.8 are the limiting factor, even if some of the Canon counterparts might be slightly ahead. For those who use zooms its probably the other way around.
Personally I have never seen a reason to switch to Zeiss lenses on the Nikon. The only lens which I didnt like that much is the 70-200/2.8VR Nikon and thereforesold it.
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Dustbak

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« Reply #35 on: December 09, 2009, 09:11:13 am »

Quote from: paratom
I dont feel that the Nikon 24PCE, 28/1.4, 35/2.0, Sigma 50/1.4 for Nikon, 85/1.4, 105DC, 135DC, 180/2.8 are the limiting factor, even if some of the Canon counterparts might be slightly ahead. For those who use zooms its probably the other way around.
Personally I have never seen a reason to switch to Zeiss lenses on the Nikon. The only lens which I didnt like that much is the 70-200/2.8VR Nikon and thereforesold it.


Same here, I also sold the 70-200VR. I now have the VRII which is very different. Much better! Finally I am happy with the 70-200VRII.

I just wish Nikon would come with a 70-200VRII/4.0. Nikon is bound to be updating its line of primes. It is pretty much the last thing they have not updated recently. Rumors are there is a 24/1.4, 35/1.4, 85/1.4 and a new version of the DC in the pipeline. I hope these rumors become true...
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Dan Wells

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« Reply #36 on: December 09, 2009, 12:29:17 pm »

Nikon's long glass problem, as I see it, is not the fast supertelephoto primes (other than their prices) - it is the 70-200 (new one may have fixed this), the very old 300 f4, and the 80-400. For a long while, the 70-300 mm consumer AF-S VR zoom was the best stabilized Nikkor longer than 120mm and less expensive than the 300 f2.8 (on FX). The first 70-200 f2.8 VR was really a (superb) DX lens, with corner sharpness issues on FX that were worse than the 70-300, the 70-200 f4 VR doesn't exist, the 300mm f4 isn't stabilized, and the 80-400 is a very old lens with slow AF and some sharpness problems (the newest 70-300 AF-S VR is a sharper lens than the 10 year old 80-400). The fast primes and the 200-400 are superb lenses (as are Canon's equivalents, and for that matter Sony, Pentax, Leica and Mamiya versions of similar lenses - superteles are expensive to build, but not all that hard to design), but both expensive and very heavy (inherent in the type of lens, not Nikon's fault). Hopefully the new 70-200 will be a true FX lens, and fill some of that gap, and Nikon will release a mid-priced (much more expensive than the 70-300 AF-S VR, but cheaper than the 300 f2.8) lens that replaces the old 80-400. If we had a truly good 70-200 FX (we may now) plus a mid-priced modern 100-400ish, Nikon would have a good line of long glass that bridges the gap in price and weight to the expensive big primes and the 200-400.

               -Dan
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eronald

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« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2009, 06:33:27 pm »

Quote from: achrisproduction
Benard, I think it doesn't matter what system.  The image is the main thing.  I like your images, your landscape work is the best landscape work I ever seen to be honest.

Cheers,

Chris

I agree with everything you say here

Edmund
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BernardLanguillier

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« Reply #38 on: December 09, 2009, 08:51:12 pm »

Quote from: eronald
I agree with everything you say here

Edmund

Thanks a lot for your kind words Edmund and Chris!  

Cheers,
Bernard

Slough

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« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2009, 05:29:11 pm »

Quote from: achrisproduction
few lenses that Nikon has to catch up with.  EF 24 f/1.4L II, EF 35 f/1.4L, EF 50 f/1.2L, EF 85 f/1.2L II, EF 100 f/2.8L IS, EF 135 f/2L, EF 180 f/3.5L....etc.

You might like to educate yourself about the Nikon micro lenses.
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