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Author Topic: Minolta Multi Pro ghosting  (Read 5069 times)

Hellstan

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« on: April 15, 2008, 05:48:05 pm »

Still have this ghosting on pictures.
Present on scans both with Dimage Scan or Vue Scan.
Single or multi exposure don't change nothing.
I tried to recalibrate (cmd+shift+I under Mac),
it did recalibrate, but ghosting is still there.
Tried all sorts of setting, no avail.
Only hint : when using the MF holder (even with
24x36), ghosting is far more discrete. Still there,
but easier to Photoshop.
Any clue before I send it on repair ?

A picture (bluish/magenta cast non corrected) shows the ghosting
on the front and the pointed hat of the mask (it's doubled!).
[attachment=6141:attachment]

The scanner is almost new : I bought it a few months ago
from a quite serious swedish colleague who used it for less than 100 scans.
Could it be due to a shock during shipping ? Could it be profile related ?

jhein

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2008, 06:37:30 pm »

I too am an owner of the Multiscan Pro.  The ghosting is a known design flaw in the scanner.  It is caused my the use of uncoated glass that covers the CCD chip.  There really is no simple cure for this problem.  If you search the MultiPro group at yahoo.com, you will see that this problem has been discussed before.  A possible solution is to scan the image twice.  First scan the image normally.  Next rotate the slide 180 degrees and scan again.  Next combine the two images in Photoshop but use the multiply blend option.  I have not tried this myself but this was a solution that was proposed in the group.

hope this helps
Jim

Quote
Still have this ghosting on pictures.
Present on scans both with Dimage Scan or Vue Scan.
Single or multi exposure don't change nothing.
I tried to recalibrate (cmd+shift+I under Mac),
it did recalibrate, but ghosting is still there.
Tried all sorts of setting, no avail.
Only hint : when using the MF holder (even with
24x36), ghosting is far more discrete. Still there,
but easier to Photoshop.
Any clue before I send it on repair ?

A picture (bluish/magenta cast non corrected) shows the ghosting
on the front and the pointed hat of the mask (it's doubled!).
[attachment=6141:attachment]

The scanner is almost new : I bought it a few months ago
from a quite serious swedish colleague who used it for less than 100 scans.
Could it be due to a shock during shipping ? Could it be profile related ?
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Hellstan

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2008, 06:45:57 pm »

Quote
I too am an owner of the Multiscan Pro.  The ghosting is a known design flaw in the scanner.  It is caused my the use of uncoated glass that covers the CCD chip.  There really is no simple cure for this problem.  If you search the MultiPro group at yahoo.com, you will see that this problem has been discussed before.  A possible solution is to scan the image twice.  First scan the image normally.  Next rotate the slide 180 degrees and scan again.  Next combine the two images in Photoshop but use the multiply blend option.  I have not tried this myself but this was a solution that was proposed in the group.

hope this helps
Jim
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=189799\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thank you, Jim.

Curious, because I saw several scans Erik de Goederen made with it, and I discussed it with him : he never had that problem.
What I saw on the Yahoo group was rather related to flare on the edge of certain scans, which is not my case.
As for the cure, I don't understand exactly what you suggest : If I rotate 180°   , how can I be sure to superpose both images, it's impossible. How Photoshop would perfect the mix ?

jhein

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2008, 07:21:23 pm »

The flare and ghosting are related to the uncoated glass.
Here is a very detailed thread on photo.net with examples like yours.

http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00CTcF

The photshop technique is just a form of digital blending.
Here is an example:

http://www.thelightsright.com/tutorials-pdf.htm

Click on the Blending revisited tutorial.  Basically you superimpose the two images and choose the multiply option for blending with a solid white layer mask.

hope this helps
Jim

Quote
Thank you, Jim.

Curious, because I saw several scans Erik de Goederen made with it, and I discussed it with him : he never had that problem.
What I saw on the Yahoo group was rather related to flare on the edge of certain scans, which is not my case.
As for the cure, I don't understand exactly what you suggest : If I rotate 180°   , how can I be sure to superpose both images, it's impossible. How Photoshop would perfect the mix ?
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Hellstan

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2008, 07:43:56 pm »

Quote
The flare and ghosting are related to the uncoated glass.
Here is a very detailed thread on photo.net with examples like yours.

http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00CTcF

The photshop technique is just a form of digital blending.
Here is an example:

http://www.thelightsright.com/tutorials-pdf.htm

Click on the Blending revisited tutorial.  Basically you superimpose the two images and choose the multiply option for blending with a solid white layer mask.

hope this helps
Jim
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Jim,
It helps a lot and puzzles a lot too.
Check the work of this photographer :
[a href=\"http://luguber.net/portfolio/portfolio%20iceland/iceland.html]http://luguber.net/portfolio/portfolio%20i...nd/iceland.html[/url]

He's been published in Lenswork and scanned all his pictures on an Epson 4990.
He uses now a Nikon 9000 but told me the difference was not worth it, if you
knew how to post-process in PS.
How about going back to a V750 Epson ?
I cannot consider to blend hundreds of scans…

Hellstan

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2008, 05:42:50 am »

Quote
The flare and ghosting are related to the uncoated glass.
Here is a very detailed thread on photo.net with examples like yours.

http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00CTcF

The photshop technique is just a form of digital blending.
Here is an example:

http://www.thelightsright.com/tutorials-pdf.htm

Click on the Blending revisited tutorial.  Basically you superimpose the two images and choose the multiply option for blending with a solid white layer mask.

hope this helps
Jim
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Jim,
According to E. de Goederen, it seems he never encountered that problem, and other users didn't either.
Goederen speaks about misalignment of some CCD glasses.
If I ask Sony to replace it, do you know if it could solve the problem ?
I wonder why it's visible on some images only.
If you look here, my image and the whole series :
[a href=\"https://www.lfi-online.de/gallery/displayimage.php?album=topn&cat=0&pos=2]https://www.lfi-online.de/gallery/displayim...opn&cat=0&pos=2[/url]
there is no flare at all.
Best
Hellstan

jhein

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2008, 11:30:49 am »

I only see it on certain images as well.  I mostly see it on areas of high contrast.  Like a yellow flower against a dark background.  I scan Velvia 6x7 most of the time, so I can't say if it exists on other formats like 35mm.  Erik mentions that he believes that the European models seem to suffer less than the American models.  I don't know why.   As far as Sony fixing it, good luck.  Others have tried but failed because Sony has very few spare parts.  For a time Sony even offered to buy back your scanner!!  I don't remember for how much.

Nice Images!

Jim

Quote
Jim,
According to E. de Goederen, it seems he never encountered that problem, and other users didn't either.
Goederen speaks about misalignment of some CCD glasses.
If I ask Sony to replace it, do you know if it could solve the problem ?
I wonder why it's visible on some images only.
If you look here, my image and the whole series :
https://www.lfi-online.de/gallery/displayim...opn&cat=0&pos=2
there is no flare at all.
Best
Hellstan
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Hellstan

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2008, 11:37:44 am »

Quote
I only see it on certain images as well.  I mostly see it on areas of high contrast.  Like a yellow flower against a dark background.  I scan Velvia 6x7 most of the time, so I can't say if it exists on other formats like 35mm.  Erik mentions that he believes that the European models seem to suffer less than the American models.  I don't know why.   As far as Sony fixing it, good luck.  Others have tried but failed because Sony has very few spare parts.  For a time Sony even offered to buy back your scanner!!  I don't remember for how much.

Nice Images!

Jim
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Thank you Jim.
I wonder if it could be film-dependent. I use mostly Portra Pro in colour and Agfa Pan-F
in 6x6. As it is, I did not see it on many Portra films (24x36 and MF).
In fact, misaligned CCD is replaced by Sony parent company in Germany for 118 €.
Not too brutal…  
As Minolta never acknowledged the problem, Sony won't do it free, though.

jhein

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2008, 03:23:19 pm »

If you do have your scanner serviced by Sony, please let me know it solves the problem.  I may do the same.

good luck
Jim


Quote
Thank you Jim.
I wonder if it could be film-dependent. I use mostly Portra Pro in colour and Agfa Pan-F
in 6x6. As it is, I did not see it on many Portra films (24x36 and MF).
In fact, misaligned CCD is replaced by Sony parent company in Germany for 118 €.
Not too brutal…  
As Minolta never acknowledged the problem, Sony won't do it free, though.
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Hellstan

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Minolta Multi Pro ghosting
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2008, 03:24:58 pm »

Quote
If you do have your scanner serviced by Sony, please let me know it solves the problem.  I may do the same.

good luck
Jim
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I will.
It should, as it affects a minority of misaligned CCD's.
Thanks for your help.
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