Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..  (Read 3981 times)

soneill

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« on: March 23, 2009, 12:21:29 pm »

Hi,

Just looking for feedback from anyone in the know regarding the H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..  currently I am testing one of these with a view to buying. It comes with the 28mm and the 80mm lens ..  it takes a bit of getting used to but when I take it through my own workflow I get some pretty decent results. Despite small issues with noise and making the image sharpness I see it as a good addition - it certainly will raise my game. The kit in question will cost me €11,500. I've looked up the price online and can't seem to find anywhere that sells these second hand. Ebay and this site are just about the best places but still I am unsure of what the market rate is for this gear - am I getting a good or a bad price?

Its a lot of money and this is making me (understandably) slightly apprehensive ..  so, what if I wanted to sell it in 6 months, what do people anticipate the price to be ??   any feedback on this matter is much appreciated ..  (also link to second hand sellers also very much appreciated)

Regards,
S
Logged

ixpressraf

  • Guest
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2009, 12:34:53 pm »

Hi there,
Ihave bought my h3d39 for about 24000 euro and i am selling my kit at this site for 7500 euro. In other words i have lost more then 15000 euro on the camera. You are about to buy a set also almost for free so what is there to lose. Ihink people dont stay real in thinking about a camera. Why do i have to loose 15000 euro on my camera and are you not likely to go for an eventual loss of a few hundred euro's. the world is turning mad.......i wouldn't hesitate to buy a 39Mp kit with lens and battery for 7500 euro, or maby your kit at 11500 euro( a bit more expensive, as you could buy two new lenses extra additional to my kit.
Surely hope second hand prices will go up again in the next months by at least 40 to 50 percent and I think they will.
Logged

soneill

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2009, 12:43:36 pm »

Quote from: ixpressraf
Hi there,
Ihave bought my h3d39 for about 24000 euro and i am selling my kit at this site for 7500 euro. In other words i have lost more then 15000 euro on the camera. You are about to buy a set also almost for free so what is there to lose. Ihink people dont stay real in thinking about a camera. Why do i have to loose 15000 euro on my camera and are you not likely to go for an eventual loss of a few hundred euro's. the world is turning mad.......i wouldn't hesitate to buy a 39Mp kit with lens and battery for 7500 euro, or maby your kit at 11500 euro( a bit more expensive, as you could buy two new lenses extra additional to my kit.
Surely hope second hand prices will go up again in the next months by at least 40 to 50 percent and I think they will.



I'm really sorry to hear you lost so much money ..    what makes you think the second hand market might turn around?   and also are you getting enquiries from prospective buyers?  I suppose I am just enquiring about the market in general ..  if I wanted to free it up how long would it take me to get rid of it and ata resonable price ..  I think you were unlucky with your timing, the global economic downturn has meant that Hasselblad were forced to bring prices down ..  this at a time when Nikon and Canon are going up!
Logged

Alex MacPherson

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 292
    • http://alexmacpherson.com
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2009, 12:45:28 pm »

A good way to determine market value for cameras is to review completed listings on Ebay

This will give you an idea of what a given camera has SOLD for recently.

Go to the search window on ebay
select advanced search
type in the camera name
check the box that says COMPLETED LISTINGS
click the SEARCH button
Logged
Alex MacPherson

Visit My Website

soneill

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2009, 01:27:06 pm »

Quote from: Dolce Moda Photography
A good way to determine market value for cameras is to review completed listings on Ebay

This will give you an idea of what a given camera has SOLD for recently.

Go to the search window on ebay
select advanced search
type in the camera name
check the box that says COMPLETED LISTINGS
click the SEARCH button


very interesting Dolce Moda ..  very interesting ..  tome, it seems that there is not a vast market out there for used MFDB's in general ..  H3Dii sales make up 90% of glabal transactions  ...  it seems as if you have opened a can of worms! Maybe the camera might hold its value but is there a market to sell it in??!
Logged

Richard Morwood

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 50
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2009, 02:31:19 pm »

Quote from: soneill
Hi,

Just looking for feedback from anyone in the know regarding the H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..  currently I am testing one of these with a view to buying. It comes with the 28mm and the 80mm lens ..  it takes a bit of getting used to but when I take it through my own workflow I get some pretty decent results. Despite small issues with noise and making the image sharpness I see it as a good addition - it certainly will raise my game. The kit in question will cost me €11,500. I've looked up the price online and can't seem to find anywhere that sells these second hand. Ebay and this site are just about the best places but still I am unsure of what the market rate is for this gear - am I getting a good or a bad price?

Its a lot of money and this is making me (understandably) slightly apprehensive ..  so, what if I wanted to sell it in 6 months, what do people anticipate the price to be ??   any feedback on this matter is much appreciated ..  (also link to second hand sellers also very much appreciated)

Regards,
S

The Pro Centre in London is often selling it's ex-rental equipment and has a very comprehensive list at present of all variations of H3D's (I & II and 39/31 etc.). AFAIK this is a Hasselblad owned outlet and their prices are possibly a good indication of what the market can stand for 2nd hand. I have bought new and 2nd hand stuff from them and it has always been fine. The ex-rental stuff is often well used, very well used at times, but I think you get 6/12 warranty. The current batch of H3Ds listed all state how many activations they have had and it looks like some have had very little use. Lots of lenses and accessories pop up from time to time too. They claim that in November each year they like to move on their rental equipment and bring in new stuff but I have noticed that the 2nd hand gear for sale is peaking at other times of the year too.
Typically I bought a used H3D39 just over a year ago and now could pick up a H3D II with considerably lower mileage for substantially less money! I'm sure many feel likewise.
If you are purchasing in Euros then these prices might be even more appealing.
Regards
Richard
Logged

ixpressraf

  • Guest
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2009, 02:37:17 pm »

as soon as people open their eyes to see dat a d3x and a 5dmk2 are not the same as a back, even an older back such as a P20 or 384c prices will rise again. now we are overwhelmed with the marketing feeling a 5dMk2 is as good as let's say a 132c from hasselblad: i have both and there is no comparison at 50 and 100 iso. On the other hand a 5d is much easier in use and has good high iso,  but so did my nikon F3 with fujipress 800 also. they are two different camera's.
Logged

happyman

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 56
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2009, 02:45:11 pm »

For me as an owner of a H3D39 kit with 5 lenses it is not the question that the market regulates the price but the manufacturer - in this case Hasselblad. With their persuading marketing strategie they will not longer count me in as a loyal user.

Some of what has been said about the closed system comes true - after only one product generation. Sure, the camera works and could produce outstanding results.
But all their promises are only words, nothing else. ISO 800, full upgrade path, longer exposure times - words only.

If they would follow there promises the value of a used system would be higher, at least 50-70 precent. But this is not their interest. They will make old systems look and feel old. Wow Hasselblad. I am impressed. Or am i depressed?

Never again Hasselblad. That is how i feel today.

Edit.
Iso 800 works. I was not aware of the new firmware the time i wrote...
« Last Edit: March 23, 2009, 03:16:20 pm by happyman »
Logged

ixpressraf

  • Guest
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2009, 02:52:42 pm »

The h3d 39 still is one of the best systems on the market. iso 800 fine works with the newest firmware upgrade, not everyone needs longer exposures, lenses are a complete other feel them phamiya, service is fine over here. It is always easy to level a system with the ground when it devaluates but it still produces splendid images and that is what it's all about.
Logged

ndevlin

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 679
    • Follow me on Twitter
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2009, 02:58:33 pm »

Quote from: ixpressraf
Surely hope second hand prices will go up again in the next months by at least 40 to 50 percent and I think they will.

I know exactly what you mean. Someone just offered me $2400 for the 1DsII I paid over $8,000 for.  I told them to forget it, since I should easily be able to get $4000 for it by summer....      

Welcome to the world of pain that is digital.  I can't even write-off a damn cent on my taxes since I have a day job....

- N.
Logged
Nick Devlin   @onelittlecamera        ww

geesbert

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 642
    • http://www.randlkofer.com
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2009, 03:13:25 pm »

if you lost 15 000 without this kit having earned a lot more than this, then it wasn't probably a wise business decision buying it in the firat place. don't blame the market for it.

Did it ever occured to you that maybe 7500 might be closer to the real value of it? and 30000 was just way to expensive for what it is (it's just a camera, not a car or an average yearly family income or 10 canon 5d2 or 60 canon 450d)  

why should prices rise? the tougher the economic preasure will get, the more people will realise that hardly anyone is seeing the difference other than a few photographers in desperate need to justify their expense. the 5d2s and similar out there are extremely capable cameras, suitable for a lot applications, probably more so than specialised MF systems.


just my thoughts
Logged
-------------------------
[url=http://ww

soneill

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2009, 05:38:11 pm »

Quote from: Richard Morwood
The Pro Centre in London is often selling it's ex-rental equipment and has a very comprehensive list at present of all variations of H3D's (I & II and 39/31 etc.). AFAIK this is a Hasselblad owned outlet and their prices are possibly a good indication of what the market can stand for 2nd hand. I have bought new and 2nd hand stuff from them and it has always been fine. The ex-rental stuff is often well used, very well used at times, but I think you get 6/12 warranty. The current batch of H3Ds listed all state how many activations they have had and it looks like some have had very little use. Lots of lenses and accessories pop up from time to time too. They claim that in November each year they like to move on their rental equipment and bring in new stuff but I have noticed that the 2nd hand gear for sale is peaking at other times of the year too.
Typically I bought a used H3D39 just over a year ago and now could pick up a H3D II with considerably lower mileage for substantially less money! I'm sure many feel likewise.
If you are purchasing in Euros then these prices might be even more appealing.
Regards
Richard

thanks Richard ..  it seems I am getting in at about the market rate ..  the only real question is how will it hold up? I'm guessing the market has stabilized a little bit .. but you never really know I guess ..
Logged

ndevlin

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 679
    • Follow me on Twitter
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2009, 09:15:07 pm »

Quote from: soneill
thanks Richard ..  it seems I am getting in at about the market rate ..  the only real question is how will it hold up? I'm guessing the market has stabilized a little bit .. but you never really know I guess ..

The rule of thumb which I have observed is depreciation of between 40% - 50 % over 24 months.  The curve flattens after two cycles, as the item hits a bare bottom where its continuing absolute utility gives it some latent value that decreases at a much lower pace (ie: 1st generation digital backs like the Kodak Pro which are now in the $2-4K range).

This is really painful, but if you plan on it, at least you won't have a heart-attack when it happens.

It's probably safe to say that if your annual film costs (and recovery) do not equal the cost of owning the camera or back on this basis (after depreciation tax credits are factored in), you shouldn't own it except as a luxury item.

- N.
Logged
Nick Devlin   @onelittlecamera        ww

Ed Jack

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 225
H3D 39 - Second Hand market rate ..
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2009, 04:19:25 am »

Quote from: ndevlin
The rule of thumb which I have observed is depreciation of between 40% - 50 % over 24 months.  The curve flattens after two cycles, as the item hits a bare bottom where its continuing absolute utility gives it some latent value that decreases at a much lower pace (ie: 1st generation digital backs like the Kodak Pro which are now in the $2-4K range).

This is really painful, but if you plan on it, at least you won't have a heart-attack when it happens.

It's probably safe to say that if your annual film costs (and recovery) do not equal the cost of owning the camera or back on this basis (after depreciation tax credits are factored in), you shouldn't own it except as a luxury item.

- N.

 I second thoose thoughts Nick.

I have been a member of this site since its inception and thanks to Michael and others time to review and discuss these items, have followed the evolution of these MF systems over the last 10 years or so.

Let's be positive and all agree that medium format systems have come on a long way... a very long way. They have survived this long at premium prices and will continue to do so.

To put things in  perspective it took about 4 years for a medium format back maker to think about putting an LCD on the back of their digital backs which could only shoot at iso50/100. Now we have 60MP resolution and some MF backs can shoot at iso1600 at 1FPS and be used in the field all day with only a change of batteries or so.  Who would have thought that today in 2009 that the top end systems are becoiming integrated with camera systems and have all the shooting feature you can expect from a D-SLR (speed/usability) such that some are approching just a large D-SLR in design. So can the doom merchants take time to reflect on not just where we are, but where we have come from!

As for thoose who made big investments, which subsequently ended up massivley devalued, well thanks for funding this great industry that provides alternative products to mass produced 35mm based D-SLRs by being an early adopter. I personally do buy used products a fair bit (mostly lenses mind you), its all I can afford and I hope that people investing in new backs now are able to pay for them or justyfy the expense in term's of productivity return. On the flip side, there is nothing wrong with spending your hard earned cash on theese things either "just for fun" as long as one is aware that the higher you start the bigger the fall  !

EJ
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up