C1 PRO 3.7.9 vs C1 DB 4.1 ??

[juiceboy99]

I have heard several people say that the new Capture One 4.1
does a better job in processing Phase One RAW files......than the older 3.7.9 ....

Has anyone done side by side comparisons ??

thanks

[amsp]

I've done some comparisons, and from what I've seen 3.7 does a better job with high ISO photos (at least with my P25), but 4.1 does a much better job with everything else. I will do more tests when the PRO version is released.

[juiceboy99]

By the way,     what 's the highest ISO you can go on the P25
to get a usable image ?

from what i have tested,   400 ISO is not usable,  there is too much noise to use at all ......

Is there any way to shoot at 400 ISO and remove the noise somehow ??

I've done some comparisons, and from what I've seen 3.7 does a better job with high ISO photos (at least with my P25), but 4.1 does a much better job with everything else. I will do more tests when the PRO version is released.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219392\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[James R Russell]

By the way,     what 's the highest ISO you can go on the P25
to get a usable image ?

from what i have tested,   400 ISO is not usable,  there is too much noise to use at all ......

Is there any way to shoot at 400 ISO and remove the noise somehow ??
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219427\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

4.0 does a better job on skin tones. than 3.7 and the dual editing windows are nice for grading and matching multiple images.  Processing is wicked fast for high rez.  The interface is way different and somewhat complicated compared to lightroom, still having to switch from tab to tab for different functions.  The previews are much better than lightroom, though 3.78 previews were by today's standards challanged at best.

For high iso it's kind of hit and miss.  We did a fairly comprehensive test on higher iso on the p30+ and the P21+ and 4.0's noise sliders are very, very, very sensitive.  one slight move and you go from huge track noise to a painterly look with a lot of work to find the sweet spot.

Though both of my backs have microlenses, I would consider 400 iso on the p21+ and the p30+ to be the very top speed of where you can work without a lot of post work.

For higher iso 3.78 is slghtly better, Raw Developer even better still.

Lightroom somewhere in between the two.

JR

[Jack Flesher]

We did a fairly comprehensive test on higher iso on the p30+ and the P21+ and 4.0's noise sliders are very, very, very sensitive.  one slight move and you go from huge track noise to a painterly look with a lot of work to find the sweet spot.



For higher iso 3.78 is slghtly better, Raw Developer even better still.


[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219428\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Interesting.  With my P45+, I find a *huge* jump in NR using the slider in 3.7, but have a lot of fine "tunability" with the sliders in 4.1...  

In the end however, I find it is usually better to leave some noise in the C1 conversion and use a third-party NR tool like DFine to really do a spectacular job.  In so doing, I get usable ISO 1600 shots out of my P45+.  (Note that my P45+ only goes to ISO 800, so for 1600 I under expose one and push one during development for an equivalent ISO 1600. This does compress DR somewhat and the added NR does cause a loss of detail, but IMO I maintain more detail than -- or at least equal detail to -- say a P25 back at normal ISO...)

Cheers,

[tho_mas]

Interesting.  With my P45+, I find a *huge* jump in NR using the slider in 3.7, but have a lot of fine "tunability" with the sliders in 4.1... [a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219443\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

the same here (P45)

[juiceboy99]

thanks for the interesting replies.

the same here (P45)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219447\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[Snook]

thanks for the interesting replies.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219752\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I am going to start trying to get used to using 4.1.1 after much thought...
I was wondering a couple of things if someone could help out.
With 3.7.9 I use the Preview converter to quickly convert the images to low jpegs for my clients.
Can you use this with 4.1.1 and if so how?
Also is the any way to make the previews just a little bigger?
It is great tool but the previews to jpeg are not quite good enough to judge focus etc..
Also in the make web contact sheet are the previews better or bigger.
My problem is my clients like to fill in the layouts with jpegs on the fly during shoots and sometimes the jpegs are to small to judge the if they are in focus or not.

Is the folder structure basically the same as the older 3.7.9??
Can I easily find the folders and manually take out the RAWs and copy them on the fly like I do in 3.7.9
Thank you
Snook

PS. are there and Blogs or sites where you can learn more about 4.1.1 and how to make the work flow more efficient?
Not just the basics but a more in depth way of filing and using all the benefits of 4.1.1
I would to show my assistants and I would love to learn a little more about it.
That way we can be a little more prepared for when the Pro version comes out , if it ever does...:+}

[tho_mas]

I was wondering a couple of things if someone could help out.[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219863\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I think the most of your question will be answered when you play around with the software.
There is no "quick proof" anymore but you can use the "web contact sheet" as workaround (pick the jpegs from the folder "photos"). The preview size is variable though max. size is 1000pixels (wide or high). But that should be big enough to judge about focus, no?
Folder structure is different. No central cache anymore (unfortunately).
It's not an update... it's a new software based on older versions. So some things are really different (some are better, some not).

[Jack Flesher]

PS. are there and Blogs or sites where you can learn more about 4.1.1 and how to make the work flow more efficient?

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219863\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

If it were me, I'd wait until C1 4 Pro comes out before worrying too much about it...

[James R Russell]

If it were me, I'd wait until C1 4 Pro comes out before worrying too much about it...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219896\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Why?

4 makes better skin tones and actuall overall processing has dual windows for matching images, processes high rez tiffs in seconds and takes all of 11 minutes to learn the program.

Even if it takes longer, the time you put in it will be saved on the back end with less corrections and faster processing.

It's not like reading War And Peace.

It really is a simple program to learn.


JR

[Snook]

Why?

4 makes better skin tones and actuall overall processing has dual windows for matching images, processes high rez tiffs in seconds and takes all of 11 minutes to learn the program.

Even if it takes longer, the time you put in it will be saved on the back end with less corrections and faster processing.

It's not like reading War And Peace.

It really is a simple program to learn.
JR
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219911\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks James.
Since you said the skin tones were better I have been interested....:+}

I am sure it is not rocket science either , Just wondering if there were any good Blobs or anything for more information.

Does anybody know if they have any kind of presets like the older 3.7.9 does.... Not that I use them that much, but always love to experiment...
That is what I love about Lightroom. I have about 200 presets that do really cool effects.
Just I have never worked lightroom into my work flow. I usually use it on a the final images if needed, I do not quite like the RAW conversion of lightroom on my P30. But the presets are sweet.
Sure would be nice if you could work some presets into C-1 4.1.1 or pro when it comes out.
It is nice, Like James says, to be able and show the client or art director a little of the direction you want to go with the final image.
In C-1 I usually just drop the sat a little and bump up the contrast a little and that is about all you can do in my mind...:+]
Thanks
Snook

[Jack Flesher]

Why?

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=219911\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I meant worrying about the shortcomings in 4.1 lite...

[clawery]

Take a look at this Phase One Knowledge Base article:

http://www.phaseone.com/HOME/Content/Suppo...Site%20-%20Main

It will cover some of the comparisons between Capture One 3.7.8 and 4.1.

Chris Lawery
Sales Manager
chris@captureintegration.com
Capture Integration, Phase One Dealer of the Year

877-217-9870 | National  Atlanta / Miami
404-234-5195 | Cell  
Sign up for our Newsletter | Read Our Latest Newsletter

[Snook]

Take a look at this Phase One Knowledge Base article:

http://www.phaseone.com/HOME/Content/Suppo...Site%20-%20Main

It will cover some of the comparisons between Capture One 3.7.8 and 4.1.

Chris Lawery
Sales Manager
chris@captureintegration.com
Capture Integration, Phase One Dealer of the Year

877-217-9870 | National  Atlanta / Miami
404-234-5195 | Cell 
Sign up for our Newsletter | Read Our Latest Newsletter
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=220114\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Did not want to start another post but wanted to ask something please..
Today I was shooting tethered and the images came in as Camera RGB from P30 profiled and only after shooting for a while did I notice.. Then I changed the Profile to P30 Flash and the image changed dramatically... Look nothing like what I thought the images looked like.. They were certainly brighter than the other profile.
Should I be using the P30 profiles when using C-1?? My output image is always going to be tiff Adobe RGB 1998..
I know this is all just for a visual but what is the "correct" way to have it set-up?

Why did the images start coming in from the P30 with a RGB camera profile instead of some P30 profile?

Thanks for any help.

Snook

[Guy Mancuso]

Snook this is a bug in 4.1 . Any image tethered or not is defaulting to P25 Flash (me) same with the P30 . This will be changed in Pro to set to whatever you set it to and stay there. For now just select all and make it what you wish than apply that correction. Than all the images will have let's say the daylight tag on them. PITA but i was promised a fix is coming in Pro. Which i expect to be seen at Photokinia

[Snook]

Snook this is a bug in 4.1 . Any image tethered or not is defaulting to P25 Flash (me) same with the P30 . This will be changed in Pro to set to whatever you set it to and stay there. For now just select all and make it what you wish than apply that correction. Than all the images will have let's say the daylight tag on them. PITA but i was promised a fix is coming in Pro. Which i expect to be seen at Photokinia
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=220485\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks Guy but I am having the problem in 3.7.9
When I tether.. the pictures always come in with an rgb camera profile tag and not the P30 tag.
Thanks for info..
Snook

[Snook]

Snook,

Check these two areas:

Make sure in Preferences > Color Management tab > Camera that the 'for camera' and 'Use Profile by Default' are set to P30 and the profile you want.

Also, in the Capture Tool tab, have Settings on 'inherit from last capture' and ICC profile to the one you want for your P30.

These are the areas that control the profile being automatically applied to each capture.

If that doesn't do it, then I don't know what to say.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=220600\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thank you very much John... I will check that out...
Appreciate the help
Snook

[Doug Peterson]

We also have a blog entry titled Capture One 4.1.X Tips & Tricks which should help you improve your workflow speed.

Workflow speed is a big deal at Phase One R&D, and a lot of the features you will see at Photokina are to address the concerns/suggestions of customers like JR. For instance, they've been working on floating/re-arrangeable pallets for the adjustments so that you can pull whatever adjustments/options you use into the "Q" (Quick) tab so you don't have to switch between tabs. As well they are adding many more customizable keyboard shortcuts for power users. The long wait for C1 4 Pro is soon to be over.

I use Capture One 4 for all my persona shoots. I use the Make Web Contact sheet function to create quick JPGs (aside from using it to make web galleries). For instance I created this "Web Contact Sheet" and then used the JPGs (which reside in the /photos/previews/ subfolder of the webgallery) to create a webgallery for my blog entry on it.

Doug Peterson
Capture Integration, Phase One Dealer
Personal Portfolio

[woof75]

We also have a blog entry titled Capture One 4.1.X Tips & Tricks which should help you improve your workflow speed.

Workflow speed is a big deal at Phase One R&D, and a lot of the features you will see at Photokina are to address the concerns/suggestions of customers like JR. For instance, they've been working on floating/re-arrangeable pallets for the adjustments so that you can pull whatever adjustments/options you use into the "Q" (Quick) tab so you don't have to switch between tabs. As well they are adding many more customizable keyboard shortcuts for power users. The long wait for C1 4 Pro is soon to be over.

I use Capture One 4 for all my persona shoots. I use the Make Web Contact sheet function to create quick JPGs (aside from using it to make web galleries). For instance I created this "Web Contact Sheet" and then used the JPGs (which reside in the /photos/previews/ subfolder of the webgallery) to create a webgallery for my blog entry on it.

Doug Peterson
Capture Integration, Phase One Dealer
Personal Portfolio
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=220644\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hey, thanks for that link, one very useful thing I found which should be in big red letters before you ever use version 4 is that it only uses the default system monitor profile so if you use an external monitor on a laptop the colour is a mile off. Typical for software companies not to mention that except in the very fine print. All of a sudden version 4 has become very useable.