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Author Topic: Sony 25mp A900 photos  (Read 19053 times)

John Camp

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Sony 25mp A900 photos
« on: March 23, 2008, 12:18:18 pm »

The Online Photographer has a link to photos of the new 25mp Sony A900 here:

http://theonlinephotographer.com/the_onlin...blog_index.html


It looks huge, but maybe it's because it's being handled by somebody with small hands...but then, even in the other photos, it looks huge. Nice to see some specs on it.

JC
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Kenneth Sky

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« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2008, 12:46:17 pm »

The importance of this camera is that photographers will be offered choice. For those of us with legacy Minolta lenses it's a bonus. Hopefully the introduction of a 24 megapixel sensor will put an end to the pixel race and manufacturers will concentrate on pixel quality (high ISO noise and dynamic range). Sony's commitment to introduce 6 new high quality lenses this year means there will be three full frame systems that will provide the competition necessary to spur on innovation that meets consumer demands not corporate paternalism.
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DarkPenguin

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Sony 25mp A900 photos
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2008, 06:12:06 pm »

I'm betting legacy minolta lenses will not be up to a 24mp camera.
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Kenneth Sky

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« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2008, 10:56:09 pm »

To be sure. I'm noticing this even with my A700. Slowly I'm converting to Carl Zeiss lenses in anticipation of the A900. But I'll probably hold onto my G prime lenses.
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douglasf13

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« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2008, 06:31:34 pm »

Quote
To be sure. I'm noticing this even with my A700. Slowly I'm converting to Carl Zeiss lenses in anticipation of the A900. But I'll probably hold onto my G prime lenses.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=183850\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

  Me too.  Some of the prime standards like the 50mm 1.4 should be fine, but I've already got the CZ 24-70 2.8 and 85mm 1.4 ready for that bad boy.  
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tsjanik

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« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2008, 07:01:24 pm »

Sony is becoming very interesting to me too.  I have no investment in Nikon or Canon; I'm still primarily using film.  I have a big investment in Pentax (67, 645 and to a lesser extent, 35mm), but the future there is not obvious.  Pentax was once run by people who loved photography; I'm not so sure now that Hoya is in control.  In any event, the delays in introducing or maintaining lens offerings and the recent death of the 645D has convinced me to look elsewhere.  I assumed that Canon and Nikon were my choices, but now with Zeiss lenses and a clear desire to be a major camera maker, Sony has great potential.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2008, 08:12:43 pm by tsjanik »
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ErikKaffehr

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« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2008, 08:25:33 pm »

Hi!

Some will and some will not.

Erik

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I'm betting legacy minolta lenses will not be up to a 24mp camera.
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dwdallam

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« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2008, 02:24:57 am »

If Sony puts its head to photography, it will be a major competitor. I'm wondering how committed Sony is to staying in the pro camera arena? I have three Canon L lenses, but I'm not stuck on Canon for sure. If Sony competes with Canon and takes CZ lenses, I may change over.
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Kenneth Sky

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« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2008, 07:57:32 am »

Let's see: the A700 last fall, the A200, A300 & A350 this year and the promise of the "A900" by next fall, the introduction of 2 new professional level lenses and the promise of 4 more this year. I'd say that's commitment. It appears that Sony is trying to emulate its success in the video camera market by segmenting the market and flooding it with choice.
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Diapositivo

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« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2008, 08:30:45 pm »

In the seventies and eighties three big names of photography made what seemed an obvious entrance in the professional market, only to withdraw later on.

First Minolta. The XM (XK in some markets) was a top-everything camera and the lenses who got with it in the following years were certainly up to any Japanese competition if not better. But the XM (1974 if memory serves) was the first and last "professional" body.

Then Pentax. Again the lenses were absolutely on par with any Japanese competition and the LX was a compact, modern (TTL daylight and TTL flash), sealed (a first) and quality built professional camera. The first, and the last, by Pentax.

Around 1984 Olympus came out with the OM-3 and OM-4 which seemed an evident commitment to the higher segment, professional or semi-pro. Immediately after they got out of film reflex altogether.

I read somewhere the following explanation, which I deem quite right: camera makers do LOSE money on very high quality professional camera. That is true for Nikon, Canon, Leica etc.
They accept to produce those cameras at a loss, because the buyer will tipically buy several (and high quality) lenses, where they have higher margin (in percentage and in absolute value).

The trend of the sixties toward "proprietary" bayonet mount made this kind of marketing quite rationale.

So, you produce the XM (or the LX, or the OM-4) and it is great. But if only amateurs will buy it (people who would need 4 years to buy a 28, 50, 135, and maybe a flash, a bellow later on) you are not going to continue playing the game because there will be no profit. You might think the "flagship" will give "prestige" to all the line, but it is a costly marketing effort.

Entering the professional arena is "easy", but in the long run it makes economic sense only if you can convince the "real professionals" to switch to your system.

This is hard for two reasons. The first and obvious is that the proprietary bayonet mount tend to "lock" the professional user to his camera make of choice, because he will typically have a big investment in it.

The second is more subtle: a professional needs support. He needs to find assistance when he goes to an important sport event, he need to find somebody who will rent him a lens if he's got a problem (or a special need, or he want to try a new lens).

Retaining professionals means, to begin with, having a "structure" in place at every major photographic event to support professionals. That is costly.

I have spoken to a professional sport photographer last year. He choose Canon over Nikon only on the ground of the kind of support Canon Italy gives as compared to what Nital (Nikon in Italy) gives. Professionals don't look that much at technical features, they look at what happens if a lens fails in the midst of an event. Is there anybody who will try an immediate fix, or lend you a lens as a substitute? That is what matters. So in most countries the choice is only between Canon and Nikon (in the 135 market segment) and in some countries only one of the two is really viable.

And what if you go on a trip and somebody steals a lens or a body? Will you be able to find somebody to rent it to you?

So the problem with Sony today is the same it was with Minolta, Pentax and Olympus of yore. If they put a "structure" in place to support the professionals, if professionals adopt Sony, if rent-a-lens begin offering Sony gear, then you can be sure Sony is going to make ground in the professional market.

If at "photographic events" there is no Sony stand and assistance, and no Sony rental, than you know it is the same old story as ever, Sony will quietly go back to limiting themselves to the consumer market, which is less risky and gives more immediate rewards.

The coming Olympic games will be a good test to see if really Sony wants to be a player in the professional market.

If they are not there, I would not bet on the next generation of professional Sony cameras, and I would not invest in Sony equipment (regardless of the quality of Sony-Zeiss material) to avoid remaining locked in a system which remains limited in the main commercial segment in the future.

"Commitment" to the professional segment is demonstrated by putting in place said "structure". No structure, no party.

Cheers
Fabrizio
« Last Edit: March 27, 2008, 08:36:41 pm by Diapositivo »
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Ray

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« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2008, 09:08:54 pm »

I have a few Minolta-fit lenses that have been sitting in my cupboard for about 10 years, just waiting for the A900 to arrive. They must be getting pretty lonely by now. They include the Tamron SP90/2.8, Sigma 24/2.8, Minolta 50/1.4, Minolta 35-70 zoom and Sigma 400/5.6 prime.

I guess I'm not the ideal customer that Sony has in mind   .
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macgyver

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« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2008, 10:38:51 am »

If Sony prices that sucker at 4K or less then canon is going to have some major pressure on the 1DsIII. Glad to hear it too.
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ErikKaffehr

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« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2008, 01:58:02 pm »

Hi,

You forgot about the Dynax 9...

My feeling is that the opportunity for Sony is to make a great "landscape photographers camera". Putting the "Zeiss" name on the lenses may help.

Best regards
Erik

Quote
In the seventies and eighties three big names of photography made what seemed an obvious entrance in the professional market, only to withdraw later on.

First Minolta. The XM (XK in some markets) was a top-everything camera and the lenses who got with it in the following years were certainly up to any Japanese competition if not better. But the XM (1974 if memory serves) was the first and last "professional" body.

Then Pentax. Again the lenses were absolutely on par with any Japanese competition and the LX was a compact, modern (TTL daylight and TTL flash), sealed (a first) and quality built professional camera. The first, and the last, by Pentax.

Around 1984 Olympus came out with the OM-3 and OM-4 which seemed an evident commitment to the higher segment, professional or semi-pro. Immediately after they got out of film reflex altogether.

I read somewhere the following explanation, which I deem quite right: camera makers do LOSE money on very high quality professional camera. That is true for Nikon, Canon, Leica etc.
They accept to produce those cameras at a loss, because the buyer will tipically buy several (and high quality) lenses, where they have higher margin (in percentage and in absolute value).

The trend of the sixties toward "proprietary" bayonet mount made this kind of marketing quite rationale.

So, you produce the XM (or the LX, or the OM-4) and it is great. But if only amateurs will buy it (people who would need 4 years to buy a 28, 50, 135, and maybe a flash, a bellow later on) you are not going to continue playing the game because there will be no profit. You might think the "flagship" will give "prestige" to all the line, but it is a costly marketing effort.

Entering the professional arena is "easy", but in the long run it makes economic sense only if you can convince the "real professionals" to switch to your system.

This is hard for two reasons. The first and obvious is that the proprietary bayonet mount tend to "lock" the professional user to his camera make of choice, because he will typically have a big investment in it.

The second is more subtle: a professional needs support. He needs to find assistance when he goes to an important sport event, he need to find somebody who will rent him a lens if he's got a problem (or a special need, or he want to try a new lens).

Retaining professionals means, to begin with, having a "structure" in place at every major photographic event to support professionals. That is costly.

I have spoken to a professional sport photographer last year. He choose Canon over Nikon only on the ground of the kind of support Canon Italy gives as compared to what Nital (Nikon in Italy) gives. Professionals don't look that much at technical features, they look at what happens if a lens fails in the midst of an event. Is there anybody who will try an immediate fix, or lend you a lens as a substitute? That is what matters. So in most countries the choice is only between Canon and Nikon (in the 135 market segment) and in some countries only one of the two is really viable.

And what if you go on a trip and somebody steals a lens or a body? Will you be able to find somebody to rent it to you?

So the problem with Sony today is the same it was with Minolta, Pentax and Olympus of yore. If they put a "structure" in place to support the professionals, if professionals adopt Sony, if rent-a-lens begin offering Sony gear, then you can be sure Sony is going to make ground in the professional market.

If at "photographic events" there is no Sony stand and assistance, and no Sony rental, than you know it is the same old story as ever, Sony will quietly go back to limiting themselves to the consumer market, which is less risky and gives more immediate rewards.

The coming Olympic games will be a good test to see if really Sony wants to be a player in the professional market.

If they are not there, I would not bet on the next generation of professional Sony cameras, and I would not invest in Sony equipment (regardless of the quality of Sony-Zeiss material) to avoid remaining locked in a system which remains limited in the main commercial segment in the future.

"Commitment" to the professional segment is demonstrated by putting in place said "structure". No structure, no party.

Cheers
Fabrizio
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=184819\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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douglasf13

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« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2008, 03:07:22 pm »

Yeah, the Minolta Dynax/Maxxum 9 was one of, if not THE, best 35mm pro film cameras of all time.





Quote
Hi,

You forgot about the Dynax 9...

My feeling is that the opportunity for Sony is to make a great "landscape photographers camera". Putting the "Zeiss" name on the lenses may help.

Best regards
Erik
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=185022\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
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BJL

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Sony 25mp A900 photos
« Reply #14 on: March 29, 2008, 12:36:10 pm »

I agree with Diapositivo's argument that entering the professional market could be hard for Sony due to support needs and such. However there is more chance for Sony (or Olympus or Pentax) to succeed in offering a system with more or less "professional" quality, used for some professional photography, but aimed to sell mainly to serious amateurs and lower level professionals. Sony has indicated that its "pro flagship" will not be aimed at the higher levels of pro gear (e.g. the 1Ds series), so might be aimed at roughly the same market as the 5D was, but with greatly enhanced appeal for subjects like landscapes through its far higher resolution.
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Fine_Art

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« Reply #15 on: March 29, 2008, 02:42:44 pm »

Quote
I agree with Diapositivo's argument that entering the professional market could be hard for Sony due to support needs and such. However there is more chance for Sony (or Olympus or Pentax) to succeed in offering a system with more or less "professional" quality, used for some professional photography, but aimed to sell mainly to serious amateurs and lower level professionals. Sony has indicated that its "pro flagship" will not be aimed at the higher levels of pro gear (e.g. the 1Ds series), so might be aimed at roughly the same market as the 5D was, but with greatly enhanced appeal for subjects like landscapes through its far higher resolution.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=185217\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sony is a major player in pro video camera equipment. I doubt networks and studios have time for poor repair service. Especially at the price of actors standing around. It wont be a stretch for a company making their kind of money to extend that to DSLR support.

I love Minolta glass. I wasn't happy Sony bought them based on their audio CD root kit fiasco. In fact i had animosity to the company. I thought they were screwing their customers. They have made good effort with the new DSLRs. The A700 is a good camera at a fair price for what you get. If the A900 is under $3000 to compete with the Canon5D/ 5DII it will win a lot of converts. Especially with G and Zeiss glass.

Look at their revenue and say they cant afford to setup pro SLR service if they want to.
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dilip

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« Reply #16 on: March 29, 2008, 03:12:56 pm »

Quote
Sony is a major player in pro video camera equipment. I doubt networks and studios have time for poor repair service. Especially at the price of actors standing around. It wont be a stretch for a company making their kind of money to extend that to DSLR support.

[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=185245\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Actually, the existence of the pro support network for video will probably not just serve as a template for the network for the still cameras, it will probably be the same network. They will offer photographers service from the same teams that support videographers.

This cuts their costs on offering support at the outset and for any organization looking at both still and video needs it gives Sony the ability to offer a single point of contact.

Having said that, I'd be surprised if they didnt start by aiming at the high end of the consumer market first. It's a market that is profitable and it shows people getting into the consumer camera space that there is an upgrade path down the road. The missing clear upgrade path is something that I have seen turn off new consumers despite the fact that there is very little chance that they will be following the upgrade path up to the semi pro bodies.

--dilip
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Mike W

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« Reply #17 on: March 29, 2008, 03:47:48 pm »

If they don't launch a couple of very good zeiss primes and pro-zooms with this body, they're gonna crash and burn. Do not pass go, wait four years to get back in the game.

Zeiss would be stupid not to build up their sony-line up most rikki tik, since there is almost no profit left for 'em in MF.
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BJL

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« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2008, 11:54:11 am »

Quote
... I'd be surprised if they didnt start by aiming at the high end of the consumer market first. It's a market that is profitable and it shows people getting into the consumer camera space that there is an upgrade path down the road. The missing clear upgrade path is something that I have seen turn off new consumers despite the fact that there is very little chance that they will be following the upgrade path up to the semi pro bodies.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=185246\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Indeed, if we look at what Sony has actually said and done, that could to be the main intention: to support advanced amateur/lower budget pro customers and reassure the mainstream customers that the system has room for upgrades. I rather suspect that the expensive "professional grade"  lenses and bodies in many systems serve in large part to reassure and impress customers for the far better selling and less expensive items that generate most profits. Especially for the "second tier" SLR systems of Olympus/Panasonic, Pentax/Samsung and Sony/Minolta, and doubly so when companies like Zeiss and Leica are enlisted with somewhat unclear contributions to the design and manufacture of the products bearing their names.
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Ken R

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« Reply #19 on: March 31, 2008, 09:05:00 am »

Sony is gonna have the same problem as Olympus has right now. very good lenses but priced way out of range of most people.
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