Z3100 - editing media profiles

[tho3hite]

I have seen several versions of HP's technical newsletters showing different print settings used by different paper presets.

I am curious if there is any known way to manage the printing parameters directly instead of the indirect method of trying to pick a paper preset that combines the set of features that you are looking for.

I thought it might be possible to edit HP's media profile (OMS) files. But the ones that I've been able to download from HP's byzantine website don't seem to be in a human readable format.

[rdonson]

Which attributes of the HP paper types do you feel the need to edit?  AFAIK there is a limited set of attributes:

- Gloss Enhancer (Y/N)
- Borderless (Y/N)
- Carriage Height (H/L)
- Printing Black (P/M/Q)
- Ink Limit
- Print Mode  (RR, PR, #passes, bidirectional)
- Cutter (Y/N)

Some of these can be altered through the driver or other means.

[tho3hite]

Which attributes of the HP paper types do you feel the need to edit?  AFAIK there is a limited set of attributes:

- Gloss Enhancer (Y/N)
- Borderless (Y/N)
- Carriage Height (H/L)
- Printing Black (P/M/Q)
- Ink Limit
- Print Mode  (RR, PR, #passes, bidirectional)
- Cutter (Y/N)

Some of these can be altered through the driver or other means.
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I would like to be able to specify ink limit and quad-tone black with a specified number of passes without having to try to find a paper preset with the settings I want. I expect that by increasing the number of passes it might be possible to lay down more ink in dark shadow areas and get better d-max without blocking up shadow detail.

I want to pick and choose from those settings above a la carte without having to take the whole package that comes with a certain preset. The Matte paper I'm using could probably benifit from quad-black printing but can't handle the ink limits that the presets with quad-black put down. I know I can reduce the ink setting in the paper presets but I would like to try increasing the number of passes to see how that affects the papers ability to hold ink.

[Geoff Wittig]

I would like to be able to specify ink limit and quad-tone black with a specified number of passes without having to try to find a paper preset with the settings I want. I expect that by increasing the number of passes it might be possible to lay down more ink in dark shadow areas and get better d-max without blocking up shadow detail.

I want to pick and choose from those settings above a la carte without having to take the whole package that comes with a certain preset. The Matte paper I'm using could probably benifit from quad-black printing but can't handle the ink limits that the presets with quad-black put down. I know I can reduce the ink setting in the paper presets but I would like to try increasing the number of passes to see how that affects the papers ability to hold ink.
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I doubt that it's worth the effort. The Z3100 has the best D-max available on matte paper as is, and laying down more pigment on top of pigment won't make it any blacker. If you need something darker, it's time to reach for a satin or gloss paper.
Back when I was using an Epson 7600 I tried running paper through twice with a "skeletal black" layer to get a better D-max on rag paper. I was very unimpressed with the scarcely visible difference, particularly considering what a total PITA it was getting accurate registration.

[rdonson]

The Matte paper I'm using could probably benifit from quad-black printing but can't handle the ink limits that the presets with quad-black put down. I know I can reduce the ink setting in the paper presets but I would like to try increasing the number of passes to see how that affects the papers ability to hold ink.
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I'm not arguing your desire to create your own paper types but you what you've outlined as a need isn't that hard to accomplish with the current set of tools.

You can increase the # of passes in the print driver.



Have you checked out this  [a href=\"http://z3100users.wikispaces.com/space/showimage/Z2100_and_Z3100_Working_with_other_commercially-available_paper_6.0.0.8.pdf]Tech Newsletter[/url]?

For Quad blacks you only need to choose between two paper types:
- Fine Art Paper >250 gsm
- Super Heavyweight Coated

[hubicka]

I've played a bit with Innova Fibaprint Gloss paper (not the Ultragloss one that was reportedly developed to work well with HP inks).  It is very nice paper and I like the texture and the warm white variant for printing historical photographs. For some reason it is being imported to Czech Republic with a lot more resonable prices than some other papers otherwise lot cheaper in US. Otherwise I didn't find any good source of Baryte papers here except for Mediaware Baryta, but it is not that nice and shows extreme gloss differential in blacks in my tests.

All Innova gloss papers shows the pizza wheel marks in shadows. I hope that with the long promised fix it will hopefully get the paper through printer undamaged.  (I am waiting for repair for 3 weeks now).

However the paper also shows some gloss differential. By observing calibration charts, it seem that light gray and gray inks, when used a lot, seems to dry on the surface of paper while others seems absorbed by surface. Amount of absortion dependent on the texture of paper so it results in rather ugly artifacts (that does not show on ultrasmooth variant that prominently because of lack of the texture). Black ink seems fine in this repsect: so with setting for "Fine art pearl less ink" one gets nice results almost everywhere except for "almost blacks" where a lot of gray ink is used. Also limiting the ing reduce DMAX but it is still more than enough for historical prints.

However I believe that it would be nice to limit use of gray ink more than use of light gray ink and leave use of black and gloss enhancer in same levels as "fine art pearl" or "fine art pearl more ink" does. That in theory might be doable by editing the presets...

I also wonder if spraying the paper has chance to hide this. The artifacts are almost unnoticeable under glass in the exhibition room, as well as the wheel marks, but still if printing on such a expensive paper one would like to not get any problems.

Honza http://sechtl-vosecek.ucw.cz

[Ernst Dinkla]

However I believe that it would be nice to limit use of gray ink more than use of light gray ink and leave use of black and gloss enhancer in same levels as "fine art pearl" or "fine art pearl more ink" does. That in theory might be doable by editing the presets.

Honza http://sechtl-vosecek.ucw.cz
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You could check whether one of the other media presets fits the paper better. In the Printer Utility software it is then possible to create a custom media preset of that more suitable media preset where you can change the passes, drying time and reduce the overall inklimit too to make it fit even better.

Even on the RIP that I have I can not change the gray ink partitioning. Like in the Z3100 driver I can set the ink limit lower or higher and I can change the black generation in an N-channel profile but the partitioning of the (K)Kkk inks stays in a black box.

For B&W I would have liked a bit more editing possible (QTR style) but for color with the complexities of the N-channel separations I think it is a Pandora's box you will open. I created a custom media preset called Photorag B&W where I reduced the quad FA>250 gr media preset inklimit a bit as I measured that the Dmax was going down a bit at the last 100% black patch of a 51 step target.


Ernst Dinkla

Try: [a href=\"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/[/url]

[hubicka]

Ernst,
thank you for suggestions!

You could check whether one of the other media presets fits the paper better. In the Printer Utility software it is then possible to create a custom media preset of that more suitable media preset where you can change the passes, drying time and reduce the overall inklimit too to make it fit even better.

I am running out of my samples (the paper definitely needs profiling otherwise the dithering pattern is very visible on every new preset so changing presets is bit wasteful). However I experimented with HP Satin Professional setting first and the Fine art Pearl.  I would say that Fine Art Pearl more ink is delivering pretty much same results as HP Satin pro setting (the gammut differs however, but not in B&W I care about) and the the setting Fine Art Pearl with default Ink still has comparable DMAX and less bronzing. At leat bronzing shifts from mid grays to dark grays only.

For B&W the Photoshop preview of HP Satin Pro looks same (modulo warmer whitepoint of Innova) as Innova in HP Satin Pro setting or Fine Art Pearl or Fine Art Pearl more ink. When printed, I think real HP Satin Pro paper black might be tiny bit darker, but it might be my personal feeling comparing glossy to satin surface. Fine Art Pearl less ink shows significantly less gammut in Photoshop Preview. When printed however it still looks great.

Any educated guess what other preset might work better would be great. Innova itself is using "Fine Art Pearl" at least for their published z2100 profiles.  I am quite surprised they do not publish z3100 profiles when they are quite actively promoting their Ultrasmooth paper and z3100 as "perfect match" and showing it regularly on trade shows. I am also not sure if it is wortwhile to try to upload the z2100 profiles into z3100 printer.

Honza

[Edhopkins]

I have the APS and it has a tab labeled "Optimize" and it allows you to directly tweak the profile itself. I thought this tread might mention this.

I have not used this. Is anyone out there using the APS (GP--Graphics Package) to edit their profiles?

 It seems to offer a wider--but maybe only different--set of features of the paper to modify.


I also know that if you submit a job from the Web interface and select the option to save it as a "stored job" that you can resubmit the stored job and modify seemingly all the printing settings.  I have not tried this either.  

Ed Hopkins (HP Z3100ps GP)

[rdonson]

Hello Ed,

Yes, I do edit the occasional profile.  I was a little afraid to at first but with some encouragement from Neal Snape I gave it a shot.  I use it to get the closest monitor to print comparison on matte papers.  I haven't tweaked any satin paper profiles yet.

[Ernst Dinkla]

I have the APS and it has a tab labeled "Optimize" and it allows you to directly tweak the profile itself. I thought this tread might mention this.

Ed Hopkins (HP Z3100ps GP)
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Profile editing can do some things but not influence the partitioning of the gray inks used. That partitioning could help to solve gloss differential by shifting the ink laid down from one gray ink to the other gray ink (still complex in my opinion). With profile editing you can lay down less or more ink and the image will become lighter or darker, unusable method to solve gloss differential.

I have to make prints that need a higher foot (sky, snow) above the paper white to get more equal with a book with the same images published already. In that case an edited profile that shifts the whites a bit is the easier method. Adapting the softproof side of a profile so the softproof matches the print better on a CM monitor is another thing a profile editor can do for you.

More passes shouldn't lay down more ink in theory. The same droplet quantity is laid down but less per stroke so with a better drying time in between and possibly less dotgain as a result. It could be that another dot placing is used but that's all you can expect of more passes. While it could help to reduce banding issue on printers (like a higher dpi resolution can help too) I have not seen any need for it with the Z3100. The variation in passes present in the total media presets range will have to do with the speed of ink absorption possible per paper coating and the ink load set in the media preset.


Ernst Dinkla

try: [a href=\"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/[/url]