Workflow Guidance Please

[jecxz]

I’ve recently switched from film to digital and I have workflow questions. I’m shooting with an H3DII and I have to use Flexcolor for the 3FR images (because the format is proprietary).

My workflow issues are as follows:

1. The low-res preview in Flexcolor is NOT working for me. The magnify tool is insufficient. It’s slow. I know Phocus is coming out soon, however, I will not be a beta tester without being paid. (I have been a software programmer for 25 years and I refuse to be a part of software development without pay (none of you pros would take photos for free so I’ll assume you understand.) Given it’ll be at least a year until other pros work out most of the bugs, that really still leaves me with Flexcolor. So, here’s the question: would you guys export to DNG and work in Photoshop? Do I lose anything by bypassing Flexcolor for RAW processing? Should I export to DNG for review, then pick the keepers in Photoshop and return back to Flexcolor to work on the images? (That sounds nuts, but I’m asking.) Or is Photoshop the same?

2. DNG – do you make adjustments in the RAW converter window that pops up in Photoshop when you open the RAW file? I find it harder to work with that popup window than working with regular Photoshop controls – where there is undo and more. What is the best way for dealing with my files for touchups and color changes—in that RAW converter popup or in Photoshop proper? Work it until it looks good and then move into Photoshop regular?

3. How are you cataloging image files? When you return from a shoot are you copying them from device/card to computer and organizing them in some way? Can Lightroom handle 50,000 or more images? I’ve reviewed it, looks nice, but I can’t seem to figure out the database backend. Have any of you turned to SQL for large data sets? (I’m PC based.) Have any of you had data problems or corruption in the Lightroom database?

4. Are you guys storing your sessions on one hard drive array (never mind backup, I’ve got that covered) and just increasing it’s size every year? How are you handling last year’s volume of image files (or the images from two years ago), do you remove them from “current” storage and how does Lightroom handle that (when you remove it for long term storage)?

5. Should I be looking more at a catalog storage solution that is DVD based, such as the 50gb Blu-Ray, meaning new work is temporarily stored on hard drive but rapidly moved to such media and then cataloged as being on so-and-so media? I have no issue with Blu-Ray technology, please, let's not turn it into an argument about Blu-Ray or DVDs.

6. I’ve used Media Expressions (that’s the new name since Microsoft has purchased it) and it is too one dimensional for me, is Lightroom the only game in town for PCs?

7. Are any of you using mobile storage such as a laptop while away from your main system? Do you catalog on the laptop and then transfer catalog info to your main system?

8. How do you handle storage if you’re away from the office for many weeks at a time (my last trip was 8 weeks long)? Lots of hard drives? Upload?

9. How do you look up image by category (fog, rain, morning, night, trees, desert, etc…)?

I was reluctant to post these questions on this forum because I know there are a lot of people who do not like Hasselblad, but I could really use some guidance so if you could holster your unhappiness and help me I’d be sincerely appreciative. Thank you in advance.

[Don Libby]

Derek

There’s simply no way that I can answer all you questions but I will give a go at a few.  First I shoot w/a Mamiya AFD II and Phase P30+ and us a PC.

My normal workflow is to take the days shooting (I shoot landscape and nature) and immediately copy them onto one of two external drives that I have hooked to my laptop.  I open CS3 and using the bridge I keyword and append my Metadata to include my copyright.  Once all that is accomplished I’ll copy the one disk over to another double check everything then with the card back in the camera reformat.  Once I have enough to fill a DVD I burn it.  When I return home I already have a backup copy on DVD and using one of the external disks copy the files onto my system to start work.  This works for me.

Can’t say much for LR at present.  Yes I have it and no I haven’t taken the time needed to really get to know it.  Using the filters in Bridge I can find most of what I’m looking for by using the keywords or serial number of camera or position (landscape/portrait) and when all else fails the directory name (I use date/location/camera).  I know there’s a better solution but at present this work for me.

You will need a large amount of storage however I don’t think I’d go with a Blu-Ray only because I don’t think that format has been set in stone, being it may stay or it may leave, remember 8 track vs cassette? I think your safe with using DVD’s at present time.

As far as on the road storage goes I have 4 - 250GB external hard drives all Western Digital.  I also carry approx 10 blank DVD’s.  I’ve got a trip to Alaska in a couple months (driving) and will take an additional 1 or 2 external drives as well as several more DVD’s.

I look up the images by topic.  Usually I’ll look for the place then narrow it down.  An example would be CA, Carmel, Big Sur, Beach or I just might look for Beach all depends.

Just a side note here, no one should ever feel reluctant to post a question here, there are no bullies here and if there is he/she won’t be tolerated.  Having just turned 60 I’m not about to run away from anyone.  Of course you might get kidded a little but that’s another matter.

Hope I’ve helped start the ball rolling …..


don

[Dustbak]

I can answer some of your questions with how I do it. I use Hasselblad CF39 & 384.

I process portraitwork via Flexcolor into Tiff. I find the rendering from Flexcolor superior to ACR especially when printed. If needed I further process these Tiffs in PS.

I also do a lot of product shots & stills. These go through various photoshop actions, depending on the color and type of item being photographed. These I save as DNG, since I do big batches of typically the same items with the same lighting I can open 1 in Camera Raw. I adjust this one until it is the way I like it and copy these 'developing settings' to the others. After that I let my action loose upon the batch. I also sometimes open multiple images in camera raw when I need to adjust on a per file basis. Camera Raw itself is a lot faster than opening it via PS.

Touch-up I do in PS. Color corrections is depending on the type of color corrections. If it is a correction that I need to apply to the whole batch I prefer doing that in camera raw. If it is a per file based color correction I do it in PS.

I have not found any archiving solution that fulfills everything I need. I store the images that I want to keep in a logical directory structure and wait until some party finally brings an archiving solution that does work as I want. I have run into some large scale SQL based solutions with ASPX front-ends that do what I like but I hate to spend 15K or more on something like that (maybe someday I will but for the moment there are other things that are higher on my list).

I use a RAID system that I grow as the amount of files grow. Besides that I use loose USB disks as backup.

I only keep files that I find really worth it and that eliminates about 95%. From the product shots & stills I only keep smaller JPG's. What is the use of saving the raw files of fashion items winter season '05?

I shoot a lot of stuff on location (fashion exchanges) for magazines, these I typically do with my Macbook pro (with flexcolor there is no reason not to use any other pc based laptop). I process these to DNG's on a USB portable drive which I hook-up to my main machine when coming home after which I start processing the files.

On holidays or trips I mostly take the Nikon with enough CF cards. CF is fairly cheap nowadays, small & lightweight and reliable.

I hope this was of help to you.

BTW. I don't have the impression people over here are overly biased towards one brand or another. At least I am not. These things are tools not religions, I have no problem burning any brand to the ground if it doesn't work the way it should:) (maybe I should say work the way I think it should).

[marc gerritsen]

I shoot with H3D39
my workflow is as following

- download on my desktop from cf cards, laptop or storage device

flexcolor
- turn fr files into fff files
- adjust wb in batches of particular locations
- generate jpg preview
- send preview to client
- delete fr files, I will not be able to use dng from then on,
   but find that somehow dng is inferior quality in terms of noise than fff file
  although with dng you can recover highlight much better. so if I foresee
   a strong highlight problem, I will keep that particular file in fr as well
- when client selection comes through I fine tune each file for white balance, exposure etc
- export file to tiff

photoshop
- blend exposures if necesary
- retouch for imperfections
- fine tune straightening, I mostly do arch/int
- levels saturation etc
- create a few different sizes of each photo to give to client

file-management
- back up of all files shot on dvd in fff
- create small jpg of each file shot to be kept on desktop for reference
- back up of worked files on dvd and back up on external hard disk as well
- create larger jpg of each file worked for portfolio purposes
- I back up everything I shoot even holiday shots as I never know if i can use them somewhere
  for a background or clouds or whatever.

hope that helps
Marc

www.marcgerritsen.com

[jecxz]

You guys have definitely helped!

Right now I only use metadata for setting copyright information. I will look into using it for categorization. My experience with Bridge in CS was not good, it kept crashing. I will have to try it again in CS3.

Marc – I understand what you’re doing, I will see if I can work that way.
 
How are you guys reviewing for keepers? With film I use to layout the film on a lightbox and look for the best. With digital, what is the equivalent—thumbnail preview? Perhaps I am not used to this yet? I think that on the lightbox I was able to rapidly compare bracketed shots – it seems on the PC I can mainly only see one image at a time (because of low-res). Is this something you get used to? Is there another way?

Guys, thank you, I will try to apply what you suggested.

[Dustbak]

I use combinations of Flex, Bridge & PS to determine what is a keeper and what not.

I use thumbs to see what might be a keeper, or when it comes in at Flex I can see whether it is a keeper. Closer examination follows after processing and in PS.

I guess you develop a way that works for you over time.

[marc gerritsen]

When shooting for myself;
I can do the firts culling when looking at the fr files in the export window in large mode
second culling with jpg previews when exported to fff
third culling: when I double click on fff files in the thumbnail window, the photo opens in a new window and I can zoom in when clicking on the loupe icon on the left side on near the bottom, I can then check for detail focus or whatever.
Of course the client hasn't got these options as I only can give them the jpg preview and they seem to be all ok with it
cheers
Marc

[jecxz]

So I'm going to get comfortable with the large thumbnails in Flexcolor; follow the advice above and find some middle ground.

Sony has a laptop with a Blu-Ray burner, r/w 25gb discs (50gb when available). Toshiba just announced they're dropping their efforts at pushing HD DVD, looks like Blu-Ray is the next standard. http://www.reuters.com/article/hotStocksNe...T34593320080218

I'll set up a storage server with four 1tb (terra byte) Western Digital drives (they're $299 each at Newegg (I only do WDs after a rash of about half a dozen Seagates failed after about two years at the office in a server rack)).

That leaves categorization... and I have to consider metadata, good idea, but some sort of database just makes sense to me.

Guys, thanks again!

[hubell]

So I'm going to get comfortable with the large thumbnails in Flexcolor; follow the advice above and find some middle ground.

Guys, thanks again!
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I agree with you about trying to use Flexcolor to assess  the quality of the files and compare multiple versions for focus and exposure. I find it useless for that purpose. OTOH, the conversions are excellent. I would suggest at least trying to use Phocus for the limited purpose of evaluating  and comparing and contrasting your files with full rez previews, and then using Flexcolor to process and convert the files that are "keepers". Hopefully, that part of Phocus will not be buggy in the beta. (Aperture could do that for you now very efficiently, but you are PC only.)