Digital Back: Private purchase or dealer?

[guyharrison]

Hi,

I might have the chance to buy a phase one p45 on the used market with value added warranty.  What are the forum's thoughts on a private purchase versus getting a used/demo back through a phase one dealer?  Will I have dealer support on the warranty or will I have to deal with phase one?  I like to have a relationship with a dealer but the huge cost of this move makes the potential savings of several thousands of $$$$ very critical.

Anyone have experience on this?  I see that several dealers participate here, please weigh in as well!

Thanks,

[Graham Mitchell]

What are the terms of Phase's warranty? Is it transferable?

[tho_mas]

A stated somewhere here on the forum the (value added or not) warranty is always for the back, not for the current owner (sorry, I do not remember the thread).
So with regard to warrenty a private purchase in this case should be okay.

[Doug Peterson]

Hi,

I might have the chance to buy a phase one p45 on the used market with value added warranty.  What are the forum's thoughts on a private purchase versus getting a used/demo back through a phase one dealer?  Will I have dealer support on the warranty or will I have to deal with phase one?  I like to have a relationship with a dealer but the huge cost of this move makes the potential savings of several thousands of $$$$ very critical.

Anyone have experience on this?  I see that several dealers participate here, please weigh in as well!

Thanks,

A discussion on this can be found on this recent thread.

Good support is much more than the warranty.

Doug

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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[tho_mas]

Good support is much more than the warranty.

Does that mean that if I buy a back with value added warranty from a private person (means the value added warranty was payed by the previous user and now is in part payed back to him by me) that you will make a difference in the way you support me as the current owner of that back?

[ddk]

Hi,

I might have the chance to buy a phase one p45 on the used market with value added warranty.  What are the forum's thoughts on a private purchase versus getting a used/demo back through a phase one dealer?  Will I have dealer support on the warranty or will I have to deal with phase one?  I like to have a relationship with a dealer but the huge cost of this move makes the potential savings of several thousands of $$$$ very critical.

Anyone have experience on this?  I see that several dealers participate here, please weigh in as well!

Thanks,

I have bought backs both from dealers and individuals in the past and can tell you that when the time came for support the manufacturer/distributor was the one that came through. Now days I buy based on price, specially since I don't really need the dealer's support but it might be different for you.

[jonstewart]

if you buy it private, or from dealer, in a different geographical area, your local Phase dealers etc won't want to know you (my experience). You also wont have a copy of Capture One licenced to you, just to the original owner...eh, Doug?

Just be clear if buying from a dealer whether it is a refurb, or are they facilitating another client to sell their back.

[Nick-T]

Hi,

I might have the chance to buy a phase one p45 on the used market with value added warranty.  What are the forum's thoughts on a private purchase versus getting a used/demo back through a phase one dealer?  Will I have dealer support on the warranty or will I have to deal with phase one?  I like to have a relationship with a dealer but the huge cost of this move makes the potential savings of several thousands of $$$$ very critical.

Anyone have experience on this?  I see that several dealers participate here, please weigh in as well!

Thanks,

Guy a good dealer will do much more for you than just supervise your warranty. What is your level of knowledge? If the P45 was going to be say your third back and you have a solid knowledge of the kit/software and are comfortable doing your own tech support then you could certainly purchase privately.
If however you are new to medium format then I would suggest you look upon the extra $$$ that you might have to spend with a dealer as a solid investment. Ask yourself what a few days of downtime would cost you if you cannot get something to work. Finally don't forget that dealers often have good deals on demos/refurbs so the cost difference might not be as high as you expect. Give the guys at capture integration a call, they have an excellent reputation and really know their stuff.
Nick-T

[clawery]

Hi,

I might have the chance to buy a phase one p45 on the used market with value added warranty.  What are the forum's thoughts on a private purchase versus getting a used/demo back through a phase one dealer?  Will I have dealer support on the warranty or will I have to deal with phase one?  I like to have a relationship with a dealer but the huge cost of this move makes the potential savings of several thousands of $$$$ very critical.

Anyone have experience on this?  I see that several dealers participate here, please weigh in as well!

Thanks,

Guy,

There are arguments for both purchasing from a dealer and from an individual.  Either way make sure you purchase from a reputable dealer or individual.  
If you need help verifying the warranty on any back, please let me know the serial # and I can check with Phase One to get the exact warranty remaining.  Just know that any Phase One warranty travels with the back.

Chris Lawery (Email Me)
Sales Manager
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870  |  Cell: 404.234.5195
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[Guy Mancuso]

From one Guy to another Guy. LOL

Maybe you should read this http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=33128

Now i have no real issue buying from a private person and may do the same myself. I'm selling my P25 Plus to get a P30 plus either from the CI folks or privately . I think more than anything outside the dealers is know the person you are buying from and know where they got there back from. It's a lot of money going out of your hands and frankly I would NEVER buy one off e-bay or if I did not know the person. What ever you do be safe and know what you are getting. I personally like the dealer network myself and will try to stay on that course first. I may pay a little more but something about comfort level is hard to put a price tag on. The bottom line as some have said but I will word it my way is I like my hand held on this stuff. It's about your comfort level and your needs. We all have different needs.

[Joe Behar]

Does that mean that if I buy a back with value added warranty from a private person (means the value added warranty was payed by the previous user and now is in part payed back to him by me) that you will make a difference in the way you support me as the current owner of that back?

I'm not going to pretend to answer for Doug, but I will answer for myself as a dealer.

If you come in with a Phase One product in need of service and its under warranty, you will get full service with a smile. Just as you're entitled to.

If you come in with a Phase One back that you bought from someone other than me and ask me to teach you how to use it, or give you a software lesson, I'll gladly do it and send you an invoice.

[tho_mas]

If you come in with a Phase One product in need of service and its under warranty, you will get full service with a smile. Just as you're entitled to.

So buying a back from a private person WITH warranty is no difference to buying it from a dealer (as long as the warranty is valid). That's good to know and exactly what I expected.
I just don't understand why Doug emphasizes "Good support is much more than the warranty" as in the initial post the questions was about a back WITH warranty.
BTW: I have absolutely no trouble with the Phase guys here in Germany, exactly the opposite - they are always extremely helpful ... with or without warranty or whatever.
Must be very different in the US.

[Joe Behar]

So buying a back from a private person WITH warranty is no difference to buying it from a dealer (as long as the warranty is valid). That's good to know and exactly what I expected.
I just don't understand why Doug emphasizes "Good support is much more than the warranty" as in the initial post the questions was about a back WITH warranty.
BTW: I have absolutely no trouble with the Phase guys here in Germany, exactly the opposite - they are always extremely helpful ... with or without warranty or whatever.
Must be very different in the US.

tho_mas,

Again I will answer only for myself.

Good support might mean a phone call after hours when you encounter a problem. It might mean a rep dropping in to give you hand with a new version of software, a new lens, camera or computer. It might mean a better relationship so that you get first shot at products that might be in limited quantities (yes, some people do get preferential treatment, depending on their status as a client. It might not seem fair, but it is reality) All those things might not be important to you, but they are to many.

[tho_mas]

Good support might mean a phone call after hours when you encounter a problem. It might mean a rep dropping in to give you hand with a new version of software, a new lens, camera or computer. It might mean a better relationship so that you get first shot at products that might be in limited quantities (yes, some people do get preferential treatment, depending on their status as a client. It might not seem fair, but it is reality) All those things might not be important to you, but they are to many.

So a payed value added warranty turns somehow in a regular warranty when the back is sold. I mean... the "value added" was payed, no? So the warranty is for the back and the "value added" thing for the owner. Somewhat complicated.
But it's okay... it's not that important to me personally. Thanks for clarification!

[Joe Behar]

So a payed value added warranty turns somehow in a regular warranty when the back is sold. I mean... the "value added" was payed, no? So the warranty is for the back and the "value added" thing for the owner. Somewhat complicated.
But it's okay... it's not that important to me personally. Thanks for clarification!

No, no, no.....

The phrase "value added" is the Phase One term for a 3 year warranty with a no charge loaner. It has nothing to do with what added services your dealer offers.

I'm sorry for the confusion.

[tho_mas]

The phrase "value added" is the Phase One term for a 3 year warranty with a no charge loaner. It has nothing to do with what added services your dealer offers.

I go it    thanks!

[Guy Mancuso]

tho_mas,

Again I will answer only for myself.

Good support might mean a phone call after hours when you encounter a problem. It might mean a rep dropping in to give you hand with a new version of software, a new lens, camera or computer. It might mean a better relationship so that you get first shot at products that might be in limited quantities (yes, some people do get preferential treatment, depending on their status as a client. It might not seem fair, but it is reality) All those things might not be important to you, but they are to many.

This was exactly what I meant in the thread I started. There is value besides the warranty. When I call someone on a Friday night at 10 pm his time when he is out looking to have a good time and your in a jam. Like the Visa ad " Priceless"

No individual seller can save your preverbal butt when the crap hits the fan. This is what you have to decide if this is important too you, for some it is not. Service as Joe's says with a smile.

[Dustbak]

I have bought from dealers as well as individuals. Personally I prefer having a backup back and other backups instead of having to call my dealer saturday night because I have a break-down. I assume my dealer much rather spends his weekend with his family than solving my shit.

I think I have the best dealer in the world. Mine called me on monday morning to tell me he had a loaner H body 10 minutes before I called him to tell him my main body went bust . Even so, I hardly ever need anything from them. I get a good price from them to the point I almost feel guilty and wondering how on earth they make enough to survive.

On the other hand I have also always bought second hand. For that I don't bother my dealer and go directly via the manufacturer when I am in need of support. I have found Hasselblad very correct in that aspect and very helpful.

I even believe Hasselblad should be more outspoken about their assistance and support for 2nd hand equipment especially since they dropped the trade-in program and now expect us to either keep our 'old' backs or sell them 2nd hand. If I have 3 backs I will most certainly sell 1 before I commit for the new 'CF60' or 'CF50'. It would be nice if Hasselblad would support my sales efforts by letting potential buyers know they are not some sort of 'second-rate' customers. I know for a fact this is not the case but it would be helpful if they are more outspoken about that.

[bradleygibson]

My experience echoes Dustbak's.

I've also done both.  In the end I prefer to rely on backups as --no amount of support will get me new gear in places I go to shoot.   That being said, and even though I'm technically savvy, my local dealer (Optechs Camera in Seattle) has delivered far more value than I would have expected.

I would contact your local dealer and talk to them about taking on your support if you buy privately.  Some dealers will simply charge you a fee to 'adopt' you, others will do it simply for the goodwill.

Just ask them what they would like to do, and you may find that the answer is straightforward.

As Chris mentioned, be sure to be dealing with someone reputable, regardless of which way you go.

Hope that helps,
-Brad

[Doug Peterson]

My experience echoes Dustbak's.

I've also done both.  In the end I prefer to rely on backups as --no amount of support will get me new gear in places I go to shoot.   That being said, and even though I'm technically savvy, my local dealer (Optechs Camera in Seattle) has delivered far more value than I would have expected.

As I said on the other thread about 90% of the total support calls end with something other than a repair of a camera or back. Maybe calls start out with the caller assuming they need a loaner/replacement/repair but in fact just had a setting wrong on the computer/camera/back or had a component like a firewire cable go bad.

And the 10% that actually need a loaner/replacement/repair can still benefit from the call even if they are in the middle of the shoot and an immediate backup unit can be provided. It's not what you want to hear, but if I tell you that your equipment is in fact dead at least you can stop troubleshooting and start figuring out what the next best option is. For instance, when Guy called me it took us about 2 minutes to establish that there was no more troubleshooting to be done and that the body was dead and that by itself held value.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________
Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870  |  Cell: 740.707.2183
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