Topic: Medium Format Pocket Camera ??? (Read 8934 times)

Anders_HK · « **on:** October 10, 2008, 10:35:03 am »

Hi,

Lets not get into discussion of what defines medium format.

I am back from travel to Boracay, Philippines where I used my new Sigma DP1 alongside my Aptus 65 + AFDIII. Processing some of the files from the DP1 in Camera RAW I am struck by how medium format they feel. I refer to colors, depth of field and photgraphic graphics simiar to my Aptus. Forget the differnce in pixels... does that matter for this? The files from DP1 do not at all feel like DSLR bayer files. They feel medium format like. And... the camera complement my Aptus 65 + AFDIII and Mamiya 7 well. They did not only feel as cameras, but as paint brushes, differnt tools for different purposes.

The DP1 is simple to use, very photographic in its controls and without many 'useless' auto functions. It is a little slow to point to make you think and plan better, it is like back to photography rather than point and shoot. I use it with with a Voigtlander 28mm viewfinder which is joyful bright. Now... if I could only figure out how to get that one off, due to its screw that has made it stuck in the flash shoe. Does anyone have a recommendation?? Then I could use it also with the DP1 flash which I bought a Canon cord for... works... gives me TTL flash that makes flash looks like more natural pointed light than than when mounted direct on camera.... Really fun to use also!

Of course I shoot RAW. Attached are two photos from Boracay... one of my favorite places....

Yes, and the DP1 does not add much weight to my bag

Any more medium format shooters with same experience?

Regards
Anders

Anders_HK · « **Reply #1 on:** October 10, 2008, 10:40:25 am »

Above my impression, no direct comparison to my Aptus to post.

Raw files ...

http://download.yousendit.com/R3owT0NlcTIzMW52Wmc9PQ

http://download.yousendit.com/R3owT0NXRStkMnMwTVE9PQ

(limited number of downloads)

NOTE: to read DP1 files need http://labs.adobe.com/wiki/index.php?title=Camera_Raw_4.6

You think?

Snook · « **Reply #2 on:** October 10, 2008, 10:59:58 am »

Quote from: Anders_HK

Raw files will be posted...

What made you come to that conclusion?
My little leica D-lux 3 also take very nice images in a a lot of light like your shot's. But I certainly would not compare it to my P30..?
I am glad you are happy with it but do not see the reasoning?
Could you explain more.
Looks like you had nice light so a lot of cameras will shine when produced with a lot of light like your images are showing.

Maybe some more example would be better in order to make a real decision but that should be in a dslr forum I believe or no?

Let us know, I would love to save 15,000 and shoot with just a DP1 for 600.00 us $...:+}
SNook

Anders_HK · « **Reply #3 on:** October 10, 2008, 11:07:15 am »

Hi Snook,

I merely share my impressions. You are free to make yours. Play with my just recent posted links to the raw file downloads if you like and then judge.

My impression is that there is no way any camera same physical size gets near the DP1 in image quality. For more examples, some of my research before purchase was at http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1027

Regards
Anders

Quote from: Snook

What made you come to that conclusion?
Let us know, I would love to save 15,000 and shoot with just a DP1 for 600.00 us $...:+}
SNook

Good grief , it aint a replacement for my Aptus 65 either. It is complement. Too small pixels. Not lens choices. Some (note some) less DR (but far more than any DSLR I come across RAWs from). Not same large viewfinder as AFDIII but still... joy....

Yes, DP1 is Foveon... when there will be FOVEON FF645 Leaf Aptus???

Anthony R · « **Reply #4 on:** October 10, 2008, 11:08:26 am »

I'll also state that I'm happy that you are happy, but I'm disagreeing with you. In fact, to me, having shot similar things as the images that you have posted and in similar light, I prefer the shots from my G9 and wouldn't even bother comparing those to a 1DS MKIII or 5D for that matter, let alone a Phase or Leaf capture. Everyone's different though in their needs and what they find pleasing.

amsp · « **Reply #5 on:** October 10, 2008, 11:23:02 am »

Sorry, can't say I'm impressed either. The jpegs you posted look smudgy, low on detail, and just plain bad in many respects. Very typical P&S look if you ask me. They're also light-years from the quality I get with my 1Ds MkI, let alone my P25.

Graham Mitchell · « **Reply #6 on:** October 10, 2008, 11:23:59 am »

Misleading title. Wrong forum. Technically poor quality images.

eronald · « **Reply #7 on:** October 10, 2008, 11:26:45 am »

Quote from: amsp

Sorry, can't say I'm impressed either. The jpegs you posted look smudgy, low on detail, and just plain bad in many respects. Very typical P&S look if you ask me. They're also light-years from the quality I get with my 1Ds MkI, let alone my P25.

Nice color. The Leica is in the same ligue too.

Edmund

Snook · « **Reply #8 on:** October 10, 2008, 11:31:11 am »

Quote from: eronald

Nice color. The Leica is in the same ligue too.

Edmund

Yeh and the new Leica d-lux4 might be something to talk about. Not compare to medium format, but something to talk about...;+}

Like I said and Foto-z pointed out... Wrong Forum!

Snook

PS. My Leica D-lux 3 Is a Love/Hate relationship.. Sometimes I love it, But most of the time I hate it.. re: Lowlight/nightshots/etc...
When a lot of light it is a winner and I really like the muted skin tones I get with it sometimes.. Almost like the original 1Ds.
But that is far as it goes..
My next Point and shoot will be a 5DII...:+}

Anders_HK · « **Reply #9 on:** October 10, 2008, 12:07:54 pm »

Guys, as stated not trying compete/compare with medium format on this one, just stating my impression the RAW files in Camera Raw feels medium format like to adjust. Obvisous smaller pixels (and sensor) than a MFDB, and much greater DR than any similar sized camera. I looked at LX3 for serious, but no way image files RAW come near DP1's. Also looked at the not latest Leica point and shoots. All those and similar small camera, in my personal impression, come out shallow comapared to DP1. Also many except perhaps some of latest DSLRs does, perhaps all of them. Obvious, because sensor of DP1 is larger than any small camera, and is Foveon. The sensor is huge compared to any similar sized camera! The lens is also sharp. DP1 impress me more than D50 did, D200 did, G9 did. I regret owned them before, including G9 for very short time. The problem with G9 is shallow DRand shutter lag, and all auto functions. Else impressive image quality for a small camera, although my impression is DP1 beats it hands down, obvious in DR and shallower DOF.

No way it replace my medium format Aptus or Mamiya 7 or direct compare to it, but processing the files in Camera RAW feels more Leaf like than anything I think I have seen in DSLR or smaller size, maybe just me...

We are perhaps all different...

That is all.

Anders

Plekto · « **Reply #10 on:** October 10, 2008, 02:20:52 pm »

Yes, the thing looks similar to medium format film, but honestly, it looks like it was shot with a consumer grade TLR 120 film camera from the 60s. At best. The "look" is there, but the resolution is honestly barely larger than APS, let alone approaching 35mm.

Lovely to look at, but no detail where it's needed. Very oil painting like, in fact(which DOES make for excellent outdoor shots due to this effect, IMO)

stefan marquardt · « **Reply #11 on:** October 10, 2008, 04:40:30 pm »

Quote from: Anders_HK

Any more medium format shooters with same experience?

yes, me.

I used a sd9 for a while. very similar quality characteristics to medium format but from a tiny sensor (with all the pros and cons!)
try to explain this to anybody who has no real experience with the foveon sensor, is just like when digital medium format shooters tell 35mm or canon users how much better medium format is. some see it, some dont.

teddillard · « **Reply #12 on:** October 10, 2008, 04:51:12 pm »

hey man, i'm right there with ya. i call my Canon G9 my pocket 120. big, badass files.

...and to bring this back to the forum, i tested a lot of 2000-2004 vintage medium format backs back when they were new products i sold, and i've actually said out loud that the G9 beats some of them. (not namin names)

...i'm just sayin.

joern_kiel · « **Reply #13 on:** October 11, 2008, 09:30:48 am »

Quote from: foto-z

Misleading title. Wrong forum. Technically poor quality images.

Wow. very useful opinion. thanks for sharing, Graham.
I like your `wrong forum`comments the most.

The DP1 is a nice camera, at least a nice concept. I once downloaded some samples from the DP1 site and processed them within PS and LightZone. And i must say that i like the film like results, the look of the files.
They are very workable, color rendition is smooth and creamy, the Foveon chip technology is amazing. I am still waiting for the DP2.

TMARK · « **Reply #14 on:** October 11, 2008, 10:56:00 pm »

Quote from: foto-z

Misleading title. Wrong forum. Technically poor quality images.

"Technically poor quality images." Please elaborate. They look fine to me, very nice to look at.

David Klepacki · « **Reply #15 on:** October 11, 2008, 11:39:30 pm »

Hi Anders, I appreciate your post here. I think there are plenty of people in the MF forum who are interested in what pocketable cameras other MF shooters decide to use. So, I do no not think this is the wrong forum for such a post. Thanks for sharing your images and opinions.

Author Topic: Medium Format Pocket Camera ??? (Read 8934 times)

Snook

Snook

joern_kiel