Adding "Unmaximized" PSD Files to the Library

[Michael Bailey]

Like many others, I have a lot of Photoshop files I had saved "Without Maximize Compatability", thinking I'd spare some file size. Of course, Lightroom can't read them.

So, a couple of questions: First, is there a way to create a Collection including just the problem files, so I can resave them in a Photoshop Action?

Barring that, how can I get Lightroom to show me at least a black icon of every problem file? I see Unmaximized PSD's often show up as black rectangles in the Library Grid, but not always. I wonder what Import settings I might be changing to cause the difference.

Finally, to vent a little, shouldn't Adobe products be able to function with Adobe files? If I can get this problem settled I'll probably go back to using layered Tiff files with Zip compression, but that's a battle for another day.

Thanks,   MB

[john beardsworth]

No easy way. Maybe filter the whole Library to just the PSDs, then select them all and add them to a new collection. You can then eyeball them and delete the compatible ones from the collection, then work your way through the others.

You might set up the action as a droplet, add the droplet as an external editor, and then launch it from Edit With. However, you may just find it easier to open the files via Edit in PS and then run the action.

Maximize compatibility simply does what it says on the tin. Adobe's Lightroom team have got better things to do than spend development time on code for re-rendering pixel data.

John

[Michael Bailey]

Thanks for your quick reply, John. I'll think about your suggestions.

Unless I'm doing something wrong, though, the problem ties in with my complaint: Lightroom not only fails to render these PSD files, it doesn't even acknowledge that they exist. That is, until I synchronize a folder. I'm not trying to beat up on the Lightroom people, but if the program is able to tell me precisely which files it can't read, couldn't it put a marker or icon in the Grid to say as much? That way, I would at least know that files are actually there, even if I can't view their thumbnail. As it stands for me now, Lightroom is actually deceptive, telling me folders are empty when they're not.

I know, I should go to Adobe to whine, not here. But I'll be happy to read here first that I'm doing something wrong. If there's a way to get Lightroom to generate at least a blank icon in the Grid, I'll be thrilled to skip all that resaving and just live with that.

[Michael Bailey]

One other thing I THINK I've figured out. When Lightroom shows me a black thumbnail. it's to indicate a great big file (I read somewhere that 10,000 pixels per side is a limit for generating thumbnails), not an un-maximized Photoshop file. Again, I believe they're invisible.

[john beardsworth]

Does Bridge cope any better? At least it should see the files. I can't think of any obvious metadata that could be used as a filter though.

One thought is to use the Image Processor to run through the files, converting them to max compatible. You might go for a Save As, just to be on the safe side.

John

[PeterAit]

No easy way. Maybe filter the whole Library to just the PSDs, then select them all and add them to a new collection. You can then eyeball them and delete the compatible ones from the collection, then work your way through the others.

You might set up the action as a droplet, add the droplet as an external editor, and then launch it from Edit With. However, you may just find it easier to open the files via Edit in PS and then run the action.

Maximize compatibility simply does what it says on the tin. Adobe's Lightroom team have got better things to do than spend development time on code for re-rendering pixel data.

John

There's no need to remove the compatible ones from the collection, is there? Opening and resaving them will do no harm.

Peter

[john beardsworth]

I was thinking that the collection could serve as a to-do list. In any case, LR isn't importing the incompatible ones, which is a shame.

John

[Michael Bailey]

Original poster here. The more I look at this, the more interesting, and disappointing it gets.

It appears it's not possible to have Lightroom create any kind of collection of offenders because the un-maximized PSD's are invisible to it. In fact, I've just noticed that if a folder contains those PSD's exclusively, the folder itself is invisible. So asking the program to throw all the Photoshop files in a bin for open-and-resave would gain nothing.

I suppose that we could ask Bridge to go into "View All Items in this Folder and All Its Subfolders" and then sort by File Type, but that would be asking it to do just what it's not designed for. Assuming, that is, that we want to automate a whole hard drive full of PSD's at a time. I can see Bridge bogging down and freezing in just the way that inspired me to buy Lightroom in the first place!

So far today I've been going through my hard drive job-by-job, synchronizing folders, and then, when Lightroom reports the offending files, tracing them to Bridge where I can run an action on them in Photoshop.

I have seen several references to this problem on the Adobe Lightroom Forum, but I can't say I've found a good solution or explanation there. I still don't understand why Lightroom can draw me an 800 MB layered Tiff file, but can't tell me whether a 2 MB layered PSD is even on my computer. Hmmph.

[KeithR]

In an earlier discussion on why to save as Tiff as opposed to PSD files:
http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=18965
In this discussion, Jeff Schewe gave an answer as to why it was not a good reason to save in PSD.
I've highlighted the part I feel is important to this current discussion.
His answer:
Wrong...PSD is now a bastardized file format that is NOT a good idea to use. Even the Photoshop engineers will tell you that PSD is no longer the Photoshop "native" file format. It has no advantages and many disadvantages over TIFF.

TIFF is publicly documented, PSD is not. That makes TIFF a preferred file format for the long term conservation of digital files.

TIFF uses ZIP compression for max compression, PSD uses RLE which if you save without the Max compatibility will be a bit smaller, but at the risk of not being able to be used by apps, like Lightroom.[/color]
TIFF can save EVERYTHING a PSD can save including layers, paths, channels, transparency, annotations and can go up to 4 GIGS in file size. TIFF can save all the color spaces PSD can. The ONLY thing I can think of that PSD can save that currently TIFF can't save is if you Save out of Camera Raw a cropped PSD, you can uncrop the PSD in Photoshop CS, CS2 or 3. That's one tiny obscure thing that PSD can do that TIFF currently doesn't. How many people even knew that let alone use it?

PSD used to be the preferred file format back before Adobe bastardized it for the Creative Suite. The moment that happened, PSD ceased to be a Photoshop "native" file format. PSB is the new Photoshop "native" file format for images beyond 30,000 pixels. And , at the moment, only Photoshop can open a PSB.

Getting back to the fist point, Adobe can do anything including stopping support for PSD because it's a proprietary file format. TIFF is public, even if it's owned by Adobe (by virtue of the Aldus purchase). Even if Adobe went belly up tomorrow, TIFF would continue.

And, let me be blunt, anybody who thinks PSD is "better" than TIFF is ignorant of the facts. If Adobe would let them, the Photoshop engineers would tell you to quit using PSD. Lightroom for the first beta did NOT support PSD and Hamburg fought tooth and nail to prevent having to accept PSD. He blinked, but you still can't import a PSD without Max compat enabled-which basically makes it a TIFF with a PSD extension.[/color]
Look, I'll make it REAL simple...

TIFF = Good
PSD = Bad

Ok?

[Michael Bailey]

You're right, Keith, and certainly Jeff Schewe knows what he's talking about. Following the advice of Jeff (and my imaging and writing hero, the late Bruce Fraser) I have been easing away from PSD for a while myself. I admit I hadn't made the switch in all cases because Photoshop files seem to save a lot faster than compressed Tiffs. (I just tested a big multi-layer 16 bit file: 17 seconds for the PSD, 41 for the Tiff/Zip. With a single layer file the difference was even more extreme.)

So I concede that in the future I'll be an all-Tiffs-all-the-time guy. But I'm still left with a couple of thousand files going back five years that I'd like to get into the Lightroom Library, and I can't find a way of accomplishing that without spending days opening and closing files. Isn't there any procedure by which Lightroom/Photoshop/Bridge can help me?

If not, then I stand by my "Hmmph".

[mcbroomf]

Write an action to open all PSD fils and save as tifs...run it overnight?

[KeithR]

...without spending days opening and closing files. Isn't there any procedure by which Lightroom/Photoshop/Bridge can help me?

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step....

But I'd follow Mike's suggestion first and: Write an action to open all PSD fils and save as tifs...run it overnight?

[Michael Bailey]

Write an action to open all PSD fils and save as tifs...run it overnight?

OK, I'm in. Now, is there software other than Bridge or Lightroom, the two likely candidates we've found to be either unlikely to work or completely ineffective, that will help me compile all the PSD's for running the action? Maybe this is a script thing?

[jjj]

You can make a smart collection in Bridge that finds PSD files and then batch them from Bridge/Tools/PS/Batch. Very easy.


As for PSD files being pointless, they work better in apps like InDesign than Tiffs, cannot remember details off hand, as well as some other stuff. Not quite sure why some people are so violently opposed to PSDs, it's not as if they secretely rearrange your pixels when you leave computer to get something to eat.

[Michael Bailey]

Oops, I almost misread your post, jjj. Excuse me if you read an earlier response that didn't correspond to what you actually wrote! Anyway, yes, I agree that Bridge and Photoshop will run the action easily. If I can do it without Bridge crashing. I've used all the different versions of Bridge and File Browser up to 4 point something, on a few different computers, and they've all been pretty flaky when being relied on to make big searches. Crashes, freezes, etc. Have you had better luck?

[mcbroomf]

Michael, note that jjj said Bridge, not Lightroom.  Does Bridge see your PSD files?  As it's part of PS it certainly should.

[Michael Bailey]

Thanks, mcbroomf. I edited my submission. Apologies to all for my careless first reading!

[Michael Bailey]

Well, if you're still with me, here's what I wound up doing.

--Using Bridge, I created a new folder in my D: hard drive called 0001. I chose that title just so it would appear at the top of the list.
--Then, still using Bridge, I moved 8 or 10 folders from D: to D:/0001. Bridge can do that easily because that process just renames file locations; it's not really moving any files.
--Then I ran a search on 0001, and subfolders, for all PSD files, including non-indexed files. (I have yet to see Bridge remember an index from one day to the next.)
--Six or seven years later, I'd get a window full of PSD files upon which I could run a Photoshop action to open and close-with-maximize.
--When done, I moved the folders back up to D:
--Why the folder moving? Because running a search on a whole hard drive in Bridge makes is freeze. Lots of time lost.
--Just a few more days to go and I should be done.

I have done some foot-stamping and breath-holding over on the Adobe Lightroom Forum but, what do you know, the company survives in spite of my disapproval.

Nevertheless, hmmph.                       MB