Length-wise warping on Hahnemühle Photo Rag Baryta

[kaelaria]

I have a couple prints, 24x30 that have been hanging for several months.  I just noticed that they have developed vertical (portrait prints) waves, fairly pronounced - like warped wood.  There are 3-4 waves going across, and it's even pushed the mat out a bit to see a gap at the low points.  Other prints made at the same time but that have been stored framed but flat so far, are still fine, it's just the ones that have been hanging.

Has anyone ever seen that before?  Printed on a Z3100.

[bill t.]

Hinge mounted or corner mounted, I assume.  The ones that have been stored flat will develop the same ripples when they are on the wall.

It's not your fault, you are merely the victim or archival extremism.

Use acid free materials but mount the prints.  If you think YOU don't like ripples, I can assure you that your customers will like them even less.  Ask any framer how often he has dry mounted a print that was originally hinge mounted.  I dry mount my prints and glue my canvases.  I will say no more, the Archival Purity League monitors this forum.

[kaelaria]

Double T mounted at the top only.

Now that you mention that it occurs to me that maybe they have expanded horizontally and are being bound by the hinges?  I need to pull one apart and inspect today when I have time.

Luckily I have not delivered any to customers on this paper yet, only the HP and Illford stock, which has all been fine.

I hate dry mounting.  I always use acid free materials.

[bill t.]

Double T mounted at the top only.
Now that you mention that it occurs to me that maybe they have expanded horizontally and are being bound by the hinges?
...I hate dry mounting.  I always use acid free materials.

Aha!  Right on!  Just as I thought.

I have tried every hinging method conceivable.  None of them work very well on the long term, but some will survive without rippling for a few months more than the others.  Houses are the worst environments for this because of swings in temperature and humidity (especially from cooking).  Air conditioned galleries are not so bad, but they lure you into a false sense of security.

Get a good dry mount press.  $500 to $1000 for a good used  Seal (now Bienfang) 500T-X 26x34 inch press will be the best money you ever spent.  Most people hate dry mounting because it's a bit of work...and to think they call themselves professionals!  But look, the worst work you will ever have is dealing with those "it's all bumpy!" phone calls.  I've had a few, they drag me down.

Dry Mounting Hit #001:  preheat the matte and the artwork (but without the tissue) for about a minute to drive off moisture.  Like the good boy scout I was back in the 50's I always did that, and my dry mounted prints from that time (we're talking 50+ years ago) are still down as good as the day they were pressed.  All the talk of dry mount problems is from slovenly dilettantes who don't preheat.

[kaelaria]

It's not the prospect of more work, it's just the concept of to me, ruining a print by sticking it to a board.  The whole concept just bugs the crap outta me.  I might just go with a beefier center only hinge.

[bill t.]

...ruining a print by sticking it to a board.

OK, go ahead and ruin the print by letting it get so totally rippled that the only way it can be straightened out is by pressing it with...tada!...a dry mount press.  PS, throw a piece of dry mount tissue in there while you're at it!

And how does mounting ruin a print?  It very much improves it, IMHO.  You will actually be able to see the image instead of a bunch if fun-house mirror reflections.

[kaelaria]

Or, I can continue as-is and simply use my other papers that have never had the issue.

[Rocco Penny]

hello, I'm a very inexperienced hand, and only offer limited useful information.
I have these ripples.
I have tried t-hinging, corner mounts, and now dry mount tissue.
The backing needs to be perfect straight and flat.
The print needs to be perfect straight and flat.
The drymount tissue has been a critical success on larger pieces while I still t-hinge some of my smaller ones.
OK thank you have a nice day
rocco

[neil snape]

Rocco,
Is this on H PR B or all your papers?

What would be good to know if this is a problem area with PR B.

[JohnBrew]

I have a couple prints, 24x30 that have been hanging for several months.  I just noticed that they have developed vertical (portrait prints) waves, fairly pronounced - like warped wood.  There are 3-4 waves going across, and it's even pushed the mat out a bit to see a gap at the low points.  Other prints made at the same time but that have been stored framed but flat so far, are still fine, it's just the ones that have been hanging.

Has anyone ever seen that before?  Printed on a Z3100.

The first paper I ever saw this with was the Harman Gloss FB Al. It is the ONLY paper I've used which did this. I would be very interested to see if anyone else is having this problem with the Hahnemuhle as I would like to try some.

[Rocco Penny]

Rocco,
Is this on H PR B or all your papers?

What would be good to know if this is a problem area with PR B.

Again, I'm very inexperienced and can only speak from my particular set of circumstances,
but Ive noticed that fine art printing is an exacting pursuit.
Flaws have a cumulative effect.  The print can be perfect, but twisted or just bad backing, along with the paper wanting to do just whatever it wants to do, has me interested in tolerances and the real numbers.
So obviously there is a right way and number for that.
It is the Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta that made me get a dry mount press.
Beautiful images but once mounted they'd pooch out on me.
I don't think I noticed it as much or at all on several other papers I have pieces done on.
The Hahnemuhle Fine Art Baryta is flat and good on the foamcore I have it t-hinged to.
Also I'm printing large pieces here and there(+/- 36"x24") and don't want to experiment with ripples right now, since I figure an incorrectly printed or mounted 36x24 costs a bit for my lack of attention.
So, yes I've seen the ripples on other paper, but the H PR B is substantial and easily corrected on large size prints by using my dry mount press
Thank you,
Rocco