Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6   Go Down

Author Topic: Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II  (Read 60655 times)

jonstewart

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 435
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #40 on: June 08, 2008, 06:30:52 am »

Quote
No they aren't.  It isn't their forum.    

Didn't really care about responding to your post. Just wanted to try out the faces. I've never used them before. Don't think I will again. They make me feel like I'm back in 6th grade.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200352\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Maybe it's important once in a while to fell like we're in 6th grade.    

The smiley in my original post was intended to indicate some humour. Not everything on this board is a life or death issue, and I certainly didn't mean to give offence to Nick T on the matter!

Cheers
Logged
Jon Stewart
 If only life were so simple.

dwdallam

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2044
    • http://www.dwdallam.com
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #41 on: June 08, 2008, 07:25:29 am »

Quote
Well, dwdallam.... you might not call her Aboriginal, but thankfully that doesn't mean she can't identify
herself as one. Do you know who her parents are?
I guess it shows that studying a subject and actually living and experiencing a subject
are 2 very different things.
A
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200400\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

The fact that I live as an aboriginal does not mean that I understand objectively what it is to be an aboriginal. In order to understand what I am, I have to study myself. That's why we study things, even if we are the object of our own study--and we are. Studying and experiencing are not mutually exclusive.

This doesn't have anything to do with the woman.

I think it's important to remember what "aboriginal" means because there are very important issues that may be lost with the glossing over of what "original people" really means.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2008, 07:35:41 am by dwdallam »
Logged

josayeruk

  • Guest
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #42 on: June 08, 2008, 07:36:51 am »

Quote
Well, dwdallam.... you might not call her Aboriginal, but thankfully that doesn't mean she can't identify
herself as one. Do you know who her parents are?
I guess it shows that studying a subject and actually living and experiencing a subject
are 2 very different things.
A
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200400\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Very well said.

Jo S.x
Logged

josayeruk

  • Guest
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #43 on: June 08, 2008, 07:41:09 am »

Quote
Why? It's absolutely wretched.  Really difficult to use and looks like in was designed in 1994 and never updated subsequently.
Phocus is a huge improvement [if you have a Mac, tough if you use PCs], but is still rather clumsy and seriously lacking when you compare in to Bridge/ACR and Lightroom. Workflow seems a bit sad next to Adobe's stuff and considering the price of the cameras, you'd expect, top notch software to go with it, which is sadly not the case. Phocus seems somewhat unfinished to my mind. Roll on v2, but probably not this decade. 

Nice shots BTW
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200356\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Well actually FlexColor has had numerous updates and additions.

As I said, it is just as powerful in workflow as many others - you just need to learn it.

Agreed Phocus was needed in terms of a fresh new interface and it certainly delivers on that front.  The Live Video with electronic focus shows what's possible and what more will come in the future.

Jo S.x
Logged

jjj

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4728
    • http://www.futtfuttfuttphotography.com
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #44 on: June 08, 2008, 09:45:26 am »

Quote
Well actually FlexColor has had numerous updates and additions.
And it still has the hideous look and clunky feel of an early 90s piece of software. Yuck.  

Quote
As I said, it is just as powerful in workflow as many others - you just need to learn it.
Even if you know how to use a piece of crap well, it is still a piece of crap.  
I'm also intrigued as to what programmes it's workflow it's as 'powerful' as.  

Quote
Agreed Phocus was needed in terms of a fresh new interface and it certainly delivers on that front.  The Live Video with electronic focus shows what's possible and what more will come in the future.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200410\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Seeing as Phocus came along a long time after Aperture and Lightroom, it's interesting as to how much better the older software is, especially LR. IF you want to make the best cameras in the world, second class software [which the camera depends on], dilutes the brand somewhat.
Logged
Tradition is the Backbone of the Spinele

James R Russell

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 992
    • http://www.russellrutherford.com/
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #45 on: June 08, 2008, 09:46:32 am »

Quote
No they aren't.  It isn't their forum.    

Didn't really care about responding to your post. Just wanted to try out the faces. I've never used them before. Don't think I will again. They make me feel like I'm back in 6th grade.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200352\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


So Tech, does hasselblad have a forum? . . . is it open to the public? and if it's not their forum then their name is on it so I assume they have some say in how what is presented, at least I would if my name brand was on the masthead.

It doesn't matter to me, other than I find it strange how Hasselblad markets their product and through the years they have sent out a mixed message over close open platforms and now even closed or open information.

You mentioned earlier that the other back makers were getting a free ride from the Hasselblad camera but I understand that one back maker was instrumental is writing a lot of the firmware information that went into the h-1 and remember, the H series was originally sold and advertised as an open system which I believe went a long way into making the camera popular.

You can't blame some photographer's for feeling duped because if you bought, lets say a Leaf back and an H-1 waiting for the 28mm to come available, it probably was somewhat of a shock to find it it only is offered with a hasselblad back.

Personally I have no stake in any of this, but the moment Blad and Imacon came together you could just tell this was coming and even if the H-1-F or whatever it's called (BTW, what does F stand for  ?, it's still a step back for a 3rd party back user from the original h1-2.

If people don't like Blad, well they do it to themselves.

JR
Logged

elitegroup

  • Guest
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #46 on: June 08, 2008, 12:04:58 pm »

Quote
You are kidding right? I mean about the "aboriginal" part?

The word aboriginal, appearing in English since at least the 17th century and meaning "first or earliest known, indigenous," (Latin Aborigines, from ab: from, and origo: origin, beginning),[9] has been used in Australia to describe its Indigenous peoples as early as 1789.--wikipedia.

That model, while pretty, looks like a European, and if not that, she has lots of European in her. I would not call her aboriginal. Unless I'm forgetting my history and anthropology classes on Australian Aboriginal peoples, that's quite and insult.

Very nice work though. Also, there is a dedicated MF thread you may want to post these in. But those MF guys are snottier than us lowly "full frame" dudes. They drink "wine" and eat "cheese" and we drink "beer" and eat "chips." 

Anyway, welcome.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks Doug for sharing your perception.

There is a lot of history associated with the word aboriginal here in Australia. The word in it self is just a definition as you described for 'first or earliest known'.

You mentioned that the association of the word aboriginal is an insult, this saddens me  

To understand where this negative connotation was derived we must look back into historic colonial policies of this great wide land. At Edith Cowan University in 2003 I enrolled in the Photomedia Major where I studied a unit on the mechanics and effects of Colonialism. One of the major points for me was the formula the colonials used to inhabit a new continent. First the native peoples must be conquered systematically through a campaign of somatic warfare, the most effective form of  suppression was to take away their culture, language, traditions and sense of identity. A vanquished people are easier to manipulate, allowing free access to seize the land, its wealth and resources etc.
 
Unfortunately a lost, suppressed and broken people are susceptible victims of the lower socio economic class structure and face the debilitating effects of low self esteem and loss of self worth etc.

As an indigenous native of Aotearoa (the land of the long white cloud or New Zealand) I have an understanding of the process as my own people seek to restore their language, culture, values and more importantly their sense of self identity.

The negative association of the word aboriginal is a reflection of old colonial policies e.g. disempowering, marginalizing, silencing, subordinating, less than and so on.

With the prime ministers apology to the indigenous nation, the first great step in the healing process of the collective consciousness of the care takers of this great land I hope that finally the association of this word will expound a new meaning of pride and self worth.

As an artist/photographer I stand witness to a time of change in this country, there is opportunity to contribute to this movement through ones talents/abilities. I hope to shoot a Dreamtime Fashion editorial out in the The kimberlies in Western Australia infusing the ancient culture & stories of the indigenous peoples embodied in young Emily Cattermole's unique European/Australian and Aboriginal heritage. All I need now is the funding  

I honor Emily's heritage and wish her well on her personal and rising Fashion career  

A short youtube clip of Prime Minister Kevin Rudd's apology to the indigenous nation [a href=\"http://youtube.com/watch?v=uERSO_9M75k&feature=related]http://youtube.com/watch?v=uERSO_9M75k&feature=related[/url]
« Last Edit: June 08, 2008, 01:34:07 pm by elitegroup »
Logged

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #47 on: June 08, 2008, 05:58:04 pm »

Quote
So Tech, does hasselblad have a forum? . . . is it open to the public? and if it's not their forum then their name is on it so I assume they have some say in how what is presented, at least I would if my name brand was on the masthead.

It doesn't matter to me, other than I find it strange how Hasselblad markets their product and through the years they have sent out a mixed message over close open platforms and now even closed or open information.

You mentioned earlier that the other back makers were getting a free ride from the Hasselblad camera but I understand that one back maker was instrumental is writing a lot of the firmware information that went into the h-1 and remember, the H series was originally sold and advertised as an open system which I believe went a long way into making the camera popular.

You can't blame some photographer's for feeling duped because if you bought, lets say a Leaf back and an H-1 waiting for the 28mm to come available, it probably was somewhat of a shock to find it it only is offered with a hasselblad back.

Personally I have no stake in any of this, but the moment Blad and Imacon came together you could just tell this was coming and even if the H-1-F or whatever it's called (BTW, what does F stand for  ?, it's still a step back for a 3rd party back user from the original h1-2.

If people don't like Blad, well they do it to themselves.

JR
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200420\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
So Tech, does hasselblad have a forum? No. if it's not their forum then their name is on it so I assume they have some say in how what is presented No. They don't. It is a user group effort. But you can make all the assumptions you like. If you make enough assumptions, you'll eventually hit on one where you assume correctly. This isn't one of them.

It doesn't matter to me Really? I find it strange how Hasselblad markets their product and through the years they have sent out a mixed message over close open platforms The marketing (advertising, brochures, events to promote current products) seems pretty conventional. Since you weren't specific, I'm forced to assume (I hate to assume, so please correct me if I'm wrong) that what you find strange are the choices they've made regarding what products to sell and which to discontinue. Hasselblad could have chosen to continue to shoot themselves in the foot financially by making money losing products to support other companies profitable products or they could have done what Kyocera did with Contax and simply withdraw from the medium-format camera market completely. They chose a path that made long-term business sense and continued to make a camera system to strengthen and support products on which they could make a profit and survive. The benefit of continuing to produce a camera system to Hasselblad back owners is that the integrated system has provided a wider range of features (auto lens corrections, GPS, more camera control abilities from the capture software, enhanced focusing accuracy, integrated power from body to back, ability to control back functions and menu from camera controls, a revolutionary optical design in the 28mm that incorporates auto digital lens correction into the optical design). The benefit to 3rd party back owners of their decision not to follow Contax, Bronica and Fuji to the graveyard of completely dead medium-format SLR systems is the continued availability of new lenses and accessories for their discontinued camera models. The H1 and H2 were offered until they became too much of a drain on finances and resources and were discontinued. That's how product life cycles tend to work. they have sent out a mixed message over... closed or open information I've never seen any message of any kind from Hasselblad regarding internet message board forums. They have no involvement in any forum and don't appear to have any past or current interest in them. What mixed message is it that you're referring to?

I understand that one back maker was instrumental is writing a lot of the firmware information that went into the h-1 A myth. Teleca Systems in Sweden supplied the electronics, camera software and communications interface for the H1. In the early stages of development Hasselblad invited Kodak, Phase One and other digital back makers to provide input as to what they would like to see in the way of interface design, contracted with Teleca to design and implement the interface and protocols and back makers wrote firmware for their own products that allowed interfacing with Hasselblad/Teleca's design. That individuals and companies develop an exaggerated sense of their own self-importance and contributions to a project is pretty common. Fish always seem to grow bigger the more time that passes after they're caught and consumed. and remember, the H series was originally sold and advertised as an open system which I believe went a long way into making the camera popular I remember the H1 system attracting attention and buyers due to having the most modern design available in medium-format with noticeable improvement in autofocus, electronics and integration. The new leaf shutter system designed and made by Hasselblad also helped draw buyers that didn't want focal plane shutter Contax and Mamiya 645 cameras. The quality and variety of the lenses including the 35mm, zoom and after a long wait the 120mm macro with autofocus from infinity to 1:1 were major considerations in buyer decisions. I don't recall that it was any more "open" than other cameras that it competed with at the time, so I'm not sure how that contributed to whatever popularity it enjoyed. Were other brands and models less "open" making them less attractive and less popular?

You can't blame some photographer's for feeling duped because if you bought, lets say a Leaf back and an H-1 waiting for the 28mm to come available Who buys a camera based on speculation of a future lens that doesn't exist from any maker, has never been attempted by any maker because it is extraordinarily complex, difficult and expensive to design and make (especially for a very limited market) and wasn't leaked or even hinted at by the maker prior to debut? I can certainly recall people wishing that someone would make a lens that wide for a medium-format SLR, but I don't recall any suggestion by Hasselblad they were going to do so prior to the announcement at Photokina. I congratulate Mamiya and Hasselblad for the effort required to create such a difficult focal length lens for a medium-format SLR. Mamiya chose a traditional optical design approach and though the lens is bigger, heavier, slower, lacks a filter mount, and is more expensive compared to Hasselblad's design--they did pull it off, giving competition to Hasselblad and that's a good thing. The Hasselblad design was unconventional, being the first consumer lens designed with some optical aberrations being corrected through automatic digital operations in image processing, rather than by the centuries-old tradition of using optical methods. Such a radical departure was bound to create discussion, but the discussion has revolved around what capture devices the lens is compatible with, rather than the unique new path in lens design that has now been opened. As for anyone feeling "duped", making a purchase based on something that doesn't exist, but perhaps-maybe-could be available in the future, could leave one being "duped" by their own speculations. Did you buy your Contax with the speculation that they would continue making camera bodies, and lenses and accessories and maybe someday a 28mm lens? If so, do you feel duped? I don't know, maybe you purchased after it became a dead camera system. That would be one sure way not to be disappointed by end-of-life product decisions and speculation of future products.

the moment Blad and Imacon came together you could just tell this was coming Actually, if you were following what was happening in the medium-format camera business (it is a real business, by the way, requiring tough financial decisions) you could see what was coming well before Hasselblad and Imacon merged. With manufacturers going belly-up and Hasselblad, Mamiya and Rollei facing severe financial losses--potential bankruptcy, sale, or reorganization--due to severe decline in demand and market for all medium-format cameras resulting in continual and growing debt loads. Either medium-format cameras would cease to exist or be partnered with revenue streams from profitable partners or products. Such is life in the world of business investment. Investors invest to get a return and will only tolerate losing money for a limited (though variable) period of time. BTW, what does F stand for  ? Your smile is nice, but you may have jaundice... or perhaps just a jaundiced view. it's still a step back for a 3rd party back user from the original h1-2 Yes. It is. And a step forward for Hasselblad back users.

If people don't like Blad, well they do it to themselves. That could be read as people cause themselves not to like Hasselblad--but I don't think that's what you meant to imply. Of course there are people in the world that are so focused on their own desires that they are unable to see beyond them and though these folks are often rather vocal when their desires are not met, they are not the majority. However, some very reasonable people are upset with Hasselblad because they don't understand why they would discontinue products they own or may wish to buy--or because there is a product they want to buy which is not compatible. I understand this and Hasselblad would be wiser, in my opinion, if they simply had a more straightforward dialogue with customers. I would have preferred to have them tell the simple truth, that medium-format cameras are money losers and they can't afford to keep making them to support revenue streams for other companies. But it seems that few manufacturers are that open or specific about what is profitable and what's not in their product offerings--Hasselblad is no exception, but I wish they were. It would save me a great deal of time and typing. Anyway, as you see... I've given my last few words on this post to lend weight to whatever low opinions you have formed of Hasselblad. I think they are a bright group of people that love photography and try hard to produce great products. Often they succeed in their many and varied efforts and sometimes fall short--as do I.

Best wishes to you and yours.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2008, 06:39:40 pm by TechTalk »
Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

eronald

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6642
    • My gallery on Instagram
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #48 on: June 08, 2008, 06:21:55 pm »

Anecdote:
 At the photokina press conference, the H CEO speaks about the perceived value of the H product. Later, sipping champagne with a stylish photographer and a model on the H booth; I believe both have just given a "performance" of  what a shoot looks like. We discuss the  H and one issue at the time being their high pricing compared to 35mm systems. And now the smart blond model pipes up: In every area there needs to be an elite product . Somehow  I think she perfectly got it.

Fashion is best understood by the fashionistas, no ?



Edmund
Logged
If you appreciate my blog posts help me by following on https://instagram.com/edmundronald

Sean H

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 332
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #49 on: June 08, 2008, 06:43:11 pm »

David,

that was thoughtful and well said. Thanks for doing that.

BTW, your photos on the boats were stunning.


Sean
Logged

josayeruk

  • Guest
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #50 on: June 08, 2008, 06:52:04 pm »

Quote
So Tech, does hasselblad have a forum? No. if it's not their forum then their name is on it so I assume they have some say in how what is presented No. They don't. It is a user group effort. But you can make all the assumptions you like. If you make enough assumptions, you'll eventually hit on one where you assume correctly. This isn't one of them.

Best wishes to you and yours.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200473\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Bravo.

Jo S.x
« Last Edit: June 08, 2008, 06:53:15 pm by josayeruk »
Logged

SeanFS

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 114
    • http://www.seanshadbolt.co.nz
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #51 on: June 08, 2008, 06:57:53 pm »

Quote
Why? It's absolutely wretched.  Really difficult to use and looks like in was designed in 1994 and never updated subsequently.
Phocus is a huge improvement [if you have a Mac, tough if you use PCs], but is still rather clumsy and seriously lacking when you compare in to Bridge/ACR and Lightroom. Workflow seems a bit sad next to Adobe's stuff and considering the price of the cameras, you'd expect, top notch software to go with it, which is sadly not the case. Phocus seems somewhat unfinished to my mind. Roll on v2, but probably not this decade. 

Nice shots BTW
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200356\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I have used flexcolour for a couple of years now and it is very powerful. it took a while to get used to it but I find it far easier to use than capture one( which I use all the time with Canon cameras) - and, and far more stable, in fact , rock solid( capture one 4 has unexpectedly quit should be changed to predictably quit!) with a real depth to colour and file quality. It has also been constantly upgraded to the point it produces  state of the art images out of my four year old Imacon back.
Phocus only runs on Leopard, which I haven't upgraded to yet for various reasons so I haven't had a  chance to really compare, but it looks like it has addressed all the handling quirks Flexcolour is supposed to have - I think its all the floating palates that annoy most people , I always seem to have the wrong ones up!
Logged

elitegroup

  • Guest
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #52 on: June 08, 2008, 08:24:50 pm »

Quote
David,

that was thoughtful and well said. Thanks for doing that.

BTW, your photos on the boats were stunning.
Sean
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200484\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

You are very welcome and Thank you  
Logged

jjj

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4728
    • http://www.futtfuttfuttphotography.com
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #53 on: June 08, 2008, 08:30:03 pm »

Quote
I have used flexcolour for a couple of years now and it is very powerful. it took a while to get used to it but I find it far easier to use than capture one( which I use all the time with Canon cameras) - and, and far more stable, in fact , rock solid( capture one 4 has unexpectedly quit should be changed to predictably quit!) with a real depth to colour and file quality. It has also been constantly upgraded to the point it produces  state of the art images out of my four year old Imacon back.
Phocus only runs on Leopard, which I haven't upgraded to yet for various reasons so I haven't had a  chance to really compare, but it looks like it has addressed all the handling quirks Flexcolour is supposed to have - I think its all the floating palates that annoy most people , I always seem to have the wrong ones up!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200489\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Hmmm Capture1 another bit of clunky software by another image back company who cannot even make a Mac and a PC pro version with the same features.  

And even though you've used Flexcolur for several years Sean, you say you still constantly make errors. As I said before old fashioned and a badly designed interface, as if it wasn't, you wouldn't keeep making such basic mistakes.
Phocus is better, but things like no scrolling on the adjustments tab is simply amateurish.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2008, 08:31:04 pm by jjj »
Logged
Tradition is the Backbone of the Spinele

SeanFS

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 114
    • http://www.seanshadbolt.co.nz
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #54 on: June 08, 2008, 11:57:26 pm »

Quote
Hmmm Capture1 another bit of clunky software by another image back company who cannot even make a Mac and a PC pro version with the same features.   

And even though you've used Flexcolur for several years Sean, you say you still constantly make errors. As I said before old fashioned and a badly designed interface, as if it wasn't, you wouldn't keeep making such basic mistakes.
Phocus is better, but things like no scrolling on the adjustments tab is simply amateurish.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200499\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yes , true . I don't consider myself an real whiz at using any of the Raw conversion software I use as it keeps changing - at least Flexcolour has been consistent. ACR really is probably the best handling wise, but I don't use it unless really pushed for time as I don't like the way it clips subtle shades in highlight areas( on my Canon  1ds2 + 3 files anyway ).

Anyway , Getting back on track. Just want to chuck in my 2c of praise ( make that $100! )for David's  stunning pictures. They are  really impressive and it isn't just the camera.
I reckon the reason he had to leave NZ to go to Aus and produce work like that is no one much has the imagination to commission work like that here any more - too busy padding those head office expense accounts.
Logged

SeanFS

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 114
    • http://www.seanshadbolt.co.nz
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #55 on: June 08, 2008, 11:59:37 pm »

Quote
Hmmm Capture1 another bit of clunky software by another image back company who cannot even make a Mac and a PC pro version with the same features.   

And even though you've used Flexcolur for several years Sean, you say you still constantly make errors. As I said before old fashioned and a badly designed interface, as if it wasn't, you wouldn't keeep making such basic mistakes.
Phocus is better, but things like no scrolling on the adjustments tab is simply amateurish.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200499\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yes , true . I don't consider myself an real whiz at using any of the Raw conversion software I use though as it keeps changing - at least Flexcolour has been consistent. ACR really is probably the best handling wise, but I don't use it unless really pushed for time as I don't like the way it clips subtle shades in highlight areas( on my Canon  1ds2 + 3 files anyway ).Not to mention it doesn't work with Hasselblad files anyway.

Anyway , Getting back on track. Just want to chuck in my 2c of praise ( make that $100! )for David's  stunning pictures. They are  really impressive and it isn't just the camera.
I reckon the reason he had to leave NZ to go to Aus and produce work like that is no one much has the imagination to commission work like that here any more - too busy padding those head office expense accounts.
Logged

James R Russell

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 992
    • http://www.russellrutherford.com/
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #56 on: June 09, 2008, 12:50:12 am »

Tech,

Well, your obviously more in the know than I am and that's good, because the small amount of information I receive is from manufacturers, reps or dealers, usually when I'm buying something.

What I've been told are from people I know and I believe to be the truthful, but I'll admit it's second or third hand information.

I'm not implying your information is not valid, or not correct, in fact I appreciate your honest contribution,  though I would be interested to know who techtalk is and who we are speaking with.

Everybody has a reason to be on this forum.  Me, because I find some of it interesting, sometimes informative, or usually because it just gives me a 5 minute break from my varied duties.

I do see a turn in this  medium format section where it has become less about photography and more about the makers and sellers specific interests and I think that lessens photographer's contributions.

Some of this section is interesting, but there is more and more instances where it's occupied by  sales messages (not to imply your post was about sales because I don't believe it is).

I as well as anyone understand business and Hasselblad or any company can run theirs the way they see fit.

Whether anyone buys a blad or any camera makes no contribution to my financial or artistic well being.

Still I do expect any day to open this section and find it's it's only occupied by dealers, reps, techs, and manufacturer point people.  

JR

P.S.  I apologize for having a hand in taking the direction away from David's nice photography.
that's really where it should have stayed.





Quote
So Tech, does hasselblad have a forum? No. if it's not their forum then their name is on it so I assume they have some say in how what is presented No. They don't. It is a user group effort. But you can make all the assumptions you like. If you make enough assumptions, you'll eventually hit on one where you assume correctly. This isn't one of them.

It doesn't matter to me Really? I find it strange how Hasselblad markets their product and through the years they have sent out a mixed message over close open platforms The marketing (advertising, brochures, events to promote current products) seems pretty conventional. Since you weren't specific, I'm forced to assume (I hate to assume, so please correct me if I'm wrong) that what you find strange are the choices they've made regarding what products to sell and which to discontinue. Hasselblad could have chosen to continue to shoot themselves in the foot financially by making money losing products to support other companies profitable products or they could have done what Kyocera did with Contax and simply withdraw from the medium-format camera market completely. They chose a path that made long-term business sense and continued to make a camera system to strengthen and support products on which they could make a profit and survive. The benefit of continuing to produce a camera system to Hasselblad back owners is that the integrated system has provided a wider range of features (auto lens corrections, GPS, more camera control abilities from the capture software, enhanced focusing accuracy, integrated power from body to back, ability to control back functions and menu from camera controls, a revolutionary optical design in the 28mm that incorporates auto digital lens correction into the optical design). The benefit to 3rd party back owners of their decision not to follow Contax, Bronica and Fuji to the graveyard of completely dead medium-format SLR systems is the continued availability of new lenses and accessories for their discontinued camera models. The H1 and H2 were offered until they became too much of a drain on finances and resources and were discontinued. That's how product life cycles tend to work. they have sent out a mixed message over... closed or open information I've never seen any message of any kind from Hasselblad regarding internet message board forums. They have no involvement in any forum and don't appear to have any past or current interest in them. What mixed message is it that you're referring to?

I understand that one back maker was instrumental is writing a lot of the firmware information that went into the h-1 A myth. Teleca Systems in Sweden supplied the electronics, camera software and communications interface for the H1. In the early stages of development Hasselblad invited Kodak, Phase One and other digital back makers to provide input as to what they would like to see in the way of interface design, contracted with Teleca to design and implement the interface and protocols and back makers wrote firmware for their own products that allowed interfacing with Hasselblad/Teleca's design. That individuals and companies develop an exaggerated sense of their own self-importance and contributions to a project is pretty common. Fish always seem to grow bigger the more time that passes after they're caught and consumed. and remember, the H series was originally sold and advertised as an open system which I believe went a long way into making the camera popular I remember the H1 system attracting attention and buyers due to having the most modern design available in medium-format with noticeable improvement in autofocus, electronics and integration. The new leaf shutter system designed and made by Hasselblad also helped draw buyers that didn't want focal plane shutter Contax and Mamiya 645 cameras. The quality and variety of the lenses including the 35mm, zoom and after a long wait the 120mm macro with autofocus from infinity to 1:1 were major considerations in buyer decisions. I don't recall that it was any more "open" than other cameras that it competed with at the time, so I'm not sure how that contributed to whatever popularity it enjoyed. Were other brands and models less "open" making them less attractive and less popular?

You can't blame some photographer's for feeling duped because if you bought, lets say a Leaf back and an H-1 waiting for the 28mm to come available Who buys a camera based on speculation of a future lens that doesn't exist from any maker, has never been attempted by any maker because it is extraordinarily complex, difficult and expensive to design and make (especially for a very limited market) and wasn't leaked or even hinted at by the maker prior to debut? I can certainly recall people wishing that someone would make a lens that wide for a medium-format SLR, but I don't recall any suggestion by Hasselblad they were going to do so prior to the announcement at Photokina. I congratulate Mamiya and Hasselblad for the effort required to create such a difficult focal length lens for a medium-format SLR. Mamiya chose a traditional optical design approach and though the lens is bigger, heavier, slower, lacks a filter mount, and is more expensive compared to Hasselblad's design--they did pull it off, giving competition to Hasselblad and that's a good thing. The Hasselblad design was unconventional, being the first consumer lens designed with some optical aberrations being corrected through automatic digital operations in image processing, rather than by the centuries-old tradition of using optical methods. Such a radical departure was bound to create discussion, but the discussion has revolved around what capture devices the lens is compatible with, rather than the unique new path in lens design that has now been opened. As for anyone feeling "duped", making a purchase based on something that doesn't exist, but perhaps-maybe-could be available in the future, could leave one being "duped" by their own speculations. Did you buy your Contax with the speculation that they would continue making camera bodies, and lenses and accessories and maybe someday a 28mm lens? If so, do you feel duped? I don't know, maybe you purchased after it became a dead camera system. That would be one sure way not to be disappointed by end-of-life product decisions and speculation of future products.

the moment Blad and Imacon came together you could just tell this was coming Actually, if you were following what was happening in the medium-format camera business (it is a real business, by the way, requiring tough financial decisions) you could see what was coming well before Hasselblad and Imacon merged. With manufacturers going belly-up and Hasselblad, Mamiya and Rollei facing severe financial losses--potential bankruptcy, sale, or reorganization--due to severe decline in demand and market for all medium-format cameras resulting in continual and growing debt loads. Either medium-format cameras would cease to exist or be partnered with revenue streams from profitable partners or products. Such is life in the world of business investment. Investors invest to get a return and will only tolerate losing money for a limited (though variable) period of time. BTW, what does F stand for  ? Your smile is nice, but you may have jaundice... or perhaps just a jaundiced view. it's still a step back for a 3rd party back user from the original h1-2 Yes. It is. And a step forward for Hasselblad back users.

If people don't like Blad, well they do it to themselves. That could be read as people cause themselves not to like Hasselblad--but I don't think that's what you meant to imply. Of course there are people in the world that are so focused on their own desires that they are unable to see beyond them and though these folks are often rather vocal when their desires are not met, they are not the majority. However, some very reasonable people are upset with Hasselblad because they don't understand why they would discontinue products they own or may wish to buy--or because there is a product they want to buy which is not compatible. I understand this and Hasselblad would be wiser, in my opinion, if they simply had a more straightforward dialogue with customers. I would have preferred to have them tell the simple truth, that medium-format cameras are money losers and they can't afford to keep making them to support revenue streams for other companies. But it seems that few manufacturers are that open or specific about what is profitable and what's not in their product offerings--Hasselblad is no exception, but I wish they were. It would save me a great deal of time and typing. Anyway, as you see... I've given my last few words on this post to lend weight to whatever low opinions you have formed of Hasselblad. I think they are a bright group of people that love photography and try hard to produce great products. Often they succeed in their many and varied efforts and sometimes fall short--as do I.

Best wishes to you and yours.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200473\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
« Last Edit: June 09, 2008, 01:06:16 am by James R Russell »
Logged

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #57 on: June 09, 2008, 01:42:42 am »

Quote
Even if you know how to use a piece of crap well, it is still a piece of crap.  
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200419\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Oh there are more possibilities than the pearl of wisdom that you have blessed us with.

There are craftsmen and artists who, when faced with an unfamiliar tool, will take time, exercise patience, and learn how to get the most from any tool that is being used.

There are others who, when faced with an unfamiliar tool, will plunge ahead relying on their current knowledge and skill and if the tool doesn't function in the manner expected--they blame the designer of the tool for their frustration.

We have probably all met both of the above, but it is the later which lends credence to the old proverb "A poor workman blames his tools".

I've read all of your previous posts on the Phocus 1.0 thread and the ones that you posted here in regard to Capture One, FlexColor and Phocus. I wish you the best of luck in your future attempts to use and evaluate the tools that you encounter and require.

I'd like to congratulate David on the beautiful work. All the more remarkable for the use of new equipment and software with little training. You did a great job of making it all (camera, lighting, model, composition) work for you.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2008, 01:49:36 am by TechTalk »
Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

TechTalk

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3612
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #58 on: June 09, 2008, 01:56:20 am »

Quote
P.S.  I apologize for having a hand in taking the direction away from David's nice photography.
that's really where it should have stayed.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=200522\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I'd like to join you in that sentiment. Enjoyed the video of the shoot also!
Logged
Respice, adspice, prospice - Look to the past, the present, the future

mcfoto

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 940
    • http://montalbetticampbell.com
Swimwear Shoot with Hasselblad H3D II
« Reply #59 on: June 09, 2008, 02:43:32 am »

Hi
When it comes to the software that comes with digital backs & with the success of LR how can they compete? Even Phase One hasn't released there new pro version which I think is only a few months away. Having talked to the Phase rep from Denmark last week in Brisbane they are excited to have some type of relationship with Microsoft which could be a real plus for Phase One. I feel Leaf has done an excellent job with version 11. And when the new Phase SW comes out, I hope it will support both the Canon 1Ds3 & ZD in  tethered. I was at the launch of the H3DII last Oct in Sydney & they showed Phocus. It looks like LR & 7 months later there is only a beta version? LR will have 2.0 out by August. Will LR go tethered, who knows & there are many waiting.  I thought with the ZD that the MAC group was smart to give a full version of LR with each purchase. Sinar is just coming out with there new SW.

Denis
Logged
Denis Montalbetti
Montalbetti+Campbell [
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6   Go Up