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Author Topic: Laser Printers going out?  (Read 5033 times)

MarkIV

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Laser Printers going out?
« on: April 28, 2009, 03:23:32 pm »

Laser Printers going out? (Oce Lightjet, Lambda, Chromira)

My pro printer has two Lightjets but says they are not making them any more.  I prefer the laser, poly (fuji flex) color prints for color landscape.  I asked him what is going to happen in the future?  He simply said "jet prints."  Not to bash jet prints, but this saddens me if it is true.

What do you think is going to happen to laser prints in the future?  Is he off base?
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Bruce Watson

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Laser Printers going out?
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2009, 04:40:39 pm »

My local pro lab told me a year ago that Oce wouldn't let him have another service contract on his LightJet. He's planning to run it until he can't get parts or can't repair it himself. Then... it's junk. What else can he do?
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Scott Martin

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Laser Printers going out?
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2009, 05:00:17 pm »

The Lightjet series was End of Life'd many years ago and now they've ended the maintenance program. Durst products (including the Lambda) and ZBE products (Chromira) are current. ZBE is particularly pushing forward with impressive development and great pricing. On the minilab side of silver halide, Nortisu dominates and has great technology up to 24 inches wide. ZBE's new Chromira Minilab will give Nortisu a good challenge.

So yes, there's lots of options and silver halide well suited for volume printing. We're still seeing R&D put into new papers like Kodak's impressive Endura VC that just making it to the masses now. Silver halide may have taken a backseat to inkjet but it should be around in volume markets (photo labs, portrait studios, etc) for the foreseeable future.
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Scott Martin
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MarkIV

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« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2009, 03:27:20 pm »

Quote from: Onsight
The Lightjet series was End of Life'd many years ago and now they've ended the maintenance program. Durst products (including the Lambda) and ZBE products (Chromira) are current. ZBE is particularly pushing forward with impressive development and great pricing. On the minilab side of silver halide, Nortisu dominates and has great technology up to 24 inches wide. ZBE's new Chromira Minilab will give Nortisu a good challenge.

So yes, there's lots of options and silver halide well suited for volume printing. We're still seeing R&D put into new papers like Kodak's impressive Endura VC that just making it to the masses now. Silver halide may have taken a backseat to inkjet but it should be around in volume markets (photo labs, portrait studios, etc) for the foreseeable future.

Good news.  Maybe Chromira will keep moving forward with LF laser technology. I can not go without my silver halide flex prints!  The only thing that has prevented me from using the Chromira so far is their inabailiy to print at 300- 400 ppi. I think 250 is their max?
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Wayne Fox

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Laser Printers going out?
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2009, 04:30:01 pm »

Quote from: MarkIV
Good news.  Maybe Chromira will keep moving forward with LF laser technology. I can not go without my silver halide flex prints!  The only thing that has prevented me from using the Chromira so far is their inabailiy to print at 300- 400 ppi. I think 250 is their max?

I believe the LightJet was similar in design to the Kodak LED printer, where the paper was held stationary and a system of lasers (LED's in the case of the Kodak) moved across the paper.  While both printers pioneered new imaging technology, the mechanics of moving the lasers and especially the LED's in Kodaks case was very challenging and very complicated. We operated two of the Kodak LED printers and output quality was terrific.  The main drawback (other than overly complicated mechanics) was the printer was limited to a maximize size (24x30 in the case of the Kodak), something which changed with the the Lambda and later generation printers where the paper itself moved under the laser head assembly and 30" or greater widths were introduced.

The ZBE Chromira is actually a 300dpi native device and is not laser but uses a small LED head and prints very much like an inkjet printer.


They also claim to have a mode which improves "visual" resolution ...from their website..."  ZBE's Resolution Enhancement Technology improves on that and increases the visual resolution to 425 PPI, ensuring that you receive a quality image every time."

 I have no clue what they mean by "visual resolution" as opposed to actual resolution, and we've never tried it with our Chromira so I have no opinion either way as to what it delivers.  It may be worth checking into if the lab you are using prints with a Chromira.  

Noritsu's 24" version is very good, but obviously limited width.  We operate one of those as well  and side by side the Noritsu seems to have a slight edge. This is judged from portraits, not landscapes, and if I remember my plant managers comments correctly it was based on slightly better flesh tones.

Personally I think the Lambda is still the best of the bunch, but all 3 produce outstanding sliver halide prints.  As you mentioned, on Fujiflex (or Kodak Metallic)  the results can be remarkable.

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Scott Martin

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« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2009, 05:19:06 pm »

The Lightjet is a drum mechanism that uses suction to remove some of the air in the drum and hold the paper flat against the drum. The light from three large lasers are directed with mirrors to a rotating mirror that spins on a rod that goes through the center of the drum. So the paper is stationary while being imaged in a near vacuum. At first this approach allowed for far great accuracy and definition than Durst's capstan mechanism (were the paper is moving). Durst's were built for speed and they sold more for that reason and they later caught up in terms of image quality. Nortisu's new "HD" machines technically offer more resolution than any other silver halide printer but you can't se it at all on the final prints. I suspect the resolvable resolution of the paper is being exceeded (IE: the paper can't handle more than ~400 ppi).

I do lots of side-by-side comparisons between machines as I travel from lab to lab (the lab I'm at today has four Noritsus and slew of inkjets) and I'd say all four silver halide brands (Durst, ZBE, Oce, Noritsu) now offer the same quality in terms of sharpness and definition when their maximum resolutions are used. And in terms of quality when they are all profiled the same way. Laser, LED or CRT - it just doesn't a matter anymore, but the resolution some one prints with does. Kodak Metallic rocks as does Fuji's Pearl (also a metallic paper) and I think this is one of the most exciting areas where silver halide sets itself apart from inkjet.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2009, 05:53:21 pm by Onsight »
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Scott Martin
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MarkIV

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Laser Printers going out?
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2009, 09:16:23 pm »

Quote from: Onsight
The Lightjet is a drum mechanism that uses suction to remove some of the air in the drum and hold the paper flat against the drum. The light from three large lasers are directed with mirrors to a rotating mirror that spins on a rod that goes through the center of the drum. So the paper is stationary while being imaged in a near vacuum. At first this approach allowed for far great accuracy and definition than Durst's capstan mechanism (were the paper is moving). Durst's were built for speed and they sold more for that reason and they later caught up in terms of image quality. Nortisu's new "HD" machines technically offer more resolution than any other silver halide printer but you can't se it at all on the final prints. I suspect the resolvable resolution of the paper is being exceeded (IE: the paper can't handle more than ~400 ppi).

I do lots of side-by-side comparisons between machines as I travel from lab to lab (the lab I'm at today has four Noritsus and slew of inkjets) and I'd say all four silver halide brands (Durst, ZBE, Oce, Noritsu) now offer the same quality in terms of sharpness and definition when their maximum resolutions are used. And in terms of quality when they are all profiled the same way. Laser, LED or CRT - it just doesn't a matter anymore, but the resolution some one prints with does. Kodak Metallic rocks as does Fuji's Pearl (also a metallic paper) and I think this is one of the most exciting areas where silver halide sets itself apart from inkjet.

Great input here, thank you.  I am currently printing the same image at the same res. on all three LF machines (Lambda and Lightjet already). Since Chromira seems to be the company that is going to spearhead the future of this technology, I might move over to their machine (we'll see in about a week when I get my sample test print back from a Chromira lab).  Have not tried Pearl paper yet but will soon.
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