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Author Topic: new Nikon 14-24mm lens  (Read 5685 times)

Mike W

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« on: February 07, 2008, 06:52:36 am »

Does anyone have this lens yet?

I'm curious since Michael R seems to think very highly of it, and it's a 24mm equivalent on a DX sensor...which is my preferred focal lenght.
My main source of comparison is the Canon 24mm L lens...which isn't that sharp.

Would anyone be tempted to post a couple of shots made with the lens at f5.6 and f8?

Everyone who would like to see a review by Michael, say Aye :-)

regards

Mike
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michael

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2008, 08:02:42 am »

I plan on reviewing it, but likely not until spring. To do so properly I need to shoot a thousand or so frames, and since we've been buried under about 3 feet of snow for the past month, it'll be a while.

Michael
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kers

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2008, 08:04:53 am »

I have bought this lens and used it on my Nikon d2X:

What i have seen so far: the lens is sharp from 2.8 - even in the corners ( dx)
from 14mm till 24mm

d4 very good
optimum d5,6 en d8  d11 is a bit less
optimum 22mm but he others are almost as good.

distortion is low even at 14mm

verygood flare control

the lens is not made for the d3 but for the d3x (24mp)
a very good value for the money (surely considering the canon offering)

cons: awkward big lens- but handles well
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Pieter Kers
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BernardLanguillier

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2008, 08:06:41 am »

Quote
Does anyone have this lens yet?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=172957\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yes, I do have a copy I am using with my D3.

This lens is indeed excellent overall. Very sharp for sure. A quick sample:



Cheers,
Bernard

Mike W

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2008, 10:19:46 am »

Bernard

Thanks for the sample, could you maybe post 100% crops or maybe even a raw-file?

The lens is indeed quite a promise, I'm looking to use it on a D300-style camera. I'm concidering my options (canon 40D, 5D or next, Nikon, since they now use CMOS-sensors)...

I just saw the lens in a store, it is indeed a monster for a wide-angle zoom.
I'm just glad I have big hands :-)


Micheal, I look forward to the review.

regards,

Mike
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NashvilleMike

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2008, 01:22:55 pm »

I've got one. I'm unable to post images, but:

It's everything "they" say it is, particularly at the wide end of the zoom range, where it's just shockingly good to a degree where I seriously think it's clearly outresolving even the high pixel density of my D2X and D300 bodies, even when wide open at 14mm.

I almost think of the lens as a reference standard 14mm and 18mm lens that also just "happens to be a zoom" - it's pretty good at 24mm, but that's its "weakest" end, relatively speaking, compared to what it does at the wide end.

Contrast is *amazing* at any aperture and focal length (the above comments about 24mm relate to edge sharpness only) and the lens has some of the nicest subjective rendering I've ever seen in a wide angle.

Don't try one unless you've got the $$$ to purchase it on the spot. The word at the shop I picked mine up is that every single person who has asked to see it ends up in a rapid heartbeat hurry to extract the Visa card from their wallet to buy it immediately.

There is nothing really else like it.

-m
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BernardLanguillier

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2008, 06:38:15 pm »

Quote
Bernard

Thanks for the sample, could you maybe post 100% crops or maybe even a raw-file?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173004\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Maybe sometimes next week, no time until then, sorry.

One think to keep in mind, this was shot handheld, this particular image won't be the best way to check absolute image sharpness.

Cheers,
Bernard

Christopher

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2008, 08:07:53 pm »

Quote
Maybe sometimes next week, no time until then, sorry.

One think to keep in mind, this was shot handheld, this particular image won't be the best way to check absolute image sharpness.

Cheers,
Bernard
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I think this says pretty much all about it. [a href=\"http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/nikon_14_24mm_1/nikon14_24mm_a.html]http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/nikon_14_24...n14_24mm_a.html[/url]

Really nice lens, if I would't own a Leica 15mm and a Zeiss 21 I probably would get it for my 1DsMk3.
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Christopher Hauser
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Ray

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2008, 12:30:44 am »

Quote
One think to keep in mind, this was shot handheld, this particular image won't be the best way to check absolute image sharpness.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173137\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Not only that, Bernard. The shot would be no good at all for checking resolution in the top left & right corners. We can't always assume that resolution is equally good in all four corners.

Generally, I find lens comparisons the most useful. A single pretty picture that looks reasonablly sharp is often not enough.

The tests so far that show the Nikkor 14-24 at 14mm and F2.8 being vastly superior to the new Canon 14/2.8 prime at f2.8, at the edges, and noticeably sharper in the centre, creates the problem that some people are unable to retrieve their credit card from their wallet fast enough.  
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Mike W

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2008, 07:09:46 am »

Thanks to all for the replies,

Bernard, anytime you find the chance to post any image made with this lens, I'd be grateful.

Question about the actual build; It seems the front element really pops out eye-ball-style. Does the lens hood provide enough protection? I'm kinda hard on gear, so it's a big deal for me.

16-9.net talks about the lens-hood on a Nikon 14mm (which seems kinda crappy) and how you're better of buying a sigma lens hood, which fits perfectly.

Can you put a lens cap on this thing?

thanks,

Mike
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GregW

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2008, 09:21:12 am »

Quote
Can you put a lens cap on this thing?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173501\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yes, it's supplied.

In case you hadn't already read it in reviews, it won't support screw in filters.  I've seen a couple of jerry rigged solutions using a Cokin holder, but haven't tried it myself.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2008, 09:23:31 am by GregW »
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BernardLanguillier

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2008, 07:57:11 pm »

Quote
Generally, I find lens comparisons the most useful. A single pretty picture that looks reasonablly sharp is often not enough.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173214\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sure, but what a real useful lens test should do is:

1. Test 10 lenses bought randomly from 5 different shops within 2 or 3 months (to test different batches of lenses),
2. Provide results in terms of average (that you can hopefully expect to the be the spec) and the worst performer (that gives an idea of how unlucky you could get if you purchase a bad sample).

Nobody does that today as far as I know.

Testing one lens has a high probability of being enough if the manufacturer does its job in terms of quality control, but if they don't then simple unit lens tests become useless.

We are only to blame ourselves for supporting various publications in print and on the web that define such low level benchmarking standarts for items we are willing to spend x0.000 US$ on.

Indeed, in most areas of human activities, companies design their products relative to the established benchmark along one single criterion, be better than the competition where it can be measured. That's what people running these companies learn in their MBAs.

As long as we, consumers, agree that the benchmark for lens testing is the testing of a single lens by various small companies accross the web, we will keep making it very easy for companies to design lenses with the following criteria in mind: be able to manufacture a few samples with very high quality (those will be provided to testers) and optimize the costs so that most other samples are good enough not to generate complaints from 90% of users (those don't know how good a sample they could have gotten). Better samples are given to the 10% that do complain.

What would really help this industry is the establishement of a third part non profit entity funded directly by working photographers (or amateurs willing to contribute) that would pay a recognized certfication company (TUV comes to mind) to do random test of lenses according to a published methodology (the random test of many samples would be part of that). These test results would be made availalbe for free on their website. Wonder how I hadn't thought about it before.

This would provide tremendous value to all of us in:

1. Identifying these lenses that are really good (and not only those that can sometimes be really good),
2. Force the manufacturers to design for average quality and not for peak quality,
3. Streamline the discussions on forums thanks to the provision of cross brand objective information focussing on the interest of the photographer,
4. Give Ray a life.

Cheers,
Bernard

Ray

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2008, 10:02:15 pm »

Quote
As long as we, consumers, agree that the benchmark for lens testing is the testing of a single lens by various small companies accross the web, we will keep making it very easy for companies to design lenses with the following criteria in mind: be able to manufacture a few samples with very high quality (those will be provided to testers) and optimize the costs so that most other samples are good enough not to generate complaints from 90% of users (those don't know how good a sample they could have gotten). Better samples are given to the 10% that do complain.

Bernard,
You've opened my eyes   . Is this really what devious lens manufacturers do; hand out a few exceptionally good copies to lens reviewers?

Quote
What would really help this industry is the establishement of a third part non profit entity funded directly by working photographers (or amateurs willing to contribute) that would pay a recognized certfication company (TUV comes to mind) to do random test of lenses according to a published methodology (the random test of many samples would be part of that). These test results would be made availalbe for free on their website. Wonder how I hadn't thought about it before.

This would provide tremendous value to all of us in:

1. Identifying these lenses that are really good (and not only those that can sometimes be really good),
2. Force the manufacturers to design for average quality and not for peak quality,
3. Streamline the discussions on forums thanks to the provision of cross brand objective information focussing on the interest of the photographer,
4. Give Ray a life.

A more thorough method, which I would prefer, would be for all lenses to be subjected to an MTF test at various apertures and resolutions and for the resulting charts to be included in the box. If this means setting up operations in China in order to do this economically, then so be it.

However, your idea of a third party non-profit organisation is still good. We can't rely upon the manufacturer to be completely honest with its own MTF testing, so we need someone to do random checking of the validity of such MTF charts in relation to the lenses they accompany, with matching serial numbers.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2008, 10:03:43 pm by Ray »
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BernardLanguillier

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2008, 10:19:11 pm »

Quote
Bernard,
You've opened my eyes   . Is this really what devious lens manufacturers do; hand out a few exceptionally good copies to lens reviewers?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173637\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sorry if I stated the obvious. Of course, not all lenses tested come directly from the manufacturers, so only a sub-set of the reviews suffer from this.

My guess though is that most high visibility testers (magazines like Chasseur d'Image) want to be the first to publish results of new gear testing because the hype is what they rely on to make a living, and they can only achieve this by testing gear sent directly by the manufacturers...

The current system is bound to lead manufacturers to favour gaussian peak performance instead of limited variance.

You could of course make a point that ethics could make manufacturers seek customer satisfaction first, but the concept can easily be diluted by the addition of the "good enough anyway" touch... "It would be best to send perfect copies to all customers, but what we ship is good enough anyway...". The problem being that people get good enough but are led to think that they are buying the best per the test results they saw.

Is it better to have such flawed test results than nothing? Probably it is, but basic statistics show that average information without variance is meaningless. In other words, current test results of photographic gear are a widely shared illusion that can only bear coincidential relationship to the truth.

Quote
A more thorough method, which I would prefer, would be for all lenses to be subjected to an MTF test at various apertures and resolutions and for the resulting charts to be included in the box. If this means setting up operations in China in order to do this economically, then so be it.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173637\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I haven't written anything about the actual tests that should be done, just that a third party should test many sample of each lens and compute the minimum + average.

The test should probably indeed include MTF + others. Whatever it takes to get a good image of how good the lens is.

Quote
However, your idea of a third party non-profit organisation is still good. We can't rely upon the manufacturer to be completely honest with its own MTF testing, so we need someone to do random checking of the validity of such MTF charts in relation to the lenses they accompany, with matching serial numbers.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=173637\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

That was indeed my main point.

Cheers,
Bernard

Mike W

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new Nikon 14-24mm lens
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2008, 08:36:41 am »

It's been a few weeks since this topic kinda died off....
Anyone who would like to post a raw-file or a 100% crop taken with the nikon 14-24?

I'm curious because I put a Hasselblad 50mm lens and a canon 5D with 24mm L to a contest the other day and to my surprise the Canon was sharper!
I was sure the Hasselblad was going to do better, since the 24mm L has a really bad rep and Zeiss has a good one.

So if a nikon 14-24 trumps the canon 24L, I kinda wanna pixel-peep it a bit :-)

thanks,

Mike
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