Help! Steadiness required but lacking!

[John Clifford]

I need some advice. I'm having a hard time getting my tripod-mounted camera to be completely still when I take a photograph.

I'm using a dSLR (either Sigma SD14 or Pentax K20D) with a telephoto lens (70-200/2.8 or 100-300/4), on a Manfrotto tripod with a Bogen 3421 gymbal head, and finding it impossible to keep the camera/lens completely still during longer exposures (1/2 sec or thereabouts). I'm using a remote shutter release, and I'm either locking the mirror up and waiting several seconds for any vibration to subside (SD14), or using 'Live View' that has the mirror locked up (K20D).

I have been 'balancing' the camera/lens via positioning the sliding plate; would it be better to ensure the camera is 'front-heavy'? This is my next strategy. I don't have a weight attached to the tripod's center column... would this help?

What is a rock-solid way of securing a camera in the field?

[mahleu]

I would think tail heavy would be better. You can try putting a bean bag on top of the lens on your tripod, it dampens the vibrations a bit.

[situgrrl]

First question is which tripod?  In my experience, the 190 isn't big enough for much other than a standard lens on a small SLR.  I think they have punier ones too.

Secondly - I'd speak to Manfrotto about the head being fit for purpose - it looks like a lighting bracket to me!  The camera mount is so far from the tripod base I can't see it being stable for long exposures.

[Wayne Fox]

I need some advice. I'm having a hard time getting my tripod-mounted camera to be completely still when I take a photograph.

I'm using a dSLR (either Sigma SD14 or Pentax K20D) with a telephoto lens (70-200/2.8 or 100-300/4), on a Manfrotto tripod with a Bogen 3421 gymbal head, and finding it impossible to keep the camera/lens completely still during longer exposures (1/2 sec or thereabouts). I'm using a remote shutter release, and I'm either locking the mirror up and waiting several seconds for any vibration to subside (SD14), or using 'Live View' that has the mirror locked up (K20D).

I have been 'balancing' the camera/lens via positioning the sliding plate; would it be better to ensure the camera is 'front-heavy'? This is my next strategy. I don't have a weight attached to the tripod's center column... would this help?

What is a rock-solid way of securing a camera in the field?

Why the gimbal head?  They are designed to help you reposition the camera  quickly, such as when shooting wildlife, not really to take long exposures.  I think a well made ball head would be superior for long exposures.

[Tony Beach]

I think a well made ball head would be superior for long exposures.

I agree.  I see a big difference when I place my cameras on RRS pano heads versus placing them directly on the ballhead.  Furthermore, even slight breezes cause issues with longer lenses, so a adding weight (heavier legs or hanging gear off of them) to the rig helps, including a beanbag on top of the lens hood.

[bill proud]

John,

Without seeing your setup it is hard to envision the problem but it is a problem that many photographers find hard to overcome and one I struggled with for sometime using a Canon 500mm f/4 glass and still never achieving 100% dead-on focus all the time.  

It could be vibration but it might be improper focus or just poor glass. You don't say which lenses but they sound like good lenses,(f/2.8 and f/4).

You have eliminated mirror slap by locking up the mirror and waiting a few seconds, both good techniques. since you are seeing the same problem with two different cameras, I would guess it isn't the bodies but either the head or the tripod or the glass.

manfrotto/bogen tripods are/were notorious for allowing vibration transfer through the mount into the camera body but you have eliminated that by locking up the mirror. Don't know the head but it could be a problem.

One possibility is the tripod not being set up level and with the legs properly opened for balance. The off balance/partial open leg situation leaves room for camera movement by the slightest of breezes.

What it sounds like is poor glass or bad focus and not camera movement, or the above tripod problems.

Have you tried shooting the camera indoors on a solid ground surface such as a concrete garage floor?

good luck,

[dchew]

Although I'm not familiar with the Bogen 3421, I found this photo.  It does not look particularly well designed for long exposures.  I too think it would be worth testing a decent ball head.

Dave Chew

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi,

adding to other valid comments, I'd like to point out that I never have been impressed by Manfrotto Quick Release (QR) stuff. Any QR plate needs be firmly fixed on both sides. The other issue is that you can never increase stability by adding stuff, except possibly by adding weight. The key to stability is to remove everything unnecessary and have metal-to-metal contact as long as possible. Rubber or cork inserts should be removed. Try to avoid anything that has the slightest amount of play. There are two keys to avoid vibration.

1) Eliminate the cause of vibration
   - Putting the camera on tripod eliminates hand shake
   - Releasing with cable release eliminates shake from pressing release button
   - Mirror lock up (MLU) reduces vibration from mirror

2) Reduce vibration
   - Heavy tripod may vibrate less than a lighter one
   - Solid connections with no play distribute vibration over the whole mass of the assembly

I had massive problems with vibrations caused by shutter on my Pentax 67. I could never get a sharp picture using 300/4 + 1.4 extender on my Manfrotto 055CB even after adding Bogens biggest head. After replacing the 055CB with a Velbon Sherpa Pro 630 carbon fiber tripod and a lightweight magnesium head I never had any problems. I presently use a Velbon Sherpa with an RRS BH 40 ball head, often with a 400/4.5 and 1.4 or 2.0 converters and that combination works for me.

Regarding the Velbon I actually have chosen it after comparing with a few Gitzo carbon fibre models. The Velbons felt much more solid than the Gitzos they had in that shop. I live in a small town so I don't really have a lot of opportunity to check out tripods. Would they have a heavier duty Gitzo in the shop I may have walked out with a Gitzo. The shop had Mountaineer type Gitzos only. I was really looking for something like the now discontinued 1325.


Best regards
Erik

I need some advice. I'm having a hard time getting my tripod-mounted camera to be completely still when I take a photograph.

I'm using a dSLR (either Sigma SD14 or Pentax K20D) with a telephoto lens (70-200/2.8 or 100-300/4), on a Manfrotto tripod with a Bogen 3421 gymbal head, and finding it impossible to keep the camera/lens completely still during longer exposures (1/2 sec or thereabouts). I'm using a remote shutter release, and I'm either locking the mirror up and waiting several seconds for any vibration to subside (SD14), or using 'Live View' that has the mirror locked up (K20D).

I have been 'balancing' the camera/lens via positioning the sliding plate; would it be better to ensure the camera is 'front-heavy'? This is my next strategy. I don't have a weight attached to the tripod's center column... would this help?

What is a rock-solid way of securing a camera in the field?

[Plekto]

Another thing to consider might be that the tripod legs themselves might not be getting a stable footing and wobbling or moving around.  IIRC, they do make more spongy and deformable foot covers for most tripods to deal with this sort of thing.

EDIT:
Also, the legs themselves might be causing the problem.  Pick up the thing with the legs extended.(or at least one at a time).  Check it for rattles, wobbles, and excessive vibration.(hitting it softly with non-marring object, of course).   Some tripods have miserable legs that are about as stable as a bunch of plates stacked on top of each other.  I've found that this can vary as well between examples of the same tripod, now that quality control is rubbish due to it all being made in China.

[marcmccalmont]

I have seen a noticeable improvement by hanging my backpack on the tripod hook.

Good sized tripod
Good Ball head
Mirror lockup/live view
Remote release
Backpack on hook
Manual focus

Marc

[jjj]

I have seen a noticeable improvement by hanging my backpack on the tripod hook.

Exactly what I'd suggest. The more weight the better. Can help dampen even flimsy  tripods.

[AndyF2]

Exactly what I'd suggest. The more weight the better. Can help dampen even flimsy  tripods.

That would stabilize the tripod, but the physically long lens tube might still wobble around; would adding something like a bungee cord from the front of the lens to a tripod leg add enough tension, to keep the lens stable?  Not a strong enough cord to stress the lens mount, but enough to keep the entire system under some tension.

And, try with IS on and off.  It usually has to off when tripod mounted but it depends on the amount of motion and the IS sensitivity.
Andy

[lightstand]

I am very interested in this topic as well. I have never found an absolute rock solid tripod/head even using the heaviest Bogen. Like you know the key is wait out until all the movement has subsided, and I have found the bubble level to be a great tool to watch & see when the slight vibrations reside.

jeff

[marcmccalmont]

I'm not at home so I cannot display a picture but I designed and built a vibration isolation device that is mounted between the ballhead and the tripod to damp both vibrations from the camera/mirror to the tripod and from the ground/tripod to the camera. My quick testing showed that it helps. The downside is it is a well damped elastic material so the camera tends to sag a bit if it is tilted up or down which makes framing a but touchy. I learned a lot about vibration control when I was designing loudspeakers for a living and made contacts in the military industry where vibration control is important (submarines etc) Placing your hand on the mirror box helps damp some vibrations also.
Marc

[jeffreybehr]

I've had a few tripods (TPs), ballmounts, lensmounts, long lenses, etc., over my 8 years as a fotog.  Here are some things I've learned, sometimes the expensive way.
1. CF tripods are better damped and stiffer than aluminum-tube TPs.
2. I've had one each Gitzo 12- and 13-series, Velbon CF, and Hakuba CF TPs.  The Gitzo 1325 (without centerpost) was by far the best at holding a heavy camera and lens rock steady.  My current Hakuba HG-6230C is very good and lots lighter to carry; I don't use as-long lenses as I used to.
3. I've used a few different ballheads and have settled on the Kirks.  Currently I use the smaller BH-3... http://www.kirkphoto.com/ballheadbh3.html#convert .  If I were you I'd consider the 'standard'-size BH-1... http://www.kirkphoto.com/ballheads.html .
4. Also consider the Kirk King Cobra lens mount.  http://www.kirkphoto.com/cobra.html  

All this stuff may be expensive, but what you have now isn't working, right?