Question re: Agencies

[pookipichu]

Since this forum has the most professionals, I felt like it would be the best place to ask.  If anyone is offended by my thread, I will delete it and am sorry.

My question is how many photos do you send to a modeling agency after a test?  The agency I started shooting for wants me to send all the images.  I don't feel comfortable sending all the images, especially since I wasn't paid for the tests.  I have no problem sending 3 retouched photos.  I told the agent that if the model wants more he would have to pay.  Am I being too stingy, is there a standard practice regarding this?  I greatly appreciate advice.

PS - I should clarify that I sent thumbnails of all the images but the agency wants high res of all the images from the shoot.

[Graham Mitchell]

This is the sort of thing you should try and agree on beforehand. If you are not being paid, you can use your own discretion. After all, there was no agreement as to how many exposures you would make anyway! I only send agencies a few selected images, definitely not every frame.

[pookipichu]

This is the sort of thing you should try and agree on beforehand. If you are not being paid, you can use your own discretion. After all, there was no agreement as to how many exposures you would make anyway! I only send agencies a few selected images, definitely not every frame.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196462\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thank you for your input Graham.  I am very new and have only worked with 3 agencies.  The new one is the first to request all the images.  I wasn't sure if this was the norm or if the other agencies were just more passive.

I feel weird because I don't want to burn bridges, but I feel like my role as a photographer is dimished if I am supposed to give them all my work for free.

[mcfoto]

Since this forum has the most professionals, I felt like it would be the best place to ask.  If anyone is offended by my thread, I will delete it and am sorry.

My question is how many photos do you send to a modeling agency after a test?  The agency I started shooting for wants me to send all the images.  I don't feel comfortable sending all the images, especially since I wasn't paid for the tests.  I have no problem sending 3 retouched photos.  I told the agent that if the model wants more he would have to pay.  Am I being too stingy, is there a standard practice regarding this?  I greatly appreciate advice.

PS - I should clarify that I sent thumbnails of all the images but the agency wants high res of all the images from the shoot.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196458\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi
Only send in three. You are not getting paid. Only show your best work. The reason why the agency wants to see all the images is they want to edit your work. what will happen is they will pick an image which you will not like. And once you do this you loose control of your work & quality. Stick tp your guns here. Just make great images & they will be happy.
Denis

[pookipichu]

I shot the tests so I could start working together with the agency, I wanted to get their referrals and work with their models.  

I am getting the feeling from Graham and Denis's response that giving them all the high res pics is not the norm and that they are trying to take advantage because of my naivete.   They have put me in awkward position because even if every image I took was great or lousy, I don't think they are entitled to all of them.  

I don't understand: did you shoot a test to become a photographer for the agency, or did you shoot samples for a model to get into an agency? Or did you want to test a model from an agency? In any case I would never hand over any materials that I didn't approve to by my own standards. Keep in mind that you are responsible for the face (= your work) that will people make you recognize by. Even if they offer money, never give out bad stuff. Your name will be connected to it forever.

EPd
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[TMARK]

I show agencies the top three from each set up.  If only one set up, I show 10 or so.  

Where are you located?  My experience in NYC is that they want the shots for comp cards, but they mainly want the girls to get experience under lights and on set.  I have only shot tests for a fee, about $400 give or take.  Its great when you are working out an idea that is too raw  (in terms of technique) for an editorial that will be published.  If the test works out you book the same model for the editorial.

[Dustbak]

This is the sort of thing you should try and agree on beforehand. If you are not being paid, you can use your own discretion. After all, there was no agreement as to how many exposures you would make anyway! I only send agencies a few selected images, definitely not every frame.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196462\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I only send those that I see fit for their eyes to view. No un-processed images will leave my studio. Since you are not getting paid for this I would say it is definitely up to your discretion.

You can be polite and friendly and at the same time very clear in your communications to your client. This is a very important skill that often is overlooked.

[elitegroup]

Hi
Only send in three. You are not getting paid. Only show your best work. The reason why the agency wants to see all the images is they want to edit your work. what will happen is they will pick an image which you will not like. And once you do this you loose control of your work & quality. Stick tp your guns here. Just make great images & they will be happy.
Denis
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196465\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I only send those that I see fit for their eyes to view. No un-processed images will leave my studio. Since you are not getting paid for this I would say it is definitely up to your discretion.

You can be polite and friendly and at the same time very clear in your communications to your client. This is a very important skill that often is overlooked.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196486\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I agree with Denis and Dustbak, I only send the strongest 3-5 images from each look that have have been digitally edited.

Never send all, raw or untouched images  

In the future clarify your intentions with the agency to save any misunderstandings.

Oh, and can I see one or two from the shoot  

[James R Russell]

I agree with Denis and Dustbak, I only send the strongest 3-5 images from each look that have have been digitally edited.

Never send all, raw or untouched images   

In the future clarify your intentions with the agency to save any misunderstandings.

Oh, and can I see one or two from the shoot 
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196498\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I think you need to look at it from the agent's standpoint.   You didn't get paid, but you also required time and effort from the models and the agents so it is an investment for all.

If you are going to work in this maner, one of two images probably doesn't tell the agent much about you or the model.   They want to see how you work, direct, how their new model reacts and a few images limit that view.

Personally I would show much more than a few, though I would edit for my and the model's protection.  Obviously don't show mistakes, but give a large enough representation so the agent can be involved.

You'll learn from this and it will make you better, (if the agent is good).

JR

[amsp]

Yeah, I'm with James on this one. Doing tests with agencies is a give and take, especially if you're new. Everybody has invested time and effort, so you shouldn't limit the number of photos you give them. Neither should you give them images you are not happy with though. Just be generous.

[woof75]

Tell em that you shot lots of raw images that take 15 mins each to convert and prepare so you can just show them a selection, maybe more like 10 is a bit better. What they are looking for is ofte a little different to what you are looking for.

[elitegroup]

Model portfolio shoots generally consist of 4-5 looks/changes

editing the strongest 3-5 pics from each look, you'll generally end up with anywhere from 12 - 20 of your best images. This is more than enough as you do not want to compromise quality for quantity and plenty to satisfy an agent.

Be very selective about your submission as your work represents you.

Some agencies prefer to view a proof sheet rather than selections via email.

Personally I'm over shooting model books/comp cards. For me the money is just not worth it  

[condit79]

Some good advice here.  BUtT 3-5 pics is very little.  Give them a chance to select from your best work.  I never show anyone all the pics.   Give them 5 from each setup at least.   Keeping them happy is in your interest, but so is only showing what you´re comfortable with as a professional.  Shooting tests can be a good thing, but use it as a marketing tool and as a way to experiment.  I always try to make sure the agency has something they´ll want to use, and that there are other shots that maybe are just pieces for my book.  A lot of the agencies here in madrid want more high key beauty type stuff as it sells the face of the model better, but that´s only a small portion of what I shoot.  In the end, you need to get to know the agents so you know what they´ll be looking for so when you pass on a disk or contact sheets they´re seeing something that they´re content with and don´t bother you for the whole shoot.  That can feel a bit like a bit of mistrust.  remember non paid tests happen as an exchange and everyone needs to come out on top in their mind.  Be humble but still rational and hold your ground when necessary with the agents.

[pookipichu]

I agree with Denis and Dustbak, I only send the strongest 3-5 images from each look that have have been digitally edited.

Never send all, raw or untouched images   

In the future clarify your intentions with the agency to save any misunderstandings.

Oh, and can I see one or two from the shoot 
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=196498\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
[/quote]

Thanks everybody, I am really grateful for all your advice.  

Just to clarify James, the agency has seen all the images because I sent them thumbnails of all the shots right after the shoot.    

I will push back on sending them high res of all the images and will only send them 3-5 final images per model.    I have been very polite and respectful with them and hope they will respect me as well.  

I am really glad for this forum, thank you!  

PS - The first image was shot with the Hasselblad 50mm f/2.8