Hasselblad buying questions

[photolinia]

Hello everyone!

Having had a chance to use an H3D-II 39 as well as a Phase one System, I'm now in the market for a used
H3D...

I was contemplating a D3X, but seeing that I can get a used Hasselblad in a good condition for as little as 50% more made me want to go
the Hasselblad route instead...

Since I am completely new to Hasselblad - having only used one for 2 days, I have a long list of questions.  So any help would be appreciated...

- I am mostly interested in the 39Mp models since even the used 50's are too expensive, and the 31's seem to be within 35 DSLR striking zone
  (I know - sensor size matters, but I want to be outside of the DSLR range in Mps for the next couple of years...  
  I've seen some H3DII, H3D, and even H2D models with 39M backs.  I know that H3D-II has a much nicer screen (still not that great compared to  
  DSLR's), but other than the screen, what CRITICAL differences are there going from H3D-II to H3D and H2D?  Will images coming out of
  the three models with the same backs look different?
  I know that H2 also has more compatibility options, but I'm not sure it matters too much for me.  The biggest question for me - should I
  spend a couple of grand more for an H3D-II over an H3D?

-What is an acceptable number of body and lens actuations?  What is a typical lifespan of the leaf shutters in a lens?  Why does the number of actuations
  matter so much in the body, since it has no shutters in it?

-I've only used FlexColor software, but I've heard that Phocus is much better.  Is Phocus available for all bodies, or only for H3D-II?  
  Will I have problems downloading and installing it if I buy a used body without Phocus?  and is Phocus really that much better than Flexcolor?

-Being in the US, should I even consider buying from abroad or is it too much hassle?  

-Is there a lens compatibility chart for an H3D?  Can I find a list of all the lenses that can work with this body (AF and MF)?

-How many years of warranty does Hasselblad offer on an H3D and can I extend it?  Does it make sense to buy extra warranty?  Are there service
  centers in LA area?

-Other than basic condition and actuation count, what else should I look at when buying a used camera?

Thank you!!
-ilya

[Graham Mitchell]

- I am mostly interested in the 39Mp models since even the used 50's are too expensive, and the 31's seem to be within 35 DSLR striking zone
  (I know - sensor size matters, but I want to be outside of the DSLR range in Mps for the next couple of years...

Sorry but this seems slightly strange to me. How much resolution do you actually *need* ?

[Nick-T]

Will images coming out of the three models with the same backs look different?

No they will be pretty much equivalent assuming all share the same firmware (user upgradeable).

I know that H2 also has more compatibility options, but I'm not sure it matters too much for me.  The biggest question for me - should I
  spend a couple of grand more for an H3D-II over an H3D?

-What is an acceptable number of body and lens actuations?  What is a typical lifespan of the leaf shutters in a lens?  Why does the number of actuations
  matter so much in the body, since it has no shutters in it?

From memory the lens shutters are rated at something like 100 000 frames. The body has a cloth blind and of course a moving mirror assembly so wear and tear can be a factor.

-I've only used FlexColor software, but I've heard that Phocus is much better.  Is Phocus available for all bodies, or only for H3D-II?  
  Will I have problems downloading and installing it if I buy a used body without Phocus?  and is Phocus really that much better than Flexcolor?

Phocus is certainly better but be aware that it does like powerful computers. Both Phocus and Flexcolor can be downloaded from Hasselblad no problem.

-Being in the US, should I even consider buying from abroad or is it too much hassle?

I guess it all comes down to $$$ but being new to MFDB you might want to think about how much support you are going to need and therefore should you be looking at establishing a relationship with a dealer.

-Is there a lens compatibility chart for an H3D?  Can I find a list of all the lenses that can work with this body (AF and MF)?

All HC lenses work with any H3D that is, 28, 35, 50, 80, 50-110, 35-90, 100, 120macro, 150, 210, 300, extn tubes 1.7X extender, and HTS. Not sure if I missed one there but the specs are all on the Hasselblad site.

Hope that answers some of your questions.
Nick-T

[photolinia]

Sorry but this seems slightly strange to me. How much resolution do you actually *need* ?

I definitely do not "need" a medium format resolution.  More than likely a D3X is plenty to cover what I need.
But a $8k price tag for a D3X seems unreasonable to me - this of course has been covered and discussed to death already...

a medium format quality is something that I would like to have, and given how relatively close a used H3D is to a D3X, I am very tempted...

[photolinia]

No they will be pretty much equivalent assuming all share the same firmware (user upgradeable).



From memory the lens shutters are rated at something like 100 000 frames. The body has a cloth blind and of course a moving mirror assembly so wear and tear can be a factor.



Phocus is certainly better but be aware that it does like powerful computers. Both Phocus and Flexcolor can be downloaded from Hasselblad no problem.


I guess it all comes down to $$$ but being new to MFDB you might want to think about how much support you are going to need and therefore should you be looking at establishing a relationship with a dealer.



All HC lenses work with any H3D that is, 28, 35, 50, 80, 50-110, 35-90, 100, 120macro, 150, 210, 300, extn tubes 1.7X extender, and HTS. Not sure if I missed one there but the specs are all on the Hasselblad site.

Hope that answers some of your questions.
Nick-T

Thanks Nick!

[Doug Peterson]

-Being in the US, should I even consider buying from abroad or is it too much hassle?

Since I don't have a dog in this race I'm glad to put in my two cents. You should buy from whatever dealer you are most confident can provide you setup, training, service, and support. All things being equal I would rather have a dealer in my time zone or down the street rather than across the world. However, all dealers aren't all equal and I would much rather have a far away dealer who answers their phone at anytime of day/night and who is extremely knowledgeable on the hardware/software than have a close dealer who is only mediocre.

This is especially true since this will be your first medium format system.

Choose one of the Hassy dealers who is known for service, do negotiate but don't beat them over the head with price, and tell them WHAT you need the system for so they can anticipate some of your needs/questions.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
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[SeanFS]

I definitely do not "need" a medium format resolution.  More than likely a D3X is plenty to cover what I need.
But a $8k price tag for a D3X seems unreasonable to me - this of course has been covered and discussed to death already...

a medium format quality is something that I would like to have, and given how relatively close a used H3D is to a D3X, I am very tempted...

Thanks for posting, I do have MF but am also looking to go for a second hand H3d as a backup as  it would only get light use and occasional resolution specific use, but then sometimes having equipment creates its own market as you confidently consider work you may not have before .
 It would be  very interesting to know users experiences between the H3d and the H3D-2 as there is quite a price difference between the two second hand.
I also don't like the idea of the smaller chip as the drop from mf film to the smaller size of the digital chip was enough and I really like the difference between MF and 35mm formats, the hd 31 is just getting that little bit too close to 35mm in look  for me although I'm sure it produces great results otherwise.
Yes my 1ds3 ( and my CF132 for that matter ) give me all the resolution I would ever practically need ( and I was looking at some 30x 40 inch prints from the 1ds3  the other day trying hard to fault them and couldn't really) but there is the odd shot that would benefit from 39mp's and also MF definitely has much better ( more subtle graduations, richer contrast)  colour from what I see, along with its crispness from No AA filters. Maybe the difference is subjective but its there otherwise why would anyone even consider it?.
I have a bit of a love hate relationship with flexcolour but at the end of the day , its not too difficult to use and produces the goods, yes its quirky ( but very  stable ) but in other ways from capture one which I also use with Canon files. I haven't really got to grips with Phocus yet as I don't have a computer with enough grunt, but I'm sure it has its own issues and advantages and is probably more adept at getting the most out of the newer backs.

[photolinia]

Thanks for posting, I do have MF but am also looking to go for a second hand H3d as a backup as  it would only get light use and occasional resolution specific use, but then sometimes having equipment creates its own market as you confidently consider work you may not have before .
 It would be  very interesting to know users experiences between the H3d and the H3D-2 as there is quite a price difference between the two second hand.
I also don't like the idea of the smaller chip as the drop from mf film to the smaller size of the digital chip was enough and I really like the difference between MF and 35mm formats, the hd 31 is just getting that little bit too close to 35mm in look  for me although I'm sure it produces great results otherwise.
Yes my 1ds3 ( and my CF132 for that matter ) give me all the resolution I would ever practically need ( and I was looking at some 30x 40 inch prints from the 1ds3  the other day trying hard to fault them and couldn't really) but there is the odd shot that would benefit from 39mp's and also MF definitely has much better ( more subtle graduations, richer contrast)  colour from what I see, along with its crispness from No AA filters. Maybe the difference is subjective but its there otherwise why would anyone even consider it?.
I have a bit of a love hate relationship with flexcolour but at the end of the day , its not too difficult to use and produces the goods, yes its quirky ( but very  stable ) but in other ways from capture one which I also use with Canon files. I haven't really got to grips with Phocus yet as I don't have a computer with enough grunt, but I'm sure it has its own issues and advantages and is probably more adept at getting the most out of the newer backs.

Thanks for responding...

while on the subject - I'm looking into upgrading my PC.  What would you suggest for running phyocus and being able to handle those 39mpix raw files?
What kind of processor / RAM / video card, etc?

thanks,
-ilya

[Nick-T]

Thanks for responding...

while on the subject - I'm looking into upgrading my PC.  What would you suggest for running phyocus and being able to handle those 39mpix raw files?
What kind of processor / RAM / video card, etc?

thanks,
-ilya

I'm a mac user but a current model computer with plenty of RAM would be a good start. The main thing with phocus is that it leverages the graphics card quite a lot so you want a minimum 512MB card. On the Hasselblad site there is a readme on suggested computer specs I think in the software downloads area (it may even be part of the phocus readme, sorry I can't remember)
Nick-T

[elitegroup]

Thanks for responding...

while on the subject - I'm looking into upgrading my PC.  What would you suggest for running phyocus and being able to handle those 39mpix raw files?
What kind of processor / RAM / video card, etc?

thanks,
-ilya

Compatibility

Phocus for Windows supports both 32/64-bit XP and Vista operating systems. Minimum service pack levels are - Windows XP service pack 2 and Vista sevice pack 1. Phocus may run on older and/or other operating systems than listed above. Hasselblad will however not guarantee correct operation or performance with these configurations, and consequently cannot offer technical support for these environments. This as well applies to operating Phocus on emulated operating systems like Parallels or VMWare. Phocus will run via Boot Camp.
Supported products
All FireWire based Hasselblad camera units are supported.
Capture or display of micro-step images is not supported.
Scanner 3F files are not supported.
3F files generated by Phocus are not backward compatible with FlexColor!
If you need to run a Hasselblad product on equipment that does not satisfy the above requirements please consider using our FlexColor software which is still fully supported.

System Requirements

Below you will find three different performance configuration examples. Please be aware that these examples are general and may vary depending on the manufacturer of the actual hardware. They may be used only as a basic guideline for configuring a computer to a given performance. To ensure a good user experience in Phocus, we recommend that your system at least conform to the “Acceptable Performance” example described below.

Recommended PC Configurations

Acceptable performance (Using 22” monitor or less)
Laptop PC:  Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 2Gb memory, 256Mb Radeon HD 3650 graphics card.
Desktop PC: Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 2Gb memory, 256Mb HD 3450 graphics card.

Good performance
Laptop PC: Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 4Gb memory, 256Mb Nvidia Quadro NVS 320 M graphics card.
Desktop PC : Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 4Gb memory, 512Mb Geforce 9600 GT graphics card.

High Performance
Laptop PC: Intel Pro Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 4Gb memory, 512Mb NVIDIA Quadro FX 2700M graphics card.
Desktop PC: Core 2 Quad (or AMD equivalent), 8Gb memory, 1Gb Geforce 9800 GT graphics card.

Non-Recommended PC Configurations

Phocus may run using older and/or other configurations than the listed examples above. Hasselblad cannot guarantee correct operation or performance with these configurations.  Older Pentium machines and/or main boards with on-board graphics adapters are generally not recommended, as they provide less performance for Phocus to perform well.
 
Graphics card

At least 256Mb of video RAM is required. Unlike older graphics applications such as Photoshop and FlexColor, Phocus utilizes the processing power available in the graphics card to provide precise real time feedback for adjustment changes. Therefore, just as with Aperture, the viewer performance is very much dependent on the quality of the graphics adapter. In general, more video RAM is better, especially if you plan to work with 30” displays or dual monitor setups. Not all graphic adapters are supported! As a minimum Direct X 9.0c compatible graphic adapters are required, yet not all are guaranteed to work.

The following is a list of graphic adapters that meets the requirements:

NVIDIA:         ATI:               Intel:
Quadro series      Radeon HD 4800 Series         GMA 3500 (limitations apply)
GeForce 9 series      Radeon HD 3000 Series         GMA 3100 (limitations apply)
GeForce 8 series      Radeon HD 2000 Series
GeForce 7 series      Radeon X 1000 Series (limitations apply)
GeForce 6 series

CPU

While viewer performance is very dependent on GUI (Graphics Processing Unit) power, the CPU (Central Processing Unit) will have the most influence on functions such as export where speed benefits from higher CPU clock rate (GHz) and maximum core utilization. It should also be mentioned that performance of the viewer at 100% and above is also CPU core and clock rate dependent. The above performance examples are not specific in regards to CPU speed (GHz). In general,- the higher the speed of the CPU and the higher amount of cores you have, the higher performance you will achieve.

Memory (RAM)

2GB is acceptable but 4GB (or more) is a better choice especially if you are running Photoshop at the same time. Phocus for Windows will when running on a 64-bit operating system, take full advantage of more than 4GB - which may improve performance when browsing folders with a large number of images.

[photolinia]

Compatibility

Phocus for Windows supports both 32/64-bit XP and Vista operating systems. Minimum service pack levels are - Windows XP service pack 2 and Vista sevice pack 1. Phocus may run on older and/or other operating systems than listed above. Hasselblad will however not guarantee correct operation or performance with these configurations, and consequently cannot offer technical support for these environments. This as well applies to operating Phocus on emulated operating systems like Parallels or VMWare. Phocus will run via Boot Camp.
Supported products
All FireWire based Hasselblad camera units are supported.
Capture or display of micro-step images is not supported.
Scanner 3F files are not supported.
3F files generated by Phocus are not backward compatible with FlexColor!
If you need to run a Hasselblad product on equipment that does not satisfy the above requirements please consider using our FlexColor software which is still fully supported.

System Requirements

Below you will find three different performance configuration examples. Please be aware that these examples are general and may vary depending on the manufacturer of the actual hardware. They may be used only as a basic guideline for configuring a computer to a given performance. To ensure a good user experience in Phocus, we recommend that your system at least conform to the “Acceptable Performance” example described below.

Recommended PC Configurations

Acceptable performance (Using 22” monitor or less)
Laptop PC:  Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 2Gb memory, 256Mb Radeon HD 3650 graphics card.
Desktop PC: Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 2Gb memory, 256Mb HD 3450 graphics card.

Good performance
Laptop PC: Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 4Gb memory, 256Mb Nvidia Quadro NVS 320 M graphics card.
Desktop PC : Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 4Gb memory, 512Mb Geforce 9600 GT graphics card.

High Performance
Laptop PC: Intel Pro Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent), 4Gb memory, 512Mb NVIDIA Quadro FX 2700M graphics card.
Desktop PC: Core 2 Quad (or AMD equivalent), 8Gb memory, 1Gb Geforce 9800 GT graphics card.

Non-Recommended PC Configurations

Phocus may run using older and/or other configurations than the listed examples above. Hasselblad cannot guarantee correct operation or performance with these configurations.  Older Pentium machines and/or main boards with on-board graphics adapters are generally not recommended, as they provide less performance for Phocus to perform well.
 
Graphics card

At least 256Mb of video RAM is required. Unlike older graphics applications such as Photoshop and FlexColor, Phocus utilizes the processing power available in the graphics card to provide precise real time feedback for adjustment changes. Therefore, just as with Aperture, the viewer performance is very much dependent on the quality of the graphics adapter. In general, more video RAM is better, especially if you plan to work with 30” displays or dual monitor setups. Not all graphic adapters are supported! As a minimum Direct X 9.0c compatible graphic adapters are required, yet not all are guaranteed to work.

The following is a list of graphic adapters that meets the requirements:

NVIDIA:         ATI:               Intel:
Quadro series      Radeon HD 4800 Series         GMA 3500 (limitations apply)
GeForce 9 series      Radeon HD 3000 Series         GMA 3100 (limitations apply)
GeForce 8 series      Radeon HD 2000 Series
GeForce 7 series      Radeon X 1000 Series (limitations apply)
GeForce 6 series

CPU

While viewer performance is very dependent on GUI (Graphics Processing Unit) power, the CPU (Central Processing Unit) will have the most influence on functions such as export where speed benefits from higher CPU clock rate (GHz) and maximum core utilization. It should also be mentioned that performance of the viewer at 100% and above is also CPU core and clock rate dependent. The above performance examples are not specific in regards to CPU speed (GHz). In general,- the higher the speed of the CPU and the higher amount of cores you have, the higher performance you will achieve.

Memory (RAM)

2GB is acceptable but 4GB (or more) is a better choice especially if you are running Photoshop at the same time. Phocus for Windows will when running on a 64-bit operating system, take full advantage of more than 4GB - which may improve performance when browsing folders with a large number of images.

Awesome!  I'll print these out and take them to a PC store when I go in to upgrade my PC...
thanks!